Adam D question...

[egan.]

I am amazed by how many people don't realize that the majority of the time when you are on a label, there is a recording budget. It also amazes me at how mean people can be on here.

Yes on all counts.
At any rate (and others who have actually managed album budgets can chime in) sometimes labels say "you are recording with this dude and you have this long and we are also going to give you this much money as an advance."

But it's also quite common a label to hand you a chunk of money and say "deliver us a record." In this scenario you pocket whatever of the advance you don't spend on the record.
I always assume this is the case in any situation where a band is huge and is self-producing/engineering. Of course they may still pay the producing member more.

It's also true that Adam D is a different case than a regular in-band producer and there is quite a bit of money around that band.

 

[Whammywon]

Yeah, well a label is a business, and so is a band.

It would be ridiculous for KsE to pocket all the money coming in, so it's likely that they have a band account that pays for fuel for the bus, etc...

If they got all their income then they would have to personally pay everyone that works for them (i.e. bus driver, roadies, tour manager, etc...).

I know this is somewhat irrelevant, but I'm going to use it to prove the point that they PROBABLY have a band account:

Skillet is the biggest Christian band in the world. 2 years ago they sold something like 6 million discs, last year (due to downloads) it was only something like 500,000. Either way their members are on a salary of $80K, I found out because my old singer is trying out for a band that's played with and is cool with Skillet, Decyfer Down, etc...

But if they bring all that in and only make 80K, then the rest must go to an account or something....

Anyways, I was just wondering what you guys thought...

 

[Suicide_As_Alibi]

sometimes labels say "you are recording with this dude and you have this long and we are also going to give you this much money as an advance."

But it's also quite common a label to hand you a chunk of money and say "deliver us a record." In this scenario you pocket whatever of the advance you don't spend on the record.

It depends on the label - some of them have ties with certain studios, so they send their bands there as they get cheaper rates and they know the final product will be good.

The advance is supposed to not just cover recording costs, but equipment/supplies for the recording and living costs (assuming the band has to take time off work etc.). It's normally the label that sort out the details of the studio regardless, even if it's the band actually find it - the label write the cheques, and they prefer to give the band as little as possible (as it means there's less for them to blow on hookers and blow).

I know a band that recorded an album for In At The Deep End, and they were basically left entirely to their own devices - they found the studio (actually the rehearsal studios they used anyway), the engineer, etc. At the end of it, they just sent the studio's invoice to IATDE and they literally just paid that.

Steve

 

[egan.]

It depends on the label - some of them have ties with certain studios, so they send their bands there as they get cheaper rates and they know the final product will be good.

The advance is supposed to not just cover recording costs, but equipment/supplies for the recording and living costs (assuming the band has to take time off work etc.). It's normally the label that sort out the details of the studio regardless, even if it's the band actually find it - the label write the cheques, and they prefer to give the band as little as possible (as it means there's less for them to blow on hookers and blow).

I know a band that recorded an album for In At The Deep End, and they were basically left entirely to their own devices - they found the studio (actually the rehearsal studios they used anyway), the engineer, etc. At the end of it, they just sent the studio's invoice to IATDE and they literally just paid that.

Steve

I'm confused. Did you just quote me and say the same thing?

 

[Plec]

...Skillet is the biggest Christian band in the world. 2 years ago they sold something like 6 million discs, last year (due to downloads) it was only something like 500,000. Either way their members are on a salary of $80K, I found out because my old singer is trying out for a band that's played with and is cool with Skillet, Decyfer Down, etc...

But if they bring all that in and only make 80K, then the rest must go to an account or something....

Anyways, I was just wondering what you guys thought...

All the money coming in from sales goes to the label first and foremost where the ARTIST has around 10% royalty rate, which is pretty standard. Before the artist sees any money they first got to pay the labels expenses which means recording expenses, video expenses, touring expenses... basically all kinds of expenses the label has on part of the ARTIST, which is fine until you see that The ARTIST pays the label out their royalty rate of 10% (in this case).

In the case of Skillet selling 6 million discs would mean that the label made ~$80 million on the monies coming in from distributors after they've taken their cut. And again, just for the sake of discussion... manufacturing, recording expenses, video production, touring expenses, advertising etc... for a band that size, maybe $5 million. The ARTIST needs to pay this on their 10% royalty which means that the label already went break even on this highly fictive figure at ~400 000 units sold BUT the ARTIST doesn't brake even until 4 000 000 units sold... which you can see is a total **s **ck!

But in this case when a band just sells enormous amounts even they get paid for a change! So the ARTIST here gets paid on the 2 million units sold past their break even which would translate to the label owing the ARTIST ~$2,6 million while the label made ~$73 million. And the label, being good sports about it probably gave the ARTIST a $1 million bonus for doing such a great job, which kind of evens it out a bit....... NOT! :Smokin:

Not taking into consideration income from merchandise, live performances etc.. this is a rough but real outline of how most record deals work. Artists like Skillet, KsE etc. probably don't handle any of their business themselves. They have managers, accountants and lawyers taking care of it... and they also need to get paid...

 

[Mat Laperle]

+1 to Plec this is exactly how it works

 

[egan.]

In the case of Skillet selling 6 million discs would mean that the label made ~$80 million on the monies coming in from distributors after they've taken their cut.

It's probably more like $50 million ($7-10 a disk as distibutor cost is pretty normal). Also bear in mind that the band's 10% (which IME is a couple of points low) will typically be based on 75% of MSRP which is typically $16-20 in the US now. So it isn't a straight percentage of the label income.
10% on 6million sold at a $16 MSRP (it doesn't matter what it really sells for) -25%("packaging fee") is going to be 7 million ignoring several variables (reserves, "free product," etc.).
Plus if you wrote the songs you shitload of mechanicals coming your way.
Either way you are right about recoup, lawyers and expenses.
One thing is that often times videos are only 50% recoupable and marketing is also murky as sometimes it's recoupable and sometimes not.

http://entertainment.howstuffworks.com/music-royalties6.htm

 

[-Loco-]

Thank you for saying this out loud. Being cocky with style can be good, being a cocky moron usually isn't.

How was I being cocky!?! Just because it didn't make sense to me doesn't mean I was being cocky...I didn't give an explanation I just didn't think they got charged.

 

[-Loco-]

Don't be a cunt to dudes on here who ask legitimate questions, especially considering you were completely wrong. Grow up man.

You're the one barking on a freakin' forum - I'm sure there were plenty of others in here who thought the same as I did also. I'm not here to flame i'm here to learn but if you're just gonna go in all guns blazing on a n00b then doesn't make you any more mature. Especially when your response to me was counter-productive. Grow up man.

 

[chonchball]

@OP (WhammyWon or whatever)

What was your purpose in asking this question? (Curious as to what knowledge you hoped to gain from it)

Also, I'm really not trying to be a dick, I'm just wondering in all honesty what you hoped to take away from the conversation and how it would benefit you.

 

[Metaltastic]

Haven't you ever been idly curious about something for no particular reason?

 

[Metaltastic]

You're the one barking on a freakin' forum - I'm sure there were plenty of others in here who thought the same as I did also. I'm not here to flame i'm here to learn but if you're just gonna go in all guns blazing on a n00b then doesn't make you any more mature. Especially when your response to me was counter-productive. Grow up man.

Forgive me, but I couldn't help but chuckle at the thought of someone going all guns blazing on a n00b cuz that n00b went all guns blazing on another n00b

 

[chonchball]

Haven't you ever been idly curious about something for no particular reason?

That's what got me banned within 300 feet of middle schools.

 

[-Loco-]

no...my question wasn't rhetorical...i wanted an answer.

 

[AdamWathan]

no...my question wasn't rhetorical...i wanted an answer.

Dude, a guy comes in and asks a legitimate question and you hammer on him, "This is the most retarded question I've ever read," and then proceed to give him the wrong answer. There's no need to be a dick to the dude who started the thread, that's all I'm getting at here. If it was a legitimately stupid question then MAYBE but even you had no idea of the answer so it couldn't be that retarded of a question could it?

 

[Metaltastic]

That's what got me banned within 300 feet of middle schools.

Hahahahahahaha, touche

 

[-Loco-]

Dude, a guy comes in and asks a legitimate question and you hammer on him, "This is the most retarded question I've ever read," and then proceed to give him the wrong answer. There's no need to be a dick to the dude who started the thread, that's all I'm getting at here. If it was a legitimately stupid question then MAYBE but even you had no idea of the answer so it couldn't be that retarded of a question could it?

Fail.

I never gave him an answer - I asked why


forget it.


May the force be with you

 

[Jarkko Mattheiszen]

Am I the only one slightly worried about what this forum is turning into?

 

[Erik Monsonis]

Am I the only one slightly worried about what this forum is turning into?

Nope, of course you're not the only one...

 

[SentencedToBurn]

That's what got me banned within 300 feet of middle schools.

and why you have met chris hanson