Chug Editing Tutorial CUBASE 5

alan1990

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Oct 17, 2007
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Wrote this for submersed in his thread but thought others might benefit as well. This is definitely not the only way of doing this but its the most transparent as time stretching get get nasty pretty quickly.

This is for cubase 5, all steps will work in any other DAWs im just not sure of how to bring up the crossfade box but that shouldn't be to hard to figure out lol.

first of all here is a before and after DI sample for comparison as well as for follow along purposes.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3374294/CHUGZ.zip



anyway lets begin

1..Import example and set session to 120bpm and go ahead and make cuts between each grouping as shown

cuts.jpg


2.zoom in to where you can see the first chug and a few following chugs as well as the some of the detail in the wave forum

CHUG%20ONE%20ZOOM.jpg


3.slide the first section over untill you have a good compromise between each of the 3 chugs second peaks being perfectly on time. Ive marked the second peak of the 3 shown chugs so you have a better idea what im getting at. Also note that in the example the first chug is just a hair early still but thats fine we are just going for a good balance between the chugs anything more then this can start to sound goofy.

chug%20edit.jpg


4.do this to all sections and zoom out and you will have this. notice that there are gaps in between the sections that we will fix next

all%20edited.jpg


5.select these sections

hilite.jpg


6.now drag the beginning of the selected wave forums back to slight overlap the ones before it

dragback.jpg


7.now select everything and double tap x to set the following crossfade. some may argue that in this case this step isnt necessary as there is not anything playing in the track at that point but I feel its good to get used to doing it.

xfade.jpg


8.one last step! select everything once again and go to audio then bounce selection to consolidate all the edits to one file.

edit.jpg





note that this is just a basic run down and that you can get way more in depth for example in longer sections of chugs such as the first in the given example I would make another cut in the middle of the section to get the later chugs as on time as the ones in beginning of the section.

just be careful when you start making cuts where there is an actual note ringing out as the position of the crossfade and amount of overlap needs to be set carefully to not mess with transients, In this case I find that the best bet is to try and place the crossfade in the middle of the 2 chugs as to not mess with the very begging of the next note and the transient of the first. one more thing its always best to make edits in the spaces that the instrument isnt playing!

This is my first tutorial so its probably not written the best but i hope it helps and will do my best to explain anything more if anyone needs it
 
Nice tutorial bro.

May I suggest making "events transparent" in your preferences though, makes things a SHIT TON easier when lining up to grid.

also, i much prefer the alt+slip method to this one... gotta make your own shortcut but you hold alt indefinitely and click to cut, drag to slip. boom.

works awesome on chugs but can get messy on other sections...

YMMV!
 
Nice tutorial bro.

May I suggest making "events transparent" in your preferences though, makes things a SHIT TON easier when lining up to grid.

also, i much prefer the alt+slip method to this one... gotta make your own shortcut but you hold alt indefinitely and click to cut, drag to slip. boom.

works awesome on chugs but can get messy on other sections...

YMMV!

whaaaaaat how do you do this????
 
I usualy do use transparent events im just on a new install and havent turned it on yet for anyone that wants to know how to do it


file - preferences - event display and its one of 4 check boxes
 
Nice tutorial Alan. Question, why do you align the second peak? I've always aligned the first.

good balance between the chugs anything more then this can start to sound goofy.

Yes, I've had this problem. Are you saying don't align them perfectly, just leave them a bit random?
 
I usualy do use transparent events im just on a new install and havent turned it on yet for anyone that wants to know how to do it


file - preferences - event display and its one of 4 check boxes

nonono I always use transparent events, I'm talking about the alt-slip trick
 
aah my bad. Im pretty sure you cant do the one click slip with cubase 5 like you can with older versions ( if anyone knows how please let me know). I know you can do it with 2 clicks but if im doing 2 clicks its not any easier for me atleast to just alt click to cut and then click and slide the part actually saves me from having to add in a ctrl button press to start the slipping. not to mention that it doesnt really make any diffrence how you move the part the guide is to show where to line up the hits as 99% of people on here now how to move a part
 
Nice tutorial Alan. Question, why do you align the second peak? I've always aligned the first.

Im aligning to the second peak as the first bit is usually pick attack and its what sounds most correct to me.

Yes, I've had this problem. Are you saying don't align them perfectly, just leave them a bit random?

as for aligning the notes...
If every note hits at the same exact spot each time it just doesn't sound right. Thats why im not cutting individual notes but instead cutting them into groups of 1-4 so that there is a compromise getting the notes lined up and thus making them not ABSOLUTLY perfect but far closer then they originally would have been, however there are cases when one note is off to much and needs to be sliped by itself but like i said in the tutorial if I run into this i usually just retrack the part as its not close enough for me not to mention its a lot faster to retrack a 15 second section then to edit every note.

Keep in mind that im usually doing this will the guitarist tunes for the next section. Im usually dealing with pretty short chunks that can easily be edited in the time it takes the player to tune for the next take as im recording with the method described in the tight mix thread. some times it takes me longer to edit then it does them tune but its worth it to me at least as its much easier to edit an 8 bar section then it is to tackle Guitar bass and vocal edits all at once after tracking
 
i still say don't be afraid to time stretch edit DI's. cut/slip/crossfade on multi-track drums is one thing, but a guitar DI that's getting re-amped is a whole different story. has anyone tried this with cubase5's new time stretch engine? in protools this is stupidly easy and i can crank through a song extremely fast via elastic audio. x-form, always
 
as for aligning the notes...
If every note hits at the same exact spot each time it just doesn't sound right. Thats why im not cutting individual notes but instead cutting them into groups of 1-4 so that there is a compromise getting the notes lined up and thus making them not ABSOLUTLY perfect but far closer then they originally would have been

Alan thanks for this. I've recently started using Pro Tools and I think I've been sucked in by all the gadgets. With my old DAW there was no grid so I never even attempted to grid align anything, it was all done by ear. I've been experimenting with PT quantising, I found that cutting a dragging by hand sounds the best but as you say very quickly sounds goofy, especially in the fast sections. Mostly the pick attack sounds weird, like a helicopter.

I like your concept of a compromised grid alignment as it is less likely to screw with the pick attack.
 
has anyone tried this with cubase5's new time stretch engine? in protools this is stupidly easy and i can crank through a song extremely fast via elastic audio.

Elastic audio is a ripoff from Audio Warp from Cubase SX3, that was released like in 2004, way before the ProTools update (7.4) that was released in 2007. And the funniest thing back then when it was released the protools enthusiasts drummed were their chest "you can't do this shit with any other DAW"... Kinda reminds me why majority of people didn't like to work with midi in protools prior to the huge midi-upgrade in PT8, but hey cmon... It only took like 7 major upgrades and 15 years to make it even up to par the earliest versions of Cubase? :erk: Okay, Cubase has had it's flaws along the way too, like really fucking hard way to sidechain and routing was very limited up till like version 4, but they have been fixed along the way too.
 
Elastic audio is a ripoff from Audio Warp from Cubase SX3, that was released like in 2004, way before the ProTools update (7.4) that was released in 2007. And the funniest thing back then when it was released the protools enthusiasts drummed were their chest "you can't do this shit with any other DAW"... Kinda reminds me why majority of people didn't like to work with midi in protools prior to the huge midi-upgrade in PT8, but hey cmon... It only took like 7 major upgrades and 15 years to make it even up to par the earliest versions of Cubase? :erk: Okay, Cubase has had it's flaws along the way too, like really fucking hard way to sidechain and routing was very limited up till like version 4, but they have been fixed along the way too.

what?! did i come off as a cubase basher?? i didn't mean to! i was asking if cubase5, which i have not even ever seen or used before, is as useful for editing DI's via time stretch algorithms as protools is! it was my understanding that cubase5 had an advanced new time stretch engine, along with its vari-audio pitch shift engine implemented with the new build of 5, and that specifically.

editing with elastic audio and primarily its transient detecting marker engine... can that really be replicated in SX3? i'm aware that the cut > alt+drag time strecthing algorithm has been around forever, and i use the same basic concept in Reaper every day, but the magic of the PT 7.4 elastic time engine is in being able to touch a transient marker and have it immediately snap...without making a single cut.
 
editing with elastic audio and primarily its transient detecting marker engine... can that really be replicated in SX3? i'm aware that the cut > alt+drag time strecthing algorithm has been around forever, and i use the same basic concept in Reaper every day, but the magic of the PT 7.4 elastic time engine is in being able to touch a transient marker and have it immediately snap...without making a single cut.

That is exactly what I was talking about. It's not as advanced in SX3 as it was propably the first one to have it, so you can't do it as on the place editing (afaik) as in PT, but you need to go to the sample editor

 
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Vari Audio rocks, I haven't tried it on Di's yet, but it should be work well.

I love Cubase 5, nice features, its absolutely handy to use Vari, cause you don't have to jump to different progs...
I think C5 has improved my workflow.

btw, heavy voice in the Vid^^

Edit: Nice Tut, thanks man!
 
based on that video, the sample editor looks like it'd be glorious on DI's. the only thing i'd miss is the transient markers already in place, and the way they snap in grid mode. can any cubase5 users report on that?