Drum engineering question: Punching in without overwriting cymbals?

[Mattayus]

How would one conduct such a practice, dear sirs.

Why I'm questioning such a seemingly simple affair is this; If the drummer is halfway through a take, he hits a cymbal, it rings out, then the next part is riding on the ride, or just a any different cymbal in the same mic (let's say you're just doing a two OH mic jobby), and he fucks that part up, and wants to go from the start of that bar? Would you not be cutting off the last cymbal sustain of the last take?

That's a very specific question and situation, of course, but I'm sure it comes up. Is it simply a question of "they have to do it from the last possible moment without that shit happening" or is there a way round it that I'm not thinking of?

Possibly a dumb question, I don't know, but my drum tracking experience is next to zero, and I'm about to venture into it in the near future and want to be armed in case stupid shit like this comes up.

 

[Plankis]

I wonder where you got that question from...
http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/production-tips/627012-punching-drums.html
This forum must be a proof that the subconscious stores a lot more crap than what your consciousness does. For every question there's 3 similar popping up shortly after.

Let the drummer start a bar before the actual take and make sure he hits the same cymbals. Add some crossfades, it'll smoothen it out even more.

 

[TheWinterSnow]

most DAWs have punch in options, one option would be to blend new clips with old clips and you will have two tracks overlapping, which you would overlap the sustain of the previous take over the new take.

 

[Mattayus]

I wonder where you got that question from...
http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/production-tips/627012-punching-drums.html
This forum must be a proof that the subconscious stores a lot more crap than what your consciousness does. For every question there's 3 similar popping up shortly after.

Let the drummer start a bar before the actual take and make sure he hits the same cymbals. Add some crossfades, it'll smoothen it out even more.

Well fuck my arse.
I even searched.
Yet had I just LOOKED AT THE FIRST FUCKING PAGE, there it was.

My bad, and thanks guys.

 

[Ben Johnson]

Always start the take a few bars before the mistake occurred.

Also, sample every piece of the kit with every articulation the drummer uses. This has saved my ass on NUMEROUS occasions.

 

[MetalSound]

you can also use another track and let the cymbals ring out. good for stuff where are a lot of tempo changes and the drummer doesn´t nail them perfectly.
just let the cymbals ring out at the end of track 1 and start another take with the next tempo on track 2.

 

[bryan_kilco]

you can also use another track and let the cymbals ring out. good for stuff where are a lot of tempo changes and the drummer doesn´t nail them perfectly.
just let the cymbals ring out at the end of track 1 and start another take with the next tempo on track 2.

+1.

First time my band recorded and didnt use click tracks, we'd just kinda *cymbal hit - ring out* and let the cymbals sustain, then carry on from there.

 

[Morgan C]

you can also use another track and let the cymbals ring out. good for stuff where are a lot of tempo changes and the drummer doesn´t nail them perfectly.
just let the cymbals ring out at the end of track 1 and start another take with the next tempo on track 2.

Yep, this, but there's no real need to have them on different tracks? Just get him to end at the end of the bar of the first section (can be difficult sometimes), then get him to start up again on beat 1 of the second section. If they can't get this then you have to do it differently, but I find this works best, as you can make sure every section is perfect before moving on.

 

[drew_drummer]

What I've done before when tracking in sections is: have the drummer hit the first hit of the downbeat of the next section. Then when you record that section, don't let him hit those cymbals again - and use the ending of the previous section to blend the two together.

I think it sounds more natural. However it doesn't work too well if the next section has a lot of cymbal work during the first few beats or so.

 

[JeffTD]

I've done this before, and had the two overlap, crossfade with an equal power fade.

 

[mva801]

Yeah a lot of the time crossfading the two sections will work. But 98% of the time I just punch the drummer in earlier, so you get the cymbal hit. If he's not good enough to play a transition that he wrote in a tempo he chose, then he should practice more before recording...