Feedback for Local Advertising: HELP NEEDED!

[Harvester]

Point blank: The remaining tickets are not moving as fast as I would expect or like them to. I cannot sit around and wait to see if the trend will reverse itself even if we are still 3 1/2 months out. I did that last year and we did not come close to a sell-out. Based on these trends, I am predicting the festival comes to a close within 3-5 years unless something happens that gets the older fans to come back. It's been a hell of a run, but all good things do come to an end in this industry.

That said....

I will now turn to the Atlanta market with a strong advertising push. Individual day tickets will go on sale much earlier this year based on the strength of previous Atlanta shows from some of the bands. I believe that Kamelot drew around 700 on the last tour in Atlanta. I would guess that less than 10% of that audience has bought tickets for the festival. I have also received several emails from Turisas/Tyr fans asking about individual day ticket sales as well. I fully expect the remaining Friday tickets to sell-out based on just that buzz alone. Nightwish pulls in over 1K in attendance at every stop in Atlanta. I would doubt that 95% of that crowd knows that Marco/Tarot is playing on Saturday yet.

The cost of advertising in the local entertainment paper (Creative Loafing) is a lot higher than what you think. How much advertising we do will greatly affect not only myself, but Shane & Nathan as well. There is no exact science to this so we are trying to get some feedback to help determine how much is necessary.

If you are planning on attending the festival and have not purchased your two day ticket yet, please be counted in this thread.

Thanks everyone.

Glenn

 

[J-Man]

I will be buying a two pass for my better half, I just completely forgot to buy it earlier.

 

[Kimavir]

I've still got a "maybe" or two among my friends as far as attending. I'll get with them and pick up my tickets soon. My whole group still has to grab tickets to Shane and Nathan's shows.

 

[hoodaman]

I have at least one friend that is waiting on a single day ticket arrangement because he only wants to see Kamelot.

 

[Perditions Ghost]

Having finally procured a job & finalized my school schedule for the Fall, I'm working on being able to get down for the show. If I do go, I have every intention of a two-day ticket.

So, I'm not definite, but hope to know in the coming weeks if it looks like something that I'd be able to pull off financially.

 

[General Zod]

Glenn... I'm sure you have ideas as to why tickets aren't selling as you would have hoped. Is it purely the economy? Or does it have to do with the scene? Do you view the frequency with which bands now tour the U.S. as part of the issue? Just curious to hear your insights. Thanks.

 

[Harvester]

Glenn... I'm sure you have ideas as to why tickets aren't selling as you would have hoped. Is it purely the economy? Or does it have to do with the scene? Do you view the frequency with which bands now tour the U.S. as part of the issue? Just curious to hear your insights. Thanks.

It's the perfect storm.

1. The economy hit everyone hard last year. While things have improved, they are no where near the point of disposable incomes like we saw 4 to 5 years ago.

2. The older fans are moving on to other circles (in music and life) and younger fans are jumping on the bandwagon of what they can see and experience on a regular basis thanks to constant touring. We have plenty of examples here on our own forum of the prior and plenty of examples everywhere else (such as the ATL metal forum) of the later.

3. Progressive and power metal is a niche market on the decline. It's a rare bird that crosses over with success to a younger audience. Kamelot and Symphony X have been slugging it out for years and are just now experiencing a moderate amount of success. The European markets are not that much better, honestly.

4. There is also simple apathy with any product over time. The only way to prevent this is to expand your product with other genres and potential capacity. You can't just stick your toes in the water though. You have to jump in with both feet so you can draw more than just the borderline fan. Hell, even Wacken has two main stages dedicated to different genres. I'm too damn old and stubborn to to attempt to pull off Wacken Jr. I will never lose another dime in this business like I did early on. Let someone else take the risk.


So what do I do? Hell, I don't know. I will try a few different things over the next couple of years to see if there is a successful formula. I booked old school headliners last year that don't tour. I booked two headliners that do tour this year. I brought back repeats last year. I stayed away from that almost completely this year. I booked some experimental stuff like DSO last time. I booked some old school thrash this time. I can tell you that the New England Hardcore Fest method of booking multiple tours at the same time will never work in the progressive and power metal fields. I will look at exclusives, dig around for a reunion, and look for the crossover appeal. I don't think there is a clear answer on what to do.

I will look at the numbers from year to year and adjust the budget accordingly. Once a certain threshold is hit based on current sales, it will trigger a call for the final show. With costs continuing to rise, that margin is not that wide. I'm hoping to hold that off for at least another five years.

 

[Magius]

I will be buying 4 Thusday tickets in the next couple of weeks. The main show is taken care of already.

I'll also be printing several hundred fliers to be passed out at the Scorpions/Ratt show in July. As with last year help passing them out will be appreciated. Hopefully the inclusion of Accept will generate some interest in that demographic.

It would be good if anyone attending any Masq or Tabernacle shows between now and September would print and pass some out. That might get more word out in the younger Turisas fan demographic.

Another suggestion would be to surrender a few tickets to local radio stations as give away prizes, which would get some mainsteam airway attention. I don't know how willing the stations would be to play that game given the canned format corporate attitude of radio these days. Could be worth a shot though.

 

[lady_space]

Until my personal economy picks up, I can't say whether i'll buy a ticket or not. That said, it would be more about the people this year, as the line-up (outside of 1-3 bands) doesn't particularly appeal to me. Not sure if that's the kind of feedback you're looking for, but there's mine.

Shaye

 

[J-Man]

1. The economy hit everyone hard last year. While things have improved, they are no where near the point of disposable incomes like we saw 4 to 5 years ago.

2. The older fans are moving on to other circles (in music and life) and younger fans are jumping on the bandwagon of what they can see and experience on a regular basis thanks to constant touring. We have plenty of examples here on our own forum of the prior and plenty of examples everywhere else (such as the ATL metal forum) of the later.

As the economy has hit everyone hard, there is another aspect also, some of the attendees that did not attend last year, had started new jobs, and just didn't have the vacation time to come. Hopefully for some of them it will change this year.

Yes, i see alot of the older fans are movin on in life and in music, myself included, but i think i am moving in a postive direction as far as music goes, I am now listening to some of the older Thrash metal, Pagan folk metal, even Viking Metal, I was so excited when Turisas was announced.

As to older, yes I am getting older, and folks it is getting harder for me to survive the 4 days in Atlanta, but i will continue to go as long my health permits which may not be but a year or two more, Even when i can't go i will find a way to support Glenn and this festival in some way form or fashion

Is there a solution to all this? Well, maybe. Let me throw this out there.

Have the forum members submit a list of 20 bands they would love to see(repeats included), then Glenn selects the 12 that have the most votes(if they fit in the budget) if not then fill the slots with those that really got the crowds attention over the years. Just a thought.

 

[Wandrail]

I think the economy more than apathy and demographics is to blame. I didn't attend last year due to my financial situation. I would like to attend this year but probably can't buy tickets until the last minute, provided there are some left at that point.

 

[Visa Guy]

"Yes, i see alot of the older fans are movin on in life and in music, myself included, but i think i am moving in a postive direction as far as music goes, I am now listening to some of the older Thrash metal, Pagan folk metal, even Viking Metal, I was so excited when Turisas was announced."

To agree with J-Man, I have found that as I have grown older (46 now) my tastes in metal have expanded. Years ago, I began to like the "progressive death metal" bands--In Flames, etc.--that I used to dislike. From there is was Soilwork, Dark Tranquility, etc. I now find myself Liking a lot of the newer metal bands that maintain an actual melody--Bullet For My Valentine, (who I just saw live and they killed), Sonic Syndicate, etc.

As the "older" PPUSA audience moves on, I would think the fest would benefit from bringing in some bands that appeal more to the younger crowd while still being apealing (or maybe even only tolerable) for the "older" crowd. let's face it, through the years no PPUSA line up has appealed to everyone. Hell, every year there are threads-a-plenty after the roster is announced where people bitch and moan about this band or that band being at the fest. Would there be any appreciable difference if a "younger" metal band was brought in? Some of the regulars would bitch and some would be happy--or least open and curious (a la DSO, Mustach, etc.). However, if the line up brought in some of the younger crowd, they would (maybe) be the returning crowd that could be more counted on into the future.

Just a thought.

 

[Miguel]

Im going for the showcase and the main event, I still dont know if my friend Daniel will be attending, I haven't bought the tickets, i'm waiting for a check to come in next month.

 

[Cheiron]

Who reads Creative Loafing that would likely be interested in this show? Just curious.

Has anybody dropped off fliars at the various music shops in Little 5? If not, I'll be in the area today and I can print up and leave a few.

 

[Cheiron]

Lets also be honest. There are only a handful of 'progressive metal' bands that haven't been to this fest, that are still active, and that people care much about. There are a couple handfuls of power metal bands, but several of them are too expensive to matter. The biggest bands in the genres are not active enough to really get the buzz going on even the smaller ones.

The most attractive progmetal bands in terms of selling tickets, are those that don't sound anything like Dream Theater. Many of the ones that were attractive and sounded like Dream Theater (or Fates Warning) no longer exist. The fan base partly has left because of that.

There are very few cost effective headline capable bands.

 

[Anubisaxe]

I am in what more than likely is considered the younger age group (being 25 now with the upcoming fest being my 6th). Each year I try to bring someone new to the festival with me of my also "young" friends. This year is turning out to be one of the toughest years of convincing people due, in part at least, to financial standing. Every person who I have brought along for any year always has a blast and has the intention of coming back but it's interesting to see what bands get them excited. When I went around raving about the lineup to friends TYR was the one that turned everyones head. I am curious what would happen if there were more bands that are, or rooted in, the heavier side of power/prog (Borknagar, Ulver, Obscura, Katatonia, etc...). On the other side of the coin, I work at a CD store and I have endlessly raved about the fest and generally get reactions from the "I wish I could do something like that" realm. To be honest, that sole reasoning was my excuse for not going to PP5 (which now I regret). It takes a very specific and dedicated music fan to attend a festival like this. I am mostly just spurting things off the top of my head and have no solid insight into how these things work but I hope the fest goes on as long as it's beneficial for everyone and will keep raving and dragging people with me until then.

 

[Heavenly Call]

I know of 2 ticket sales you will get later this summer. As for local advertising,I can't say that I ever look at any of the local ads except Creative Loafing occasionally. I find out about concerts through e-mail announcements, visiting venue websites, and forums.

IF I was going to do Creative Loafing, I would seriously DO it and take a full page or 1/2 page ad for two weeks in JULY. That's, to me, late enough so people remember it, but still early enough to generate some sales and allow people to change schedules.

While I appreciate the festival getting "bigger," Glenn have you looked at the other side and considered instead of 12 bands, shrinking down do 8 or so? Honestly, I'd pay the same ticket price (or the same sponsor rate) for 8 bands as I would 12. I usually only actually WATCH 6-8 bands anyway. Four "bigger" names each night. Have room for longer sets or special sets. You could even have a couple of solid regional/local bands open as I'm sure most of them (I know we would) would play for free and could MAYBE add a few more ticket sales. Just a thought.

 

[AMBR]

In this perfect storm, I think the economy makes up the greater part of the formula. As it is, Dave, Michelle and I are not coming Wednesday, as we have been doing, simply to save the money. We are also hoping to buy the tickets for Thursday at the venue, assuming they will be sold on the show day, also to save on TM fees. Times are tough - real tough.

As I've aged, my musical tastes have expanded as well. Unfortunately, so have my financial responsibilities. I'm now paying for two college educations and staring at a 401k statement that was decimated. With the hubby hitting 50, we can't put off thinking about our future anymore. I don't know how many other oldsters are in this boat, but I'm sure we're not alone.

I honestly can't think of any more ideas for bringing in the younger crowd then the ones stated above, which I think are pretty good ideas actually. Having two 20-something kids, I'll survey them and their friends to see what would draw them, but their financial positions are mostly worse than ours.

 

[ICEDEARTHFAN]

I might could sit through 1 or 2 of the death metal bands kids are into today,but that's about all I can tolerate.I want clean vocals on at least 85% of the fest if I'm attending.If Glenn decides to start going the way Chicago's Fest does with bringing in too many of those death metal bands,I'm out.
I think this fest would benefit from bringing in more thrash bands.I feel like younger kids today would enjoy that more than the Prog bands.I would definitely be interested in seeing more thrash myself.I love power metal and thrash metal.To see the 2 combined at a 2 day festival would bring in more people IMO.Of course I realize that's not what Glenn's intentions were for this fest,but if he wants to keep it going,and I believe he does,then maybe this is something to consider.What do the younger kids love to do at a metal concert??? Bang their heads to fast guitars.I'm pretty sure power and thrash can accomplish that.
Perhaps the Showcase on Thursday or the show on Wednesday should be dedicated to Prog.Just a thought from someone who obviously isn't a fan of Prog but doesn't want the fest to end either.I'm not trying to step on anybody's toes that loves Prog,just trying to help.

 

[J-Man]

There is another aspect to This Perfect Storm that is affecting not only Glenn and ProgPower but all metal tours and Festivals here in the US and that is :

John Feinberg. He has managed to drive up the prices for all bands that come over to the US and all bands from here that use him as an agent, he is the Scott Boras of the Music booking world.