At last: Final poll in 9+ minute song series!

[Light]

Eh, yeah, whatever

Face? Bothered?

3'37" is the "gold ideal" length for a song. Double that is tops, otherwise you may as well make two songs from it. I think you'll find that most of what you count as 9+ minute songs are in fact several different musical themes interwoven together and then (sometimes) returning to the origin, but that could equally be achieved by segueing several songs together and then using a reprise.

Seriously, I'm not even into 12" mixes that much, unless the 7" is stupidly short (Hi-Tack I'm looking at YOU).

But just my humble opinion, of course

 

[rdyfrde]

Just when I wanted to vote...for SE of course...

I wish you had. Then at least it would have been a tie

 

[BurningDownTheMiddle]

3'37" is the "gold ideal" length for a song.

Breaking news - Top of the Pops has been taken off the air.

The gold ideal is all very well for derivative pop tosh that requires endless airplay to airheads to get it noticed but music is about an experience rather than a quick fix.

Threshold have always managed to deliver a real variety of song lengths and styles. Whilst I'm not a fan of Rick Wakemanesque 20 minute keyboard solos, sometimes a song needs time to develop and progress. I view the composition of such tracks in the same way as I would a classical piece. Sometimes it doesn't take long but sometimes it does. There is no point rushing to fit some artificial ideal probably devised by the likes of Simon Cowell

 

[Light]

The gold ideal is all very well for derivative pop tosh that requires endless airplay to airheads to get it noticed but music is about an experience rather than a quick fix.

That's extremely condescending, what you just wrote. That's like me saying, "Rugby is only for boneheads with small percys". Music is music, it is what it is and it's to be taken - experienced - in any way you feel like letting it take you, no matter what the sound or style. Just because you're a passionate fan of a certain splinter of the whole, doesn't mean you should automatically rubbish the rest of the puzzle.

Also, I don't know who is Simon Cowell, but he has a cow in his name, so he can't be too bad.

 

[BurningDownTheMiddle]

That's extremely condescending, what you just wrote. That's like me saying, "Rugby is only for boneheads with small percys". Music is music, it is what it is and it's to be taken - experienced - in any way you feel like letting it take you, no matter what the sound or style. Just because you're a passionate fan of a certain splinter of the whole, doesn't mean you should automatically rubbish the rest of the puzzle.

Also, I don't know who is Simon Cowell, but he has a cow in his name, so he can't be too bad.

The short duration refers to short snappy pop songs from many years ago which some have continued to produce to slot into the various media offering video shows. Most sociologists describe it as derivative, inferior and the product of mass media, hence its rise through the age of television. There words, not mine.

Similar academics don't use the statement you have made and you are in fact facually incorrect - the popularity of rugby union in University for one thing goes against your argument.

Calling something derivative isn't necessarily rubbishing it. A lot of metal is derivative and it doesn't mean it doesn't have its place. Equally "tosh" means general silliness. Check out some main stream pop tunes and many will fit that criteria. "Umbrella", 2007s biggest world seller, springs to mind.

And you don't know who Simon Cowell is? Pop Idol, American Idol, X Factor, Britains Got Talent, Americas got talent, Grease is the word, American Inventor, Celebrity Duets, Rock Rivals and other derivative tosh. I can only assume you've been living in a cave

 

[Madrigal]

Just when I wanted to vote...for SE of course...

HELLO The Whispering!

You look like Lake's friend from those great happypics in the Legacy Festival thread...? -- Welcome, in any case.


... And you lads, what is all this other quabbeling about here?!

The core of my humble onion says that defining a golden length for a song is just as futile as diminishing short tracks.....

4 mins or 9+ mins --- isn't it all about the *quality* of the song and the music in the end, no matter the ascribed criteria of a certain genre?
And isn't it just one of the most praised features of us progheads that we refuse to think in clichés and be ever so tolerant and open towards ANYTHING, yes, making this the essence of what 'progressive' means for us even?

In the end, I feel we all agree on that point and all else is just splitting Simon Cowbell's hair.

So be nice now, please. I prefer happy vibes.

 

[BurningDownTheMiddle]

Just a point of order - I never said that songs should be any length in particular. What I did question was the concept of the gold ideal which historically has always been associated with the pop genre and radio airplay. That seemed a touch irrelevant given this is a forum for a progressive metal band, especially when being used in the well thought out argument that 9 minutes is too long for a track.

A song should be whatever length it needs to be I would argue that Threshold don't just drag a track out for the sake of it but rather construct a song that moves on throughout its duration. I don't really care if songs are 3 minutes or 20.

 

[LavagesOfTime]

Dont forget that Threshold songs decide their length by themselves

 

[The Whispering]

Thanks Madrigal, you guessed well!

 

[Defiance]

Wheee I'm glad Pilot won, it's an awesome song!

And well, 9 minutes is not really that long, you know?

Moonsorrow: 25+ min

Green Carnation: 1h4s

There you go 9 minutes is too much .

 

[Light]

I wasn't being entirely serious, and I have now Googled Simon Cowpat (I don't have a telly...)

In this age of mp3 players and shuffleplays I do find myself skipping the longer songs more often than the bite-size ones, but perhaps that's just my short attention span. I do think that long songs often are long for the "image" rather than the "cause".... Swanö's Crimson, say, is basically about 6 or 7 songs strung together with a few repeating motifs (as evidenced by the numerous "split" versions that exist in the Stormy Seas Of Which We Must Not Speak). It's one of my favourite albums, so this isn't a diss - I just wink knowingly at the whole "OMG ITS ONE LONG SONG" thing.

I won't say anything nasty about Rugby again because apparently people might take me to court

 

[BurningDownTheMiddle]

I've got a spare TV if you need one

 

[Light]

Is it colour?

 

[BurningDownTheMiddle]

Sorry it's gone - you have waited over two years to claim it!

 

[Light]

I'm like that. Haha.