Is it a good idea to reamp keyboards?

[SimonTaddio_Qc]

I've been wondering if it would be a good idea to reamp keyboard's parts?
Should I record MIDI, or just the output of the keyboard in the audio interface? And then, what impedance should my signal be when it gets into the amp when I reamp it? is it the same as a guitar?

Thanks,

Simon

 

[Forceps]

Do both. Record MIDI and the original sound. When the performance is sloppy, quantize the performance and send the MIDI through the keyboards.
Oh, and you don't put keyboards through an amp to record them. Connect the outputs directly to your interface.

 

[Notuern]

Midi(For quantizing and stuff.), as for reamping through a guitar amp, that might NOT be good idea(as it may kill the elements.).

 

[DanLights]

yep, always keep the midis, you can "reamp" through the keyboard or some other keyboard or any vsti but reamping through an actual amp doesn´t sound like a good idea

 

[SimonTaddio_Qc]

Do both. Record MIDI and the original sound. When the performance is sloppy, quantize the performance and send the MIDI through the keyboards.
Oh, and you don't put keyboards through an amp to record them. Connect the outputs directly to your interface.

That's exactly what I do, but I find I'm having a real hard time mixing the keys almost on top of the mix, like, say, the band Adagio.
There's just not enough power in the strings sounds and the organ soungs when I record directly in the interface than when it's played through a PA or an amp, in rehersals...maybe I shouldn't have side-chained compressed the keys with the drums...

 

[JeffTD]

That's exactly what I do, but I find I'm having a real hard time mixing the keys almost on top of the mix, like, say, the band Adagio.
There's just not enough power in the strings sounds and the organ soungs when I record directly in the interface than when it's played through a PA or an amp, in rehersals...maybe I shouldn't have side-chained compressed the keys with the drums...

Sounds to me like you just need a better synth or to use softsynths?

 

[Notuern]

How the strings are composed makes a huge difference in how big it will sound in the end, and its not a small subject to get in to.
If it really is the sound that makes it sound to small, or not rich enough, then layering is the key.

But yeah, you might need a better synth/sampler/plugin to make it sound the way you want.

 

[ParsonsMatt]

...maybe I shouldn't have side-chained compressed the keys with the drums...

Why on earth would you do that :zombie:

 

[SimonTaddio_Qc]

well, I did it with all the rythm sections, with the kick drum, I should say...As of why...I don't know, it just sounds more alive to me, it just gives me a nice "oumph" to the kick...it's hard to put into words, lol

 

[SimonTaddio_Qc]

How the strings are composed makes a huge difference in how big it will sound in the end, and its not a small subject to get in to.
If it really is the sound that makes it sound to small, or not rich enough, then layering is the key.

But yeah, you might need a better synth/sampler/plugin to make it sound the way you want.

I don't think the synth is an issue here, we're working with a Yamaha S-90 that sounds pretty good to me.
We've got a 4-sound layer in the synth itself, so do you suggest just double tracking with the same 4 sounds, or just adding more and more different sounds to it?

 

[Forceps]

Different sounds, the same sounds only make everthing louder. And that's not what you need, you need more body in the sound.

 

[Loki Laufeyiarson]

First of all: if you think it will help your mix, you can always try it with an ampsim plug in. That way you can get an idea of the result and be sure nothing gets damaged.

If you really believe re-amping is the way to go, Carvin (used to) have some amps especially designed for keyboards. Don't know wether they are any good though, I only have experience with their guitars. Maybe some other brands have keyboard amps as well. Look around I'd say.

Another thing next to re-amping or layering you could do is using tube- or tape saturation. Could give some nice results as well.

 

[KillFrenzy]

How the strings are composed makes a huge difference in how big it will sound in the end, and its not a small subject to get in to.
If it really is the sound that makes it sound to small, or not rich enough, then layering is the key.

But yeah, you might need a better synth/sampler/plugin to make it sound the way you want.

+1 to all this.

S90 is a great synth, but maybe not enough as you just said in your fisrt post. Great for gigs, AMAZING piano, but I would definetly use some sample-based strings like EWQLSO, Symphobia, etc. And pay a lot of attention to the composition itself. As you mentioned Adagio and I'm a keyboard player, I must say Kevin Codfert is one of the best players out there. Not only execution-wise but mainly for his composition. Note that the symphonic lines are anythig but strings section alone. A lot of brass and all kinds of horns going on. Again on strings, try adding individual instruments and sections to the ensemble. Violins + violas + double bass are not the same as a 'strings ensemble' patch (although Symphobia's ensembles are beautiful).

 

[SimonTaddio_Qc]

+1 to all this.

S90 is a great synth, but maybe not enough as you just said in your fisrt post. Great for gigs, AMAZING piano, but I would definetly use some sample-based strings like EWQLSO, Symphobia, etc. And pay a lot of attention to the composition itself. As you mentioned Adagio and I'm a keyboard player, I must say Kevin Codfert is one of the best players out there. Not only execution-wise but mainly for his composition. Note that the symphonic lines are anythig but strings section alone. A lot of brass and all kinds of horns going on. Again on strings, try adding individual instruments and sections to the ensemble. Violins + violas + double bass are not the same as a 'strings ensemble' patch (although Symphobia's ensembles are beautiful).

Yes, I think you just made me realize that it's gonna cost me even more money to make that damn record! lolllll

But yeah, I've been messing around with Miroslav Philarmonic a bit, too, and I'll check out Symphobia for sure, too!

Another thing next to re-amping or layering you could do is using tube- or tape saturation. Could give some nice results as well.

I'll go give it a try right now, as I'm getting just ready to get in Pro Tools...:Smug:


Thank you all, I'll keep you updated on this!

 

[KillFrenzy]

Yes, I think you just made me realize that it's gonna cost me even more money to make that damn record! lolllll

But yeah, I've been messing around with Miroslav Philarmonic a bit, too, and I'll check out Symphobia for sure, too!




I'll go give it a try right now, as I'm getting just ready to get in Pro Tools...:Smug:


Thank you all, I'll keep you updated on this!

Maybe not. Try messing around with the S90 first. All the layering thing I said. If it works, then it will probably work even (a lot) better with VSTis like Symphobia. Personally I think Miroslav is a little thin sounding.

Good luck!

 

[::XeS::]

I have a question about keyboard recording... If I have to record a key with crappy sounds, I record the midi signal and I use the good plugins I have. But how can the band replicate the album sound in a live situation? It's not my problem of course, but someone could say "hey, we wanna use the same sound live, so we use the keyboard sound"..

 

[Forceps]

Hmm, that's a tough one... they could play with clicktrack and use that particular part on a guide. But I think a better idea is to invest in a better synth.

 

[preampdude]

The term "reamping keyboards" is totally Beavis and Butt-head like, you can't dumb it down any further. And yes you should always record in midi, people have been doing that since the mid 80s.

 

[KillFrenzy]

I have a question about keyboard recording... If I have to record a key with crappy sounds, I record the midi signal and I use the good plugins I have. But how can the band replicate the album sound in a live situation? It's not my problem of course, but someone could say "hey, we wanna use the same sound live, so we use the keyboard sound"..

Getting a good keyboard will most of the time take 'em there. If it doesn't, a VSTi-based setup will.

 

[SimonTaddio_Qc]

The term "reamping keyboards" is totally Beavis and Butt-head like, you can't dumb it down any further. And yes you should always record in midi, people have been doing that since the mid 80s.

I meant "is it a good idea to record keyboard through an amp [as well as recording MIDI too, but I know that already], and also, what is the input impedance of a keyboard amp, so that I don't blow up my amp trying to reamp it" but thought it was a bit long for a thread title.


And aside from that, I think the S90 has some kind of "slave" mode with MIDI so that it can just play MIDI data from an external source with it's own sounds.