brexit
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The Ozzman
Melted by feels
To remain. Probably won't significantly impact me, or most people, either way. The major complaints about immigration (the leave campaigns only real winner) seem to come from clueless idiots.
Unlikely that it'd be lower if we left, those that complain about the cultural impact tend to live in the most white and british of places, immigrants contribute more to the economy than they take out, pressure on schools and housing both have far more to do with government underinvestment (which the conservatives will continue if we leave) than the population increase resulting from immigration, etc.
Most of the laws we've had 'imposed' on us we voted for. Most are sensible. Most don't really have any impact on the average person's life anyway.
The irony is that the uk has vetoed various things that i'm guessing most that want to leave would be in favour of, e.g. tariffs on chinese steel. So much for protecting lower paid british workers.
The problem is that your average 'brexiter' is less educated and more than likely less intelligent. They buy into populist shit more easily. Immigrants are an easy scapegoat.
The uk has more power in he eu than many seem to realise and over thr next decade or two that's only going to increase. The uk is on course to have the largest population and largest gdp. It has the most powerful military. Is has london. Worrying about a germany dominated eu seems absurd, especially so if you plan to leave the eu and essentially hand the crown to them.
I have no idea why people are opposed to an 'eu army' either. It's only going to be a small thing, none of my friends/family in the forces see it as a bad thing. And maybe, just maybe, it'd prevent the uk from sucking so much american dick and jumping into stupid wars.
Unlikely that it'd be lower if we left, those that complain about the cultural impact tend to live in the most white and british of places, immigrants contribute more to the economy than they take out, pressure on schools and housing both have far more to do with government underinvestment (which the conservatives will continue if we leave) than the population increase resulting from immigration, etc.
Most of the laws we've had 'imposed' on us we voted for. Most are sensible. Most don't really have any impact on the average person's life anyway.
The irony is that the uk has vetoed various things that i'm guessing most that want to leave would be in favour of, e.g. tariffs on chinese steel. So much for protecting lower paid british workers.
The problem is that your average 'brexiter' is less educated and more than likely less intelligent. They buy into populist shit more easily. Immigrants are an easy scapegoat.
The uk has more power in he eu than many seem to realise and over thr next decade or two that's only going to increase. The uk is on course to have the largest population and largest gdp. It has the most powerful military. Is has london. Worrying about a germany dominated eu seems absurd, especially so if you plan to leave the eu and essentially hand the crown to them.
I have no idea why people are opposed to an 'eu army' either. It's only going to be a small thing, none of my friends/family in the forces see it as a bad thing. And maybe, just maybe, it'd prevent the uk from sucking so much american dick and jumping into stupid wars.
EspaDa
Damage Case
SentinelSlain
Suck my joined date.
- Nov 21, 2007
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I've found it quite hard to work out what to do in regards to this. I have some vague interests that would be best served by being in I suppose. The fact that anti-EU sentiment is more pronounced among a certain part of the electorate than an others isn't that big a deal. I see a lot of that as being due to specific cultural phenomena among the middle class that isn't necessarily rational. Virtue signalling, for example. I think the EU, taken as a vague idea, has the potential to be good, but I think the people really in power have pretty unpleasant ideas about the direction they want to take Europe. Britain has no real constitution, for example and if the EU did things like guarantee freedom of speech, American style, then I would probably support that, but it tends to be the opposite. Do I want Britain to be powerful? It depends on the people who will run the country and the values they will have. If it's the current type, who basically see any kind of critique of the default absolute multiculturalism purely as an indicator of class differentiation on the part of the speaker, then no, I'd rather we were a meager power, a backwater.
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CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
- Jun 4, 2008
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suppression of free speech by the left wing pc police lol
what about the fact that you spend billions of pounds in the eu, far more than you get back? if you voted out you could spend that money on yourselves rather than some eastern eu shithole or the refugees. don't you think your own government would be better at allocating it than some faceless unelected bureaucrats in the eu?
what about the fact that you spend billions of pounds in the eu, far more than you get back? if you voted out you could spend that money on yourselves rather than some eastern eu shithole or the refugees. don't you think your own government would be better at allocating it than some faceless unelected bureaucrats in the eu?
SentinelSlain
Suck my joined date.
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I think it would probably be better for the government to simply give me billions of pounds than for them to do a lot of the things they would otherwise do with it. I would spend the money in the UK, in UK businesses, I would employ British people, I would fund things like good Art, like realism, pre-raphelite, romantic etc, those kinds of paintings and neo-classical sculpture. I'd try and push for that kind of work to become in vogue and valuable. I'd have beautiful buildings built, demolish modernist shit and create wonderful buildings that replicate the styles from hundreds of years ago. I'd set up education institutions that teach people the greatness of European and British culture and then employ those people with good jobs after they graduate. It would be wonderful. Far better than paying for fridges for warlords to put the dead bodies of their enemies in, or teaching people to hate themselves as part of becoming "middle class" and "educated".
- Jun 4, 2008
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then leave, fall flat on your face, throw out the current government, vote in the government who will fix it on your own terms!
or stay and continue to be dictated to and siphoned money out of and dumped immigrants on. do you think that can still change?
@no country for old wainds and @Phylactery interested in your input!
or stay and continue to be dictated to and siphoned money out of and dumped immigrants on. do you think that can still change?
@no country for old wainds and @Phylactery interested in your input!
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Eh. We're not really dictated to. The eu isn't even really any less democratic than thr systrm we have in the uk. FPTP is a fucking farce. Something like a quarter of us that voted in the last election got 10 outa 650 mps whilst the conservatives have a 'majority' with something like 37% of the vote/25% of the electorate.
If leaving gives us a new government it'll just be an even more right wing conservative government. Who i doubt will do much to bring down immigration (any deal with the eu will probably involve free movement anyway). And i don't really give a fuck about immigration. The uk doesn't have especially high levels and most of the arguments against it (boohoo hurting the poor) seem to me more like an indicator that most lower paid brits are fucking useless. I'm not getting screwed because i manage to turn up on time and i work hard. If more white britons did the same they'd have less to moan about.
The only issue i have with immigration is when too many from x country end up in one place. It's not a hard problem to solve.
If leaving gives us a new government it'll just be an even more right wing conservative government. Who i doubt will do much to bring down immigration (any deal with the eu will probably involve free movement anyway). And i don't really give a fuck about immigration. The uk doesn't have especially high levels and most of the arguments against it (boohoo hurting the poor) seem to me more like an indicator that most lower paid brits are fucking useless. I'm not getting screwed because i manage to turn up on time and i work hard. If more white britons did the same they'd have less to moan about.
The only issue i have with immigration is when too many from x country end up in one place. It's not a hard problem to solve.
Master_Yoda77
Juggalo
I live the US. I have no idea about foreign politics, so I don't comment about how other countries do things. Perhaps, @CASSETTEISGOD could learn a thing to two here.
CiG
Approximately Infinite Universe
You don't comment because you don't know or pay attention to anything. You twat.
SentinelSlain
Suck my joined date.
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I don't see what's wrong with saying that Britain should work to further the interests of British people, as a whole. I don't care if people in Vietnam are willing to work until the flesh falls of their fingertips, that's their problem really. If people come here because they're "more willing to work hard" then eventually they are going to fatten up, their children wont want to do the jobs they did. Also, in the past, absolute p.o.s. government / business arrangements have brought in entire third world village communities and those people simply never integrated at all, they even bring their cousins over for arranged marriage and they tend to believe in sharia law. Frankly I would far rather that the elements of the business community and ruling class who strongly agree with such immigration were deported. You can't compete with Chinese manufacturing costs by bringing in poor people when you have minimum wage laws and a generous welfare state and even if you could, the only reason you are in power to make such a decision is on the basis that you will be serving the interests of the British.
Blind Guardian
Member
As a Swede I hope the UK stays, mainly because it's one of few other EU countries not using the Euro. Without the UK the power balance shifts even more heavily towards the Euro countries in many economic/business fields.
no country for old wainds
Active Member
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Draehl
Lurker
The only reason EU countries are pushing this whole immigration bit is to tilt the voting base to the left, reduce sovereignty, and vest more power in the united nations. The desire for a one world government is pretty pervasive. Even Obama's actions over here in general clearly favor not the American people or even the American liberals/poor, but rather international interests in general.
SentinelSlain
Suck my joined date.
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It's a bit like the Soviet policy against the nationalities in the USSR. For example, deporting people to Siberia, away from their ethnic homelands, to disrupt nationalism.
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