Drums in a very little room..possible solutions?

[::XeS::]

I've recorded drums for my last projects in a very little room: ceiling at 3meters, and 4 meters for the other 2 sides....not ideal at all.
What happened? The OH's turned out very ambient, probably because of the reflections.
This is a pic of my last section:

As you can see, the wall are really close to the drums.
One solution should be moving the oh's mics closer to the cymbals...20cm...but probably I'll get less reflection but also less cymbals image (and also I could need more mics to capture some "hidden" cymbals).
Other solution? It would be cool to have a big room with high ceiling but actually it's a little hard to find. Could some panels help me in any way?

 

[amarshism]

I also struggle with a small room. I have it dead as shit because the early reflections just sound terrible, but I too have struggle with clean, clear and crisp cymbals. The roof just isn't high enough and it's difficult to get treatment up there. Can't wait to get out of there.

 

[Lasse Lammert]

I'm recording drums in a small room.
but it's treated perfectly and sounds great.
so I'd say: get loads of absorbers, difusors etc, make sure to not only get thin high freq absorbers but also bass traps etc

 

[::XeS::]

What about putting some kind of pad around the OH's mics...I mean the mic aimed down and a pad around the mic that goes between the wall and the capsule, to avoid the direct reflections...

Something like:

Probably a stupid solution, but if I have a dedicated space to record drums, it would already well treated...unfortunately at the moment this is not a dedicated place :\

 

[Lasse Lammert]

well, you'll still have shitloads going on from the other pieces of the drum.
the problem with small rooms is that the modes (standing waves) are higher i the frequency range and hence more annoying (noone cares for a 10Hz standing wave), the smaller the room, the more important the bass freq controll.
you wanna have a relatively even RT60 over the whole freq spectrum..and in small rooms that's especially difficult for the low freqs

 

[::XeS::]

I've just calculated rt60 for some frequencies:

125Hz: 0.95s
250Hz: 1.32s
500Hz: 0.57s
1000Hz: 0.5s
2000Hz: 0.51s
4000Hz: 0.64s

It's just the formula applicated to the dimensions and the materials of the room.

 

[Jarkko Mattheiszen]

I've tracked drums in a very small room with a horrible room sound and really nasty flutter. Your best bet is to treat the surfaces like a madman. Carpet on the floor, molton on the walls, broadband absorbers all over the place, bass traps in the corners and if it's possible, hang some panels from the ceiling. You can always add cymbal mics and get them closer to the kit, but if the room sounds like crap, you can't hide it completely without making it as dead as possible.

Good luck!

 

[Max Morton]

I'm recording drums in a tiny room. It's treated with big care so the drums sound fine. I've got huge bass traps there, diffusers everywhere. Reflective wooden floor. Drums being placed on the podium. But how I wish I had a huge natural reverb)

 

[::XeS::]

Out of curiosity: with this little untreated room...which is the best frequency to treat initially? The lows with some bass trap or the highs with absorbtion panels around the drums?

 

[acappa]

My room is very small also, I get great results by using Auralex Xpanders, they will isolate your OH´s mikes from ceiling and your snare mike from HH

 

[Leon--]

it's really wrong for me to record drums in bad rooms,buy an e-kit will be a better solution.if the drum sound sucks then the whole production will suck,so i suggest an e-kit.but on the other hand you can work really hard and make the room really "dead" with NO refilections at all.but it will be hard in this room i think

 

[darthjujuu]

Out of curiosity: with this little untreated room...which is the best frequency to treat initially? The lows with some bass trap or the highs with absorbtion panels around the drums?

depends on what your production will ultimately be like...if you're sampling the shells and leaving the only natural stuff (OH/cymbals) super highpassed, definitely target those high frequencies first and worry about standing wave later. killing the flutter is top priority in a tiny room, IMO. obviously, shooting for a more natural drum mix is gonna require some adjustment across the board with something more absorbant than foam (rockwool, oc703) in the corners.

highly recommend glenn's stickied drums guide for basic drum room treatment. that plywood leaning against the wall trick is priceless for quick n' dirty standing wave augmentation.

 

[~BURNY~]

You should never have your mic closer to the walls/ceiling than the source (except for a certain type of room sound). In fact you should use the 3:1 rule between the walls/ceiling and the sources. Sure it's not like you're using omni mics but still...

 

[Dollarosa]

where about is this sticky with the plywood, recording in a small room next week. Thanks

 

[::XeS::]

I'm thinking to rotate the drums of 90° next time so I'll have more space between cymbals and the side walls. Hope it helps a little.
Second solutions would be placing the OH's aiming closer and straight down the cymbals (not aiming away from the snare).
Maybe some insulation panels around the mics could help to avoid some reflections from the ceiling

 

[darthjujuu]

where about is this sticky with the plywood, recording in a small room next week. Thanks

http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/production-tips/217656-acoustic-drums-metal-guide.html

 

[::XeS::]

I'll try the plywood solution.
Are these the right panels?

What about these?

Which is the right depth for the panels?

 

[Wisheraser]

While plywood is a good ghetto method for killing flutter echo in medium to large sized rooms, space is at way too much of a premium to use that in small rooms. Pretty much your only option to make that room useful is to pack it with thick absorbers (6" if possible) all around to make it as dead as possible over the widest frequency range possible. This way you can kill flutter, as well as reduce some of the horrible modal issues that small rooms have (which plywood would do nothing to help). It still won't be good sounding, but it will be less bad.

Think of it this way: stuffing a small tracking room with thick absorbers is a lot like lubing up before getting raped. You're still fucked, but it won't be as painful.

 

[jangoux]

Think of it this way: stuffing a small tracking room with thick absorbers is a lot like lubing up before getting raped. You're still fucked, but it won't be as painful.

hahah best quote ever along with Jeff's cheesburguers eating each other quote