I need help from fellow drummers.

I highly recommend Remo Clear Emperor's for the top and clear Ambassadors for the bottom.

Yes, these heads are very live and full of tone. I am sorry but, offensive over-rings is a result of improper tuning. It is a delicate balance to find the correct tonal pitch of each drum, the sweet-spot if you may. And it isn't always easy.

But there is no need for muffling if you listen to the drum and know which head to make adjustment's to. I have personally played in a variety of band's playing everything from 80's new wave to metal. And you can tune the drums to deliver exactly what you need.

I recenly lent my cheap $600.00 secondary Mapex kit to an old-school NY thrash band (with the heads I recommend), and the drummer and engineer had nothing but extreme praise for the dynamic and killer tone they produced (which I set-up by listening to the drums and making them speak properly with proper tuning).


You need decent mic's and a soundman who knows what the f*ck he is doing or your drum mix is going to suck no matter what. Try investing in a good tuning key that will dial your drum sound to within 95% of perfect pitch. Then you just need to be patient and finalize the tuning by listening for the pitch and ringin and knowing where to make those subtle changes. I have never used muffles or tape to correct bad drum tones or over-ringing.

Tuning drums is an art in and of itself, and it takes time and patience to locate that sweet sound your drum's want to deliver!

Good luck

Chris
www.jonoliva.net
 
Kong said:
You need decent mic's and a soundman who knows what the f*ck he is doing or your drum mix is going to suck no matter what. Try investing in a good tuning key that will dial your drum sound to within 95% of perfect pitch. Then you just need to be patient and finalize the tuning by listening for the pitch and ringin and knowing where to make those subtle changes. I have never used muffles or tape to correct bad drum tones or over-ringing.

Tuning drums is an art in and of itself, and it takes time and patience to locate that sweet sound your drum's want to deliver!

Good luck

Chris
www.jonoliva.net
Click to expand...

The Emps are the Remo equivalent to the Evans G2. Their good heads, just inconsistent in my observation, though not NEARLY as bad as the Pinstripes.

I understand what you say by perfect pitch and whatnot, but I don't see it that way. I see it, as, a drum has a sweet spot - if you want to find the true sweet spot, hit the shell and thats the note at which the drum resonates at the most. I don't even like to get that technical. I know how to tune a drum to my liking, and I usually tune to the sweet spot, not the perfect pitch, the perfect interval or what not, as my drums, when they hit thier respective sweet spots, sound sweet together. A drum key is a drum key in my eye, I dont use any torque wrenches or drum dials or anything like that, and I dont see the need to, when I can get the job done with some time and a good old fashioned drum key of ANY brand.

You definitely know your stuff though, and I respect that, not too many people around seem to have knowledge of how drums work, and how to maximize playability, most just bash away and hope for the best.
 
http://www.urinalcakemix.x-nr.net/Video/TJSolo160.mp3 Here you go! 7:39 of me going at it. 100% improv, I wasnt expecting to play as long as I did, but Im kinda glad I did. One of my better solos. Some hisses/pops here and there in the recording, makes the sound sputter a bit, couple spots it conveiniently makes me sound like I go WAY out of time =).

Enjoy it, give some feedback. Im pretty happy with how the mix sounds, I've been experimenting with new recording techniques, and I REALLY like this one!
 
Urinalcake?

Very, very nice indeed. Great chops and the kit sounds GREAT!

I am sure this was not a fancy drum mic set-up...and that is probably the reason it sounds so good. Our producer/Engineer taught me alot about recording and basically his philosophy is "less is more". The more mic's you use the smaller your drum sound is going to get because each mic is fighting for frequency space in the total sound spectrum. Bonham recorded most of Zepplin records with 6-8 mics tops and that is where his signature sound came from.

And thank you Edge for the nice compliment. Recording with the legend that is the Moutain King really brings out the creative juices. I could play much busier drum parts, but that would just defeat the purpose and the music.

Good work Uninalcake!

:headbang:
 
urinalcakemix said:
http://www.urinalcakemix.x-nr.net/Video/TJSolo160.mp3 Here you go! 7:39 of me going at it. 100% improv, I wasnt expecting to play as long as I did, but Im kinda glad I did. One of my better solos. Some hisses/pops here and there in the recording, makes the sound sputter a bit, couple spots it conveiniently makes me sound like I go WAY out of time =).

Enjoy it, give some feedback. Im pretty happy with how the mix sounds, I've been experimenting with new recording techniques, and I REALLY like this one!
Click to expand...



Very nice indeed! The kit sounds great and you have mad skills! :headbang:

BTW, I have entered retirement again after hearing that. I am not even sure why I really even bother playing. :erk:

What kind of china boy do you have? Or is that one I hear? It sounds great. Post a pic of that kit as well if you don't mind.
 
OKAY....This is a serious question and not some form of modesty. I understand that there are some people that have a natural ability to do "something". For example...

Stevie Ray- Guitar
Tigar Woods - Golf
Jordan - round ball
Gretski - hockey

You get the point. These types of people and many more have reached a level of their game that is not the "norm". Alright, I am sure that there are some people that are naturaly gifted at playing the drums but, there seems to be a whole lot of really good drummers out there. I will admit that my skills are sad compared to urinalcakes and many more drummers.

So my question is...........is playing the drums at a certain quality level ( I understand that the "quality level" thing is very subjective) a natural ability or is it something that with the right teaching and dedication that one could reach a certain playing level?

I suppose I look at it this way. Back in the day you had those stand out musicians that seemed to stand head and shoulders above the rest. On the topic of drums, that would have been Neil Pert IMO. Don't get me wrong, there were obvously some other very skilled guys back then like terry bozio, stewart copland and the sorts but it seemed that Pert was the top drawer. Now fast forward to today and you could pick just about any band that we talk about on this forum and they all have kick ass drummers. What gives? I have always felt that I had to work very hard just to do what I do and trust me, it is nothing even close to what Urinal played up above.

I often wondered if Neil got all the glory simply because the prog type music allowed him to show the chops more than non prog rock. Example....the dude that taught me ( Joe Raynor ) taught Frank Beard from ZZ TOP. That never really impressed me much as a kid because I did not really think at the time of Frank being a great or good drummer. Why? He wasn't Pert. Obviously now I understand that he is an excellent drummer and maybe I did not see him as one because the music they played did not lend itself to him being all flashy.

Anyway....forgive the babble........I am just amazed at all the talented drummers out there and I really have much respect and admiration for them. I believe you have to have somewhat of a natural gift to play well and I suppose I was not in that line when they were handing that out. Here are some links to a little back ground about my late and great teacher. The dude was money! RIP Mr Raynor!

http://www.freewebs.com/joeraynordrummerman/memories.htm
http://www.freewebs.com/joeraynordrummerman/heyjoe.htm

To hear some old clips of my playing with my old band back in the mid 80's, click here: http://www.myspace.com/houstonsscreamer There are 4 tracks off a 6 song demo we did back in 85.
 
Kong said:
Urinalcake?

Very, very nice indeed. Great chops and the kit sounds GREAT!

I am sure this was not a fancy drum mic set-up...and that is probably the reason it sounds so good. Our producer/Engineer taught me alot about recording and basically his philosophy is "less is more". The more mic's you use the smaller your drum sound is going to get because each mic is fighting for frequency space in the total sound spectrum. Bonham recorded most of Zepplin records with 6-8 mics tops and that is where his signature sound came from.

And thank you Edge for the nice compliment. Recording with the legend that is the Moutain King really brings out the creative juices. I could play much busier drum parts, but that would just defeat the purpose and the music.

Good work Uninalcake!

:headbang:
Click to expand...

Wow! Thanks for the kind words, its awesome to hear some positive feedback from a professional! Yes, I used a small mic setup: 3 tom mics, snare, hats, bass and 2 overheads. I play an 8 piece Mapex M-Birch with 9 cymbals, and the 2 toms that weren't even miced still came through very well. What I did was in Sonar Cakewalk, took those 8 tracks I recorded, and doubled it, making it 2x8 tracks = 16, and mixed them each a bit differently to blend them together. I found the double tracking gave a lot more balls, depth and meat to my drum sound, it was my first time trying this method, and I KNOW I found a new method of mixing my kit.
 
FatesFan said:
What kind of china boy do you have? Or is that one I hear? It sounds great. Post a pic of that kit as well if you don't mind.
Click to expand...

That is an 18" Wuhan China you are hearing. You know the Chinas at Sam Ash/Guitar Center that are like $10 for a 12". The bigger sizes are absolutely magical. Their hand hammered, so no two wuhan chinas will ever sound the same. If you go to the store, hit a few, you'll be sure to find one that sounds great!
 
It looks like those have remo pinstripes currently. I would go with remo ebony pinstripe heads for the toms and basses. Get a coated remo ambassador or pinstripe for the snare and a batter badge of some sorts.
 
For those who requested a picture of my kit here it is. Im experimenting with the angle of the ride, I'm not really liking the placement of it currently, I'm always changing little things here and there looking for something spicy. 2nd bass drum has been ordered in December, due in April! Can't Wait!

Mapex M-Birch:
Toms: 8x8, 10x9, 12x10, 14x14, 16x16
Snare: Pearl Steel Shell 14x6.5 , Tama StarClassic Maple 12x5
Bass: 20x18
Cymbals L > R:Zildjian: 80's Avedis Ride (used as alternate ride) 20" Sabian: 14" AAX Metal Hi-Hats, 9" MAX Splash, 16" AA Metal X crash, 18" AA Metal X Crash, 18" AAX Dark Crash, 20" AAX Metal Ride, 18" Wuhan China, (not pictured): 12" Wuhan China, 12" HHX Evolution splash

Rack: Pearl Icon 3 Sided Straight Bar Rack - THE BEST rack on the market today, HANDS DOWN

DeathMachine016.jpg
 
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