Black Sabbath: New Album (Rick Rubin)

[Jind]

I've never been a fan of classical Sabbath, mainly because it all sounds so crappy even if the riffs are good (like almost every band from that period). That's why I am so disappointed. It sounds like they got stuck in 1970 and didn't know how to make it sound 2013. And by that I don't mean subdrops, synths, breakdowns and pigsqueals, just a less retro affair.

I guess I can't be unbiased on the "sound" of retro records since some of my favorite sounding records are from the 70's - something about natural sounding recordings just speaks to me, not that there is anything wrong with modern productions as a whole, and I certainly do like many modern discs.

I guess I'm just one of those in the camp of saying this is exactly what I expected from an original Sabbath lineup getting together after 34 years. Really unsure what some expected it to be musically and/or production wise.

 

[smy1]

I guess I can't be unbiased on the "sound" of retro records since some of my favorite sounding records are from the 70's - something about natural sounding recordings just speaks to me, not that there is anything wrong with modern productions as a whole, and I certainly do like many modern discs.

I guess I'm just one of those in the camp of saying this is exactly what I expected from an original Sabbath lineup getting together after 34 years. Really unsure what some expected it to be musically and/or production wise.

I actually like organic productions a lot and my comment refers more to the songwriting/arrangement/build-up of the song than the sound or Ozzy's horrible singing ability. He's always been a shitty singer. Back in the 70s and now. Do I still love some of his work (like the "No More Tears" record)? Definitely, but mainly because of the songwriting and not because of production/performance..

I'm definitely one of the older guys here on the board and I can dig old stuff (from Beatles to Blue Cheer to Venom) and see it for what it was: cool shit back in the 60s/70s/80s. I can also respect the importance of bands when it comes to music. I still think that after over 40years of making music bands like Sabbath (with the help of unlimited budgets and guys like Rubin) should be able to come up with something a little more ... hm ... inspired ... than the track there.

Or maybe the label ran a focus group and figured "we still have very high purchase-percentage in the 35-60 demographic" and told Rubin "make an album that sounds exactly like their childhood memories" - after all THAT'S (psychologically proven again and again) the music people like the most.

That's entirely the point, this is classic Black Sabbath, they made it, unlike Metallica, Megadeth, Slayer etc. who can't make an album sound like in their prime.

DanLights: I agree that the bands you mention can't touch their older records, I just expected a better song from Sabbath. I was hoping for something in the range of 6-7/10 "points". This is 1-2/10 max. for me.

 

[DanLights]

What?? You literally don't read any of my posts if you think this is true. The 1990 comment may be accurate since I just don't actively listen to much older shit (not to say I don't love Queen/Priest/WHAM!), but I have been publicly swinging all over the nuts of David Bendeth, Steve Evetts, Will Putney, and Sam Pura among others for a while now.

Hahaha I never said you ONLY liked something produced by Sneap (it's not like I don't enjoy pretty much everything he's involved with either), I said you don't like old stuff that wasn't produced by Sneap. I'm generalizing, I'm sure there's some old bands you like, but that's the general idea from "literally" reading your posts. All the producers you mentioned all work with "newer" stuff.

Sammy: it's cool, nothing else to say I guess, to you it sounds uninspired, to me it sounds ridiculously inspired. Seriously though, are you just ignoring those riffs on purpose? Build up, lyrics, ozzy (never been a big fan of his singing either, but the nostalgic effect pops in immediately when hearing his voice, and I'm only 25), whatever you wanna say is wrong about the song, but you can't touch the power of those riffs.

 

[ArthurD]

The song is awesome.
FUCKING BRUTAL RIFFS

 

[DanLights]

The song is awesome.
FUCKING BRUTAL RIFFS

YES! I've been listening to it almost every day since they put it out, it's on Spotify now! I can't wait to hear the full album.

 

[Jind]

A shit load of new North american dates announced.

Jul. 25 - Houston, TX @ Cynthia Woods Mitchell Pavilion
Jul. 27 - Austin, TX @ Frank Erwin Center
Jul. 29 - Tampa, FL @ Live Nation Amphitheatre
Jul. 31 - W. Palm Beach, FL @ Cruzan Amphitheatre
Aug. 02 - Bristow, VA @ Jiffy Lube Live
Aug. 04 - Holmdel, NJ @ PNC Bank Arts Center
Aug. 06 - Detroit, MI @ DTE Energy Music Theatre
Aug. 08 - Uncasville, CT @ Mohegan Sun Arena
Aug. 10 - Philadelphia, PA @ Wells Fargo Center
Aug. 12 - Boston, MA @ Comcast Center
Aug. 14 - Toronto, ON @ Air Canada Centre
Aug. 16 - Tinley Park, IL @ First Midwest Bank Amphitheatre
Aug. 18 - Indianapolis, IN @ Klipsch Music Center
Aug. 22 - Vancouver, BC @ Rogers Arena
Aug. 24 - Seattle, WA @ Gorge Amphitheatre
Aug. 26 - San Francisco, CA @ Shoreline Amphitheatre at Mountain View
Aug. 28 - Irvine, CA @ Verizon Wireless Amphitheatre
Aug. 30 - Phoenix, AZ @ US Airways Center
Sep. 01 - Las Vegas, NV @ MGM Grand Garden Arena
Sep. 03 - Los Angeles, CA @ Los Angeles Sports Arena

I'll be getting tickets to the Uncasville, CT show for sure. Mohegan Sun Arena is a great place to see a show, relatively cozy in size with about seating for 11,000 and pretty good sound - plus it's an indoor venue. I've seen several shows there including Rush several times, Heaven & Hell, Judas Priest, TSO a few times, and several other acts. Pre-sale starts May 2, public May 3.

 

[cfh11]

not quite on the level of deaf magnetic but that is one flat dynamic-less sounding pile from brickwall fidelman. reminds me a lot of this video:




iommi is still the riff master though.

 

[bryan_kilco]

I must have HORRIBLE ears because, honestly, with these comparisons between brickwalled and non-brickwalled audio, once I sort of level-match the audio, it doesn't sound that completely different to me. Mostly in the kick/snare but it's not enough to kill me. Maybe the YT vids aren't the best medium, either.

 

[Jind]

I must have HORRIBLE ears because, honestly, with these comparisons between brickwalled and non-brickwalled audio, once I sort of level-match the audio, it doesn't sound that completely different to me. Mostly in the kick/snare but it's not enough to kill me. Maybe the YT vids aren't the best medium, either.

I'm with you - a YouTube video is a really hard medium to use as a basis for a judgement. Like I said earlier, I'll wait until the CD is in my fingers to pass judgement on both the entire album and the mix.

 

[StoneLord]

Just saw them in Sydney. Perfect.

 

[Pman]

Just saw them in Sydney. Perfect.

Who was drumming?

 

[Jind]

Who was drumming?

Tommy Clufetos is the Black Sabbath touring drummer from what I've seen and read.

 

[Stereomixer]

thank god Ozzy started drinking again, he actually sounds legit.

 

[cfh11]

I must have HORRIBLE ears because, honestly, with these comparisons between brickwalled and non-brickwalled audio, once I sort of level-match the audio, it doesn't sound that completely different to me. Mostly in the kick/snare but it's not enough to kill me. Maybe the YT vids aren't the best medium, either.

I think the difference is more apparent in this one:



for my ears, the LP version sounds much punchier. the reason i posted the ac/dc video above is because i think it is a similar example of taking a classic band and killing the warmth and vibe that made their classic albums so great.

 

[ArthurD]

https://itunes.apple.com/us/album/13/id633771839

CLIPPING AS FUCK! (including vocals sometimes)
Songs are quite enjoying... But clipping is annoying

 

[prostetnic]

Wow, these old men rock as hard as a bunch of youngsters on 15 different drugs doing a class job of emulating old-school Sabbath! Ozzy does sound LEGIT. It's slightly disappointing that Rubin and co. couldn't make the album sound as good as The Devil You Know, but they pulled an alright sound. It doesn't sound smashed to death-magnetic to me. I mean, when Iommi lowers the volume on his guitar, it sounds exactly like it should. Also, those growling low mids on Iommi's guitar tone, and dat massive Geezer bass! Killer record, it hits all the right spots for me. Sabbath absolutely schooled Metallica and Megadeth on how to continue a legacy.

 

[DanLights]

Sabbath absolutely schooled Metallica and Megadeth on how to continue a legacy.

+100

I can barely keep my excitement in my pants right now. According to some friends, it leaked, but I'm gonna wait for my actual copy, I'll play it cool till then.

 

[Jind]

Wow, these old men rock as hard as a bunch of youngsters on 15 different drugs doing a class job of emulating old-school Sabbath! Ozzy does sound LEGIT. It's slightly disappointing that Rubin and co. couldn't make the album sound as good as The Devil You Know, but they pulled an alright sound. It doesn't sound smashed to death-magnetic to me. I mean, when Iommi lowers the volume on his guitar, it sounds exactly like it should. Also, those growling low mids on Iommi's guitar tone, and dat massive Geezer bass! Killer record, it hits all the right spots for me. Sabbath absolutely schooled Metallica and Megadeth on how to continue a legacy.

Got my copy today and like the musical aspects of it quite a bit, basically what I had come to expect musically and that pleases me. While it's not better than the great run of the first six of eight Sabbath (Ozzy era) albums, it's an enjoyable album that reminds you what made them great on those discs.

BUT... like the poster quoted I'm disappointed that basically what amounts to the at least a good portion of the technical team behind The Devil You Know could not recreate the crushing (in a good way) production that that album had. While it would be easy to blame the addition of Rubin and Fidelman, I'm also going to blame Tony and Geezer as they are the parties that were involved with both efforts and should have recognized how superior sonically that last Heaven & Hell album is to 13.

Overall production is not the reason I end up liking or not liking albums in definitive ways so I'm sure it will get it's fair share of play time, but it's still a somewhat missed opportunity on the overall sonic aspect in my opinion.

 

[Skyweaver]

got the album and had two listens....it sounds rushed through production, very strong riffs, great bass and guitar tone....wrong choice of drummer and vocal production leaves a lot to be desired...the mix doesnt match the band...A/B it with "the Devil you know" and I would be asking for my money back. the songs are good, but what kills it in parts is that Ozzy sounds quite "unsure" about what he is singing in parts, its clear he doesnt know the songs or wasnt comfortable....with the right producer and the right control gates around preproduction and releasing it, the album would have been significantly better...I suspect someone stuffed up time schedules, tours and recording estimates and hence a possible rush job.....

 

[Jind]

Reviving this just to give some props to something from Black Sabbath's back catalog that never gets the respect it deserves - that being the pinnacle of the Tony Martin era, Headless Cross.

This latest release from Black Sabbath has had me listening to most of their back catalog over the past several weeks and I realized how much I absolutely love this album. Perhaps it's my disappointment in some of the production values of 13, perhaps it's the fact that I really am a child of 80's metal, but Headless Cross brings out the teenage metal lover in me.

Sure it's only Tony Iommi from the classic Sabbath lineups, but with Martin on vocals, the great Cozy Powell on drums, Geoff Nichols on keyboards, and jazz-fusion bassist Lawrence Cottle, he produced, at the time, one of the most modern sounding Sabbath albums. It had huge sounding drums dripping with big room reverb, Tony's guitars might have the most effects he's ever used added onto some crushing riffs - it all adds up to just a big sounding album. Add to the mix the utterly underrated but incredible vocals of Tony Martin soaring over the mix and it's seriously in contention with my top Sabbath albums.

Being completely honest - Ozzy is my least favorite Sabbath vocalist - even behind Glenn Hughes (on the not so Sabbath album Seventh Star, and Ray Gillen (can only be heard on the second disc of The Eternal Idol - Deluxe Edition the demo versions of the songs from the album which became Martin's first Sabbath record). While I think Ozzy works quite well on "classic" Sabbath tunes in the more psychedelic/ doomy vibe - I just don't think he would have worked well on the more modern sounding output that would come in the 80's, and 90's where singers with greater range like Ronnie James Dio and Martin provided a better fit.

Any other love out there for the Martin era albums?