does anyone here work with assistant engineers?

[Machinated]

its very much the norm in commercial studios to have a hierarchy of engineers working on projects. essentially so a team of people can do what they are each best at rather than one person doing anything.

it kind of feels like this eludes metal slightly, id imagine largely due to budget constraints, but also largely because people daren't take the risk.

i'm finding that doing everything myself is extremely draining and i'd get more satisfaction working with other people. its definitely become more common on here for people to out source editing work to others to soften the load. my plan is to start having assistants helping out with editing and mix prep which eats a huge chunk of time and means when I actually get round to mixing the song doesn't sound fresh in the slightest to me any more.

 

[rapucore]

Outsourcing editing is really useful. It softens the load and lets the mixing engineer focus on the actual mixing part like you said.
I've done several editing works (drums / guitar / bass) for people in this forum, and they've been pleased to get some load taken off of their shoulders.

It's great to start mixing a song that has been quantized/edited (if needed) and all noises etc. have been taken care of beforehand.
It's a real turnoff when you have to edit the whole song before you can actually start the mixing. uke:

I like to work in phases if I'm doing everything by myself.
An ideal order of working for me is the following (if I wasn't involved in tracking):

1. Editing (instrument quantizing, vocal aligning etc.)
2. Pre-mix (checking phase issues, general leveling, possible hi/lopass etc.)
3. Actual mixing (paste your workflow here)

But the thing is that you lose focus REALLY easily when in charge of everything. :Smug:

I'd be glad to work for someone doing the editing and prepping up so they could focus on creating some art.

 

[nialldoran]

i'm a staff engineer at the studio i work at and i've worked AS an assistant engineer for many years, doing everything from assisting while tracking to vocal tuning drum/edits and sample etc, it helps the project come along quicker and helps whoever it is i'm working for feel fresher when they have to mix the project, i don't have assistant engineers under me i move fairly quickly as i'm used to having to do all the pre-mix work etc so the process is always fresh with me,

we don't do a huge amount of metal at the studio and most things that we have, require little to no drum editing such as the last few slomatics records (very slow doom), which is such a great, free way to work

 

[C_F_H_13]

For me it was always hard finding good help. I had 6 different assistants over the course of a 5 year stint as chief engineer of a major studio. As great as it was to have them around for taking notes and other mindless jobs, I would never be satisfied with their editing or tuning to not have to check over all of it myself at the end. I ran into an issue where if I did find someone who could edit competently, they knew their own self worth and would leave after a few months to try and do it independently.

Because of this my whole view on interns/assistants is kind of negative, but outsourcing is a whole other thing. If I have the budget, I outsource editing/reamping/sampling whateverI can to not have to deal with that shit. For me from a time/money standpoint, having a guy(s) that you can send stuff to for fixing or whatever when you need it, makes way more sense then some guy who hangs around all the time and you have to train into someone useful.

 

[nialldoran]

yeah it can be tricky, i was around in this studio for about 2 years before i started to become useful in that way,but the two guys who run the place are very patient and now i'm not only benefiting their projects but bringing in my own work that earns their studio money, so in the long run it worked out good in this situation, but even during my time here there have been some hopeless cases through the doors who want to train and do it full time, but everything thing from bad attitude to incompetence when it comes to the actual work, has led to them all except me being asked to leave

 

[JeffTD]

For me it was always hard finding good help. I had 6 different assistants over the course of a 5 year stint as chief engineer of a major studio. As great as it was to have them around for taking notes and other mindless jobs, I would never be satisfied with their editing or tuning to not have to check over all of it myself at the end. I ran into an issue where if I did find someone who could edit competently, they knew their own self worth and would leave after a few months to try and do it independently.

Because of this my whole view on interns/assistants is kind of negative, but outsourcing is a whole other thing. If I have the budget, I outsource editing/reamping/sampling whateverI can to not have to deal with that shit. For me from a time/money standpoint, having a guy(s) that you can send stuff to for fixing or whatever when you need it, makes way more sense then some guy who hangs around all the time and you have to train into someone useful.

I pretty much agree with this. I've had maybe 1 or 2 things handed to me that I felt I was comfortable on without re-touching myself, but the vast majority of the times I've worked with other engineers have resulted in me re-editing everything they've done, asking them to re-do it (and having to touch-up their work after a re-do, too), or panicking over the possibility of them having fucked up so much that I just do it myself again anyways and bin their tracks.

 

[mva801]

Yeah it's tough finding someone who can do that type of work. I started as an assistant and worked my way up, and now I'll have interns most of the time at the studio. All they ever do is hook up mics, patch, get coffee and clean. Every once in a while I'll let them run the computer while we're tracking but I do 98% of all the work in Pro Tools and all the button pushing.

 

[DavePiatek]

I ran into an issue where if I did find someone who could edit competently, they knew their own self worth and would leave after a few months to try and do it independently.

This. Good people are hard to find. Especially ones that are as OCD about drum edits as I am.

 

[JeffTD]

One issue I constantly ran into as a freelance editor was fair payment. I'm at a point where I can edit virtually any drum track quickly, perfectly, and with whatever groove/feeling is required or desired and I have the track record to prove it, yet was still lowballed by engineers who saw it as grunt/dirty work (many of whom it was apparent couldn't edit the tracks on their own, which might be key; an inability to do the work reflects a lack of appreciate for the effort/expertise that goes into it).

There was one guy in particular who I was partnered with for a bit who had absolutely zero appreciation for the craft of good editing and would never pay me or other editors who he tried to farm work out to a fair rate; not coincidentally, tracks I received from him were consistently under-edited and always had clicks/pops because he didn't spot-check his cross fades.

On the other hand, the guys who paid me best were dudes who used to edit their own stuff but now are too slammed to do so, or were recording their own band and wanted to stay as hands-off as possible with the dirty work.

I don't think anyone who's posted so far is guilty of underpaying or underappreciating editors by any stretch of the imagination, but I think that my experiences with 'engineers' who were guilty of those things is indicative of a mentality that's permeated throughout the industry - people who aren't familiar with or are able/willing to do the hard work necessary don't appreciate it and aren't likely to pay for it as such, thus the shrinking budgets and tight-fistedness surrounding the topic.

 

[ArthurD]

One issue I constantly ran into as a freelance editor was fair payment. I'm at a point where I can edit virtually any drum track quickly, perfectly, and with whatever groove/feeling is required or desired and I have the track record to prove it, yet was still lowballed by engineers who saw it as grunt/dirty work (many of whom it was apparent couldn't edit the tracks on their own, which might be key; an inability to do the work reflects a lack of appreciate for the effort/expertise that goes into it).

There was one guy in particular who I was partnered with for a bit who had absolutely zero appreciation for the craft of good editing and would never pay me or other editors who he tried to farm work out to a fair rate; not coincidentally, tracks I received from him were consistently under-edited and always had clicks/pops because he didn't spot-check his cross fades.

On the other hand, the guys who paid me best were dudes who used to edit their own stuff but now are too slammed to do so, or were recording their own band and wanted to stay as hands-off as possible with the dirty work.

I don't think anyone who's posted so far is guilty of underpaying or underappreciating editors by any stretch of the imagination, but I think that my experiences with 'engineers' who were guilty of those things is indicative of a mentality that's permeated throughout the industry - people who aren't familiar with or are able/willing to do the hard work necessary don't appreciate it and aren't likely to pay for it as such, thus the shrinking budgets and tight-fistedness surrounding the topic.

Jeff, I PMd you about an editing job. Cheers!

 

[JeffTD]

Jeff, I PMd you about an editing job. Cheers!

Responded but just in case anyone else gets the same idea, I'm not taking on editing work any more.

 

[Winston Wolf]

my plan is to start having assistants helping out with editing and mix prep

Have those positions been filled yet?
I see why mix prep can be tedious work to do...
I often find it quite fascinating though,to the point where I've downloaded a lot of stuff for mixing practice,sorted all the tracks,fitted them into my templates,checked phase etc,but never got back to actually mix it

 

[rapucore]

...to the point where I've downloaded a lot of stuff for mixing practice,sorted all the tracks,fitted them into my templates,checked phase etc,but never got back to actually mix it

Shameless plug: my upcoming mixing practices have all that taken care of beforehand.

 

[mickrich]

I usually have one of my second year students assisting for sessions.
Over the course of the year I try and get them all out at some stage.
They vary wildly on how much they are capable of doing.
I wouldn't trust them to edit or place mics but it is brilliant having somebody to tape op and save and open sessions etc.
The big advantage is not having to sit right in front of monitors listening to loud click track all day when tracking.
I can sit back on the couch and listen comfortably to the performance and go home much fresher than when I am doing it myself.

 

[greyskull]

My problem is that so few people can be trusted to do a half way decent job.

 

[rapucore]

My problem is that so few people can be trusted to do a half way decent job.

What kind of experiences have you had? Interested in hearing

 

[jval]

These days with the cost of a home recording setup being so low, it's extremely hard to find a good enough assistant, like others are already saying here. For me to trust someone else to work for me, they've got to do things almost the same as I do and just as well, otherwise it's just a time waster. Problem is, all of those people are recording bands themselves at home. And the longer they do that, the more bad/weird habits they develop, and the harder it is to train them to work your way.

 

[brianhood]

I've tried interns in the past. I've even gotten some from Belmont University, where their students pay upwards of $20,000\yr to attend(which is hilarious to me, since I never even considered going to college).

In my experience, they are not worth the time you invest training them. I honestly hate teaching people things, so this is absolutely never going to be something I do again. (although the last intern I got was one of the nicest dudes to walk this earth).

On the other hand, if you find an assistant that knows what he's doing, they are worth their weight in gold. I recently hired a guy to work for me, and he's been incredible. I'm paying him what seems to be the going rate for assistant engineers in this genre, and I honestly feel like he's underpaid. He's that important to what I do. He can handle basically everything in the tracking and editing process that I need him to.

 

[greyskull]

What kind of experiences have you had? Interested in hearing

I know that comment may come off as hugely arrogant, but I only know one maybe two people who I could trust to do either a decent job of tracking a project, or more appropriately for an assistant, do a decent job of editing.

The trouble is that the few people who would be able to do those things decently, are way too busy to be assistants!

 

[xTomx]

I'm an assisting at a place in London, learnt a lot of techniques and approaches I'd never have come across just editing/prepping my own stuff.