just when you think the Great White thing couldnt get any worse

[Yetti]

great white going on with their tour, courtesy of the opeth board

 

[alanbirdsell]

Maybe he's trying to raise money for the lawyers he's gonna need and get a last bit of touring in before he goes to jail. Just a thought.

 

[Keyser Soze]

I think that report comes from Blabbermouth... who have been known to be rather "unreliable" at times... remember the "Magesty of Gaia" incident? I never liked Great White, but I'd give them the benefit of the doubt first... But... if this is true... :ugh:

Edited - wow, I just read that... damn!

 

[alanbirdsell]

I just saw Great White's attorny on Good Morning America and he said the band is a mess and that they haven't slept much since the incident. So, either the story is false or Jack has gone psychotic from lack of sleep or... the attorney is laying. But that would never happen...

 

[Melisan]

Someone suggested the band may be legally obliged, since they could have been paid in advance for some of the shows. There might be some arm twisting going on.

 

[Bruce Chickinson]

NO NO NO...you can get out of contracts easily when something like this happens......

Sure they will owe money if their guarantees were paid for half in advance but come on....WHAT VENUE REALLY WANTS THEM NOW???

If I were a venue I'd PAY to have them stay away.

 

[SauceyJack]

aw-Brucie, thats a bit harsh, unless it is proven that the band itself used the pyros without permission.
im not a big G.W fan, well not at all really, but i dare say their world is a living hell right now, guilty or not.
politics and rock doesnt mix, but sadly law-suites and misery go hand in hand-
but to lay the blame at someones feet, without the full facts cant be right, can it?

 

[Melisan]

Blabbermouth had a piece saying GW denied the rumor, that they are not on the road. Given the condition Jack was in in recent interviews, I don't know how he could perform.

You know, I'll bet you in a morbid way, if they toured, the turnout would triple. People are weird.

 

[Yetti]

Originally posted by Bruce Chickinson
If I were a venue I'd PAY to have them stay away.

I think I'd do the same, any band that will risk the lives of their fans just to have some sparkly things and kabooms and whatnot should never be allowed to play in front of an audience. EVER

 

[alanbirdsell]

Originally posted by Bruce Chickinson
NO NO NO...you can get out of contracts easily when something like this happens......

Sure they will owe money if their guarantees were paid for half in advance but come on....WHAT VENUE REALLY WANTS THEM NOW???

If I were a venue I'd PAY to have them stay away.

Jen, how do you really feel?

 

[SauceyJack]

'any band that risks their audience'..

im getting fed-up with saying this now,..but again, has it been proven whos fault the tragedy was?
and if your gunna accuse bands that use 'sparkly and kaboom' things, of putting lives at risk, well that doesnt leave many bands left to see Live does it?
hmm, no Iron Maiden for 1.

so, i hope you have loads of 'fun', sat at home in your armchair Mr Yetti..maybe you could hire a good DVD of the Live after Death gig, but make sure you close your dainty eyes when the stage show kicks off, i wouldnt want you falling onto the carpet and getting a carpet burn.

 

[sparky2112]

There is a little more reliable info on the tour on the news links on AOL Instant Messenger. There will be no more tour. Bottom line, no matter how big of a band you once WERE(and for the record, I do like Great White), 2 facts exist: First, no one should ever use Pyrotechnics in a club setting. And second, if you are not as famous as you used to be, scale down the show and just play your music.

 

[Soul of a new Machine]

pyros are dangerous, no matter how big the venue, and they put smoke everywhere wich makes me cough and irritate my eyes.

 

[smylex]

Originally posted by SauceyJack
'any band that risks their audience'..

im getting fed-up with saying this now,..but again, has it been proven whos fault the tragedy was?
and if your gunna accuse bands that use 'sparkly and kaboom' things, of putting lives at risk, well that doesnt leave many bands left to see Live does it?
hmm, no Iron Maiden for 1.

so, i hope you have loads of 'fun', sat at home in your armchair Mr Yetti..maybe you could hire a good DVD of the Live after Death gig, but make sure you close your dainty eyes when the stage show kicks off, i wouldnt want you falling onto the carpet and getting a carpet burn.

Let's take a look at something. First, it was Great White's pyro that ignited the blaze. Whoever it was who set up the unit (REGARDLESS if they HAD permission or NOT) set the thing up too close to the walls of the stage. Also, the sparks on the "gerbs" were not cooled down sufficiently to be hitting the sound insulation. Had they had a licensed pyrotechnician as part of their road crew, they would have known not to use this kind of thing in a club the size of The Station.

Next, there is a very real possibility that the club's management may have given verbal permission to the band to use their pyro, despite the fact that the club was not permitted to have it. The club has given permission to other bands to use pyro as was proven on Dateline NBC when they ran a videotape of the Kiss tribute band, Hotter Than Hell setting off pyro and their Gene Simmons impersonator blowing fireballs in The Station as part of their act. Other acts have come forward with videotape of their bands setting off pyro in the club as well. Did they stop the bands from using the stuff? It sure seems like they were too busy counting the money they were making from the alcohol sales to bother stopping the band that is entertaining their over-capacity limit crowd. (Hell, look at the Great White show. Maximum Capacity for the venue: 300. Fatalities: 97. Injuries: 180. Uninjured: about 60. Do the math.)

Now, I don't know about you, but I can appreciate a band that can actually do a show without having to resort to using stuff like pyro. Granted, the pyro's nice, but if your band is good enough, you don't need it. The props and whatnot are merely icing on the cake. Does Iron Maiden need pyro? No, they've proven that on tour countless times. So have many other bands and artists that I've seen live. Broaden your horizons. I've seen Diamanda Galas tear up the stage using just a piano and a microphone in a club that holds 500 to seeing Metallica's performance cause a riot in front of 82,000 in Los Angeles...both shows without pyro!

Also, these arena acts that you are speaking about that have the pyro also have TRAINED PROFFESIONALS working for them to make sure that they're not setting the buildings that they're playing in on fire! They've also made sure that they've cleared everything with the local fire marshalls the day of the show, fire trucks and trained personnel are standing by and that fire extinguishers are placed every few feet in case something does fuck up. Did Great White have these proffesionals doing the same thing? Apparently not. If they had, 97 people would probably still be alive now and their families and loved ones would
not be mourning their deaths.

For more on this story, visit:

http://www.knac.com/article.asp?ArticleID=1816
http://www.knac.com/article.asp?ArticleID=1815
http://www.knac.com/article.asp?ArticleID=1804
http://www.knac.com/article.asp?ArticleID=1807
http://www.knac.com/article.asp?ArticleID=1813
http://www.knac.com/article.asp?ArticleID=1809
http://www.knac.com/article.asp?ArticleID=1810

 

[CT]

Originally posted by smylex
... to seeing Metallica's performance cause a riot in front of 82,000 in Los Angeles...both shows without pyro!

As I recall, James found himself standing in the wrong spot at one show had his arm burned up by a flash-pot. Think that was the last of the pyro for them.

 

[alanbirdsell]

Originally posted by CT
As I recall, James found himself standing in the wrong spot at one show had his arm burned up by a flash-pot. Think that was the last of the pyro for them.

Uh, nope it wasn't...

 

[alanbirdsell]

Originally posted by smylex
The club has given permission to other bands to use pyro as was proven on Dateline NBC when they ran a videotape of the Kiss tribute band, Hotter Than Hell setting off pyro and their Gene Simmons impersonator blowing fireballs in The Station as part of their act.

I'm going to see them tomorrow night here in Spokane, so we shall see if they are hotter than hell. After the Great White incident our local fire chief said that pyro is illegal in any venue here. This is interesting because Metallica used a shitload of it for their Cunning Stunts show here. The venue I am going to see Hotter Than Hell in is Fat Tuesdays. This coincedently is where I wanted to see the Maidens get booked if they came back to Spokane. I'll let you know how it turned out... if I survive

 

[CT]

Originally posted by alanbirdsell
Uh, nope it wasn't...

Hmmm. Gave up on them quite a while ago. Guess it shows. But it is frightening to think that whoever flicked the switch didn't even make sure all the band members were out of the way. It's a risky situation, licensed techs/readily available fire extinguishers/flame retardant sound proofing or not.

Gee, wondering how I survived all those WASP shows at the Troubador in the early/mid eighties. Yikes.

 

[Bruce Chickinson]

I may sound harsh.

I have a BA in Theatre Arts from Cal State Long Beach where we were taught of the dangers and safety issues of on stage weapons and fire / lighting effects. We were taught that we as show-men and stage managers were responsible for the safety of the audience.

Is the person guilty of murder when he yells FIRE in a theatre and people are killed? We were taught YES and to take audience safety very seriously.

Is the person guilty when as a result of his or her negligence they cause the death of people because of the show they are responsible for orchestating?

I was taught YES.

That is why I sound harsh.

I still can't get over the individual who died while driving home from one of our shows. I feel responsible eventhough many people have told me not to...the bottom line is...I am responsible for this show and if we had not played that night ...for whatever reason...that person would most likely still be alive.

Just like if the RI concert in question had not taken place, the outcome would have been different.

But who knows....maybe it was just putting off the inevitable and the next time HOTTER THAN HELL or some other pyro band came...the same thing would have happened only with a different crowd.

I do sound bitter. I am bitter. I was torn to pieces when I heard about this incident knowing that it could have been prevented and should have been prevented.

It's possible that the band was misinformed about GERBS. I was. I thought they burnt COLD only and there was no heat at all and they didn't qualify as PYRO because they burned cold when maybe that was just a marketing term to sell more GERBS. Maybe the band was under the impression that since they burn cold, they aren't PYRO and the club okayed it also thinking that it's the safe kind of effect since it doesn't burn hot and maybe something went horribly wrong with the type of spark ....that just happened to hit the nearby sound insulation.

That's a question that has been nagging at me. These same GERBS land on the pro wrestlers all the time...almost designed to do that so they look like they could be burning but they are really cold.

I also have some inside info though that I can't share in a public forum....

That's all I'll say on that...

Next topic please?????

 

[alanbirdsell]

See above.... AMEN!