Comparing and Contrasting The Mesa Heads

TruNikkaz

New Metal Member
Jun 27, 2008
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ok, i've always wanted to ask this question, and its not a true matter of me wanting either of these amps. it's pure curiosity.

compare and contrast the Dual Rec with the Mark IV plz...

OH, if ANYONE has any info on the Mesa Lonestar that Marco Sfogli uses, I would love to have something said about it:

[ame]http://youtube.com/watch?v=aqOomFjGfGg[/ame]

if u havent heard of this marco guy he's a beast, but that tone is very not mesa if you know what i mean
 
The Mark IV is tighter, much less midscooped, and less gainy than the Rectifier series. It's got a more 'old-school' voicing that can still work wonders for modern metal. Even tho I'm a sucka for the Recto tone, the Mark IV is my favorite Mesa. Both the cleans and the crunch are much better on a Mark IV too, making it a much more versatile amp.
 
The Mark IV is tighter, much less midscooped, and less gainy than the Rectifier series. It's got a more 'old-school' voicing that can still work wonders for modern metal. Even tho I'm a sucka for the Recto tone, the Mark IV is my favorite Mesa. Both the cleans and the crunch are much better on a Mark IV too, making it a much more versatile amp.

Yeah, isnt the Mark IV the amp that is behind Lamb Of Gods signature sound?
 
The Mark IV is tighter, much less midscooped, and less gainy than the Rectifier series

"Less midscooped" doesn't even begin to describe it. Set the graphic EQ flat, and it's all mids. Mark IV with mids on 5 = Marshall with mids on 10, or thereabouts. And I'm not exaggerating here. (I owned a Mark IV and a 2204 at the same time. I like midrange.) Honestly, I'd say they're roughly the same, gainwise. You just have to know how to dial in the lead channel. There's two gain controls, and the gain on tap is affected significantly by the treble setting. The Recto might have a bit more, but that's really beyond the "usable gain" range- what sensible person dimes the gain on Red/Modern, anyway?

Yeah, isnt the Mark IV the amp that is behind Lamb Of Gods signature sound?

That's correct, but their settings are rather unusual. They have the presence pulled (the Mark IV has a ton of push-pull pots) on the lead channel, which makes the amp significantly brighter... and then cranked up all the way. The Mark IV is an odd beast for sure. The tone stack is pre-gain, which makes the amp very mid-heavy and renders the bass knob useless for much of its range, as it's controlling the bass before distortion. Most players shape the sound pretty significantly with the graphic EQ, which is post-gain, like the tone controls on a more normal amp.

The Mark IV is very tight if dialed in properly. Maybe not VHT tight, but close enough, especially given its more "vintage"-flavored voicing. I found boosting the lead channel pretty useless, even playing death metal down in A standard. Boosting R2, the crunch channel, can yield some pretty cool tones, though. The clean is quite nice, which isn't surprising seeing as the Mark series are based off old Fenders.

There's a lot of power section options, which are very cool. You can run EL34s and 6L6s at the same time, there's a triode/pentode switch to reduce the power, Simul-class/Class A to drop the amp to 30 watts, and Tweed power to drop the voltage. The Mark IV has the best master volume of anything I've ever used- nothing else even comes close in this department- so the power options are more tone-shaping tools than anything. I preferred Simul-Class/Full Power for metal stuff with a band. At maximum power, despite being rated at 85 watts, the Mark IV is one of the loudest things I've ever used. It's louder than a Dual Rec or a Stiletto. (IMHO.) It's not '70s Marshall loud (that's the loudest thing I've ever played!) but it's getting there. I had a '90 Mark IV A, one of the early models with two effects loops and a different output transformer than the later versions, for whatever that's worth.

Oh, and the effects loop on the Mark IV is really nice. It pwns the shitty Recto loop hard. :lol:

The Mark IV and the Recto sound huge together. Just massive, if they're both dialed in right. They're voiced totally different- the Mark IV is thick, thick mids while the Recto has huge bottom end and an aggressive top.
 
Christ Exocaster, I never realized what an intimidating amp the Mark IV was in design. And yet I have to really hear a clip of it that demonstrates that all that complexity is worth it tonally - maybe that's why Randall Smith hasn't made anything nearly as complicated since then (and when did the Mark IV debut, anyway? Judging by it's wretched ugliness, I'm guessing EARLY 90s/late 80s)
 
Christ Exocaster, I never realized what an intimidating amp the Mark IV was in design. And yet I have to really hear a clip of it that demonstrates that all that complexity is worth it tonally - maybe that's why Randall Smith hasn't made anything nearly as complicated since then (and when did the Mark IV debut, anyway? Judging by it's wretched ugliness, I'm guessing EARLY 90s/late 80s)

1990. The Mark series has been around since the late '70s, and they all look generally similar. The Mark IV just has an assload more knobs. :lol:

It's a bear to dial in, they're not very popular, and honestly I found it was difficult to get the sound in the room to come across recorded. There's definitely a lack of good clippage out there. If I picked up another one, I'd probably spend a couple weeks just dicking with the settings and making clips. It's very versatile, and can do a lot of things.

BTW, the rhythm tone on much of Metallica's Black album is Mark IV, IIRC. Petrucci uses them these days, and the voicing of the IIC+/III/IV is pretty similar, the III being the most aggressive, and the IV "A" having a lead channel design closest (identical?) to the IIC+ with the III's output transformer. The IIC+ is your Master Of Puppets/AJFA/Dream Theater tone.

I have a couple of clips from when I had mine, for whatever they're worth. Here's a modern rock demo with the IV. This was recorded at very low volume in Class A/Tweed, if I'm remembering right. EC1000 with a Duncan Custom 5 and a Marshall cab with V30s. Single SM57 into an original MBox. Back in the days of hardware drum machines. :lol:

Mark IV A Rock Sample

And here's an isolated guitar track from a demo I tracked for a friend's band a couple years ago. He played an EMG-loaded Jackson through my Mark IV rig. I think there was a 57 and a Rode NT5 on the cab. We had the amp up pretty loud, right around "drummer" volume, into a Mackie desk.

Mark IV A heavier sample
 
Mark IV is exceptional amp with total control on every gain/drive stage. Well, probably not totally total since they've done the tone controls with only two center frequency positions (these could have been parametrics, ya know? ha!), but still, pretty much total.
Just another thing to add to Exocasters perfect review: this amp sounds awesome even at bedroom level. Never heard another like it.

Cheerz!
 
by the way that marco sgofli video is not the lone star. i'm pretty sure in the video it is turned off and i remember a bunch of people at the john petrucci forum boasting over the tone and i think he said somewhere that he was using he studio preamp or the quad preamp which is basically the mark iic+ preamp section with the 2:90 power amp i think.



either way the lone star is a great amp and the mark iv is one of the best amps ever. the only knock on it is that it is overly smooth even at the harshest settings so for certain styles of metal more "dry" distortions work. but hey IMO it is the best distortion of all time so don't take my word for it. you can get it sounding absolutely brutal and unlike all other metal amps a tube screamer takes the soul away that amp has enough midrange and has an onboard eq that you could just leave on the standard "V" and it will sound phenomenal. oh the other knock on that amp is the clean channels are basically useless haha because one, they are not that all that great very fat sounding and two, you don't have the balls to even think about switching out of the lead channel for at least a year after playing it.
 
Hey Gibson, pretty cool sound...for a Bogner 2x12 ;) I just sold mine after trying desperately to love it for the past year, but the thing is just too fizzy, and I have to say I hear that tell-tale tone in your clips (especially "War," "Nemesis," & "Antihero;" "Holy Diver" sounds better but still has it). Good job making the best of what you have, but my advice is: ditch it!

Edit: I've now listened to almost all of your clips, and "Holy Diver" sounds quite different (and better) IMO then the rest; do you remember what you did differently for that one?
 
Hey Gibson, pretty cool sound...for a Bogner 2x12 ;) I just sold mine after trying desperately to love it for the past year, but the thing is just too fizzy, and I have to say I hear that tell-tale tone in your clips (especially "War," "Nemesis," & "Antihero;" "Holy Diver" sounds better but still has it). Good job making the best of what you have, but my advice is: ditch it!

Edit: I've now listened to almost all of your clips, and "Holy Diver" sounds quite different (and better) IMO then the rest; do you remember what you did differently for that one?

That's funny, I don't hear the fizz. Most of my clips are recorded at low volumes, that could be the culprit. The Mark IV combined with the V30 cabinet could contribute to what you're hearing (more of a mid spike). Personally, I love the cab coupled with the Mark series. The "Holy Diver" clip was recorded with the exact same setup. Did you try different speakers in the cab?
 
That's funny, I don't hear the fizz. Most of my clips are recorded at low volumes, that could be the culprit. The Mark IV combined with the V30 cabinet could contribute to what you're hearing (more of a mid spike). Personally, I love the cab coupled with the Mark series. The "Holy Diver" clip was recorded with the exact same setup. Did you try different speakers in the cab?

Low volumes is most likely the cause (well it is in most amps). I think the Holy Diver clip was a lil overgained and a little too middy, but otherwise it sounded very nice.
 
That's funny, I don't hear the fizz. Most of my clips are recorded at low volumes, that could be the culprit. The Mark IV combined with the V30 cabinet could contribute to what you're hearing (more of a mid spike). Personally, I love the cab coupled with the Mark series. The "Holy Diver" clip was recorded with the exact same setup. Did you try different speakers in the cab?

Well there are only 2 of 'em, so yeah, I did :p And believe me, all V30 cabs are not created equal in terms of sound, as I've learned the hard way. I'm glad you like it though man, tone is of course subjective, so one man's overpriced, overhyped trash is another man's treasure!