Decibel's October Issue

BenMech

student of the d'eh
So, they have THE GALL to publish this whole roundtable debate about "Hipster Metal", and not once specify why they need to talk about this, and why they all defend Kemedo and The Sword.


I presume Jim and Dave will be pleased.


Meanwhile, really interesting profile about one of my favs in the 90s. Monster Magnet's Dopes to Infinity (which I presume Dave hates)
 
BenMech said:
So, they have THE GALL to publish this whole roundtable debate about "Hipster Metal", and not once specify why they need to talk about this, and why they all defend Kemedo and The Sword.


I presume Jim and Dave will be pleased.

I'm wondering if Dave could right an article on the BeeGees and have Decibel covering them a few months later.
 
I presume Jim and Dave will be pleased.
Who is this “Dave” of which you speak? :lol:

So, they have THE GALL to publish this whole roundtable debate about "Hipster Metal", and not once specify why they need to talk about this, and why they all defend Kemedo and The Sword.
It is utterly ridiculous on many levels. I find it humorous though. Not surprising…for all their cutting-edge and enfant terrible posturing decibel is a mainstream magazine and must maintain a fabricated “underground” and “independent" identity in order to remain credible, so my article does exist in their world but it is not of their world. It actually reads like a coordinated and choreographed response to my article, but it is stilted and herks and jerks due to a chair intentionally left empty around their table. :)

The article is a hoot though and they are bunch of tools:

Brian Slagel: By the way, in case you don’t know this already, Lars from Metallica is a huge Sword fan. He loves them.

How the hell anybody in their right mind could still trot out Ulrich as an individual who would boost a band’s credibility at this point is beyond me. As far as I can see, moving beyond what I may think, he is one of the most reviled music personalities in recent memory. It is staggering how out of touch these people are…

John Darnielle in response to Kory Grow commenting on how metal fans scared the crap out of him:

That is why I used to wear a suit and tie to my metal shows, because then they would assume that I was a label rep and leave me alone.

And he claims in the article that there is “no such thing as a hipster.” These people are fools and the article just ends up digging them in a deeper hole for anyone paying close attention. After the initial shitstorm on the Internet, but before the “false metal” article appeared, one review (not going to take the time to dig it out or look it up) opened their meditation on all this that came to no conclusion with the astute observation that “hipsters love nothing more than a game of dress-up.” Something I’ve seen time and time again. Hell…the last time I was in Chicago, I had to let a guy decked out in a zoot suit style outfit know that his backhanded and ironic comments about my Dio shirt were not appreciated nor welcome.

Darnielle is a hipster through and through. It is a term that people are very familiar with and it has definitional boundaries that can be hazy at times, but that is life—what is more than apparent on the street is difficult to translate into words.

Anyway, as a public service and because it is a damn informative and interesting read here is an article on what could be called “hipster hunting.”

This is a shortened version of the original article:

Part I

Part II



Meanwhile, really interesting profile about one of my favs in the 90s. Monster Magnet's Dopes to Infinity (which I presume Dave hates)
I wouldn’t put quite that strongly. Infinity is a fine album, but much of the rough and ready charm and wild and manic energy that made Superjudge Monster Magnet’s real high point is absent on Infinity, making it a buffed and spit-shined follow-up to a superior prior release.

What the hell a rock ‘n’ roll album is doing in a “pantheon of extreme metal" is another matter entirely though…

The previous entry was The Rollins Band The End of Silence, and I do hate that crap.

It is interesting how decibel is doing the same thing that metal magazines did in the early ‘90s when grunge/alternative was slyly pawned off as heavy metal. Only a matter of time before something like Nirvana, Jesus Lizard, Big Black, or Slint is inducted into their “hall of fame.”
 
BenMech said:
Hey, I liked The Rollins Band, as much as you like some goofy power thrash badness like Grim Reaper or whomever.
Ha!

Just offering my opinion. Rollins is waaaay overrated in my book. I've never been able to get into Rollins era Black Flag either, but the pre-Rollins material is enjoyable. Never enjoyed Grim Reaper either though for that matter. :)
 
I like Monster Magnet and The Rollins Band too. And Nirvana, Jesus Lizard, Big Black and Slint for that matter. Of course I wouldn't consider them to be Heavy Metal but on the other hand it's really not such a big step from Big Black and Jesus Lizard's dissonant riffing to (let's say) Voïvod. So I don't see why it would be such a problem that some Metal mags (mainstream or not) pay attention to bands like that.
 
Occam's Razor said:
Rollins' spoken word material is pretty enjoyable.
I'm more fond of Jello Biafra myself.

I could go on and on about Rollins, actually--but won't. Maybe it is because my first real exposure to him was in the early '90s when he was the poster boy (Man of the Year in 1994) for Details Magazine--the "forward fashion" bible for young male three-martini-lunch-go-getters with a "post-Yuppie sensibility." :ill:

In fact, decibel and details probably are not that far removed from one another in spirit. *makes mental note to self*

Also, for anyone out there keeping a scorecard, it should be noted that before "False Metal" numerous sidebars and many of the "lifestyle" features (gaming, comics, etc.) and the section which could be called "news" I guess were run without bylines in decibel. After "False Metal" each and every piece in the magazine now has an author. :) The "decibot" is the lone exception, however.
 
I found the literature Rollins produced intensely distubing as well. Maybe I have a different angel here, because he's never been that big n Europe, so I am not fed up with his face that appeared in any media over there obviously
 
Occam's Razor said:
because he's never been that big n Europe, so I am not fed up with his face that appeared in any media over there obviously
That raises a larger issue that certainly relates to many cultural issues (including metal) and is rarely addressed. I think a lot of issues may resonate differently or be percieved differently and due to the kind of banal interconnectedness of everything--what is apparent to some is not apparent to others and vice versa.

Not that this is a revelation or anything, but something that becomes an almost atmospheric element that is taken for granted and therefore recedes into the background when it actually should be in the foreground.


It is something that has come a bit to the forefront with US versus Australian perceptions due to the unfortunate and sad death of Steve Irwin, but hasn't really been siezed upon by anyone since the emotional wound is still to raw to delve too deeply into that type of analysis.

But I'm three beers down and will start rambling if I am not careful...
 
DBB said:
It is something that has come a bit to the forefront with US versus Australian perceptions due to the unfortunate and sad death of Steve Irwin, but hasn't really been siezed upon by anyone since the emotional wound is still to raw to delve too deeply into that type of analysis.

Totally off-topic note. I don't know if I'd even know who this guy was at all if I didn't read www.irregularwebcomic.net. He's parodied there (as a guy who does things like wrestle Cthulhu and stuff and has an antagonistic relationship with Jane Goodall), but then so is Star Wars, D&D, James Bond, etc. I thought he was just some local Australian thing (the guy who does the strip is Australian). Imagine my shock when an Irregular Webcomic character was suddenly the talk of THE ENTIRE FUCKING WORLD. I suppose I should be glad I knew he was a real person at all and not just a lego comic character. :D

http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/1290.html

http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/1306.html

http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/1317.html

:D
 
Hmm, interesting

While I do not like The Mountain Goats that Darnielle dude raises some very valid points:

"When it comes down to their scene, metal fans are purists. They don’t want outside attention. Any time there’s any band that can make any noise outside of that circle, they’re going to brand them as poseurs, false metal, or hipster metal"

The guy is absolutely spot on correct and this site is living proof of that :lol: :Smug:

"I think if bands start insisting on sticking in their own little neighborhoods and refuse to branch out, then the scene dies"

Couldn't have said it better! (and I still don't like The Mountain Goats) :headbang:
 
Ho-hum. How shocking! You agreeing with the incisive editorial position of decibel which is nothing more than a cliched phrase that executives mouth whenever they are trotting out a new product line to graft onto the media industry. Didn't see that coming.:rolleyes:


Where have I heard very similar sentiments expressed. Hmmmmmmm....oh yes! It was Carl Schultz the "hipster metal" publicist:

Hard music is hard music regardless of if a band suddenly has a lot of press, and they're a new band, and they haven't been toiling in the underground for years and years. I think that when people dump these labels like hipster metal, it's because they're a little upset because they didn't know about this band first, like they do half the time.

Bunch of tools. People just want to totally ignore the unseemly side of the business and act as if it is an even playing field. Has nothing to do with inside connections..like which concert promoters you know and whose palms you've greased.

You release your CD yet? I'm interested to hear it. No need to send me a promo. I'll buy it.
 
Also, the funny and real ironic thing is that it is magazines like Revolver, Guitar World and Metal Maniacs perpetuating and spreading the "hipster metal" tag. I'm sure Guitar World is a "narrow-minded" publication that would have published my piece if given the chance.:lol:
 
Speaking of irony, thanks for proving me and that Darniello geezer right. Again. :err:

Actually we just released our CD. I can send you a copy although I'm not sure you'll like it. We're not really 'Metal' strictly speaking. We just play what we like without any consideration of genre or what target groups may be interesting for us :lol: Musically we've been compared with everything from Entombed to Hüsker Dü so I guess you could call us a Hard Rock band of sorts.
 
DBB said:
Ho-hum. How shocking! You agreeing with the incisive editorial position of decibel blablabla...
Wait a minute. I'm not agreeing with that shitrag magazine you people here seem to be so obsessed about. I'm just agreeing with that one statement by that guy (I only wish I didn't hate The Mountain Goats so much)

Go easy on the paranoia, will ya! :rolleyes:
 
Thrash was more or less thrash, death metal was more or less death metal, and the slovenly longhair scumbags who gave a shit were, for the most part, not self-aware.

Hmm.

I think that any band that might be categorized as hipster metal these days, I feel like they’re really solid songwriters but I think the craftsmanship is what I find the most engaging about these [new] bands. It’s not heavy for the sake of being heavy. It’s heavy, but the song is there.

This could be taken to mean "Heavy metal is just heavy for the sake of heavy, there are no songs... but these guys, they have songs!"

They start listening to a little metal, but they sort of want to describe the metal in terms that makes it part of their shtick instead of its own universe.

I think this sums up the entire problem right here.

I feel like that’s what’s going on with the indie folks; they’re trying to ease into metal, but they don’t want to start by listening to guys who they’re afraid of.

Seriously?

My long-standing shtick is that ironic appreciation is actual appreciation, but it’s hesitant. It’s sort of wanting to maybe dip their toe in, but in the event that the whole subculture goes “What the fuck are you talking about? We don’t listen to polka,” they can go “Ah-ha, I was just kidding.” As a culture all indie rock people sort of gradually are like, “I like this metal, but it’s intelligent metal, but they’re kind of our people” and this and that. Ironic appreciation is one of those ways of not having to do what is a very scary thing. Most people who grew up metal will acknowledge that if you decided you were going to fucking wear your cut-off jeans and vest and put fucking Iron Maiden on the back of your jacket, you were going to get clowned, right?

They are really being clear in explaining what the problem is, but they are completely missing it.

I recently read an article that suggested that hipster metal bands are more concerned with what they’re wearing and I just found that hilarious. More than almost any other scene, heavy metal has always been about a uniform.

I think the point is that metal fans (not so much bands, unfortunately, at least in the promo photos) are going to wear their "uniform" whether they are expecting to be around metal people or not. It's their "uniform" they wear even in unconnected situations because they want to, not because they are expected to.

I think if bands start insisting on sticking in their own little neighborhoods and refuse to branch out, then the scene dies.

The world will die without marketing.

As soon as the major labels get involved, we’re all dead unless it’s really done the right way. The indies can kinda control that. That’s what happened with metal in the ’80s. As soon as the majors started getting involved and putting tons of money behind the bands, then they get a great review in The New York Times. As soon as that happens, you’re dead. Your parents go, “Oh, Johnny look at this, there’s this band you like that has a good review in The New York Times.” Then it’s over.

heh.

I recently interviewed Mastodon and put them on the cover of my indie rock magazine. They’re a little nervous about being on a major but they seem to think it’s the right thing for where they are. They couldn’t do any more being on an independent.

Yes, no more writing music, releasing albums, or being on tour... they just couldn't do any more being on an independent, obviously.

I ignored Mastodon live sets happening in the building I was already in both before and after they were signed. I can say my complete lack of giving a shit has nothing to do with their popularity.

I feel like there’s this overtly literary quality to Mastodon and I think that’s what indie rock hipsters are looking for in metal—something that they can tie in to their own tradition, which is largely a liberal arts school tradition where they can say: “Here’s how this connects to the literature that I read or the films that I like and shit.” They don’t want to seem boneheaded.

I wish someone would have stood up and said that this has been a part of metal for DECADES now. sheesh.