Mesa recto help pls???

[DemolitionX]

Hey folks, only made a few posts here so do please excuse my being so forward on the whole thing. That and working 200 hours a day doesn't usually help the matter either.

Anyway, I got this Mesa dual recto amp, happy with the lead tone, clean even! But rhythm is still a bit off ever so slightly. I would like to actually find a way of getting the mid frequency on the amp EQ to sit up at a higher level without obviously spending heaps of dollars on more gear. Below is my gear and the settings I'm using. The mid range tends to sit a bit too low and I need to bump it somewhere between the 1.8 to 3k ranges.

Gear Chain.....
Guitar ------> Boss SD1 overdrive pedal ------> Mesa dual recto solo head with 6L6 tubes

Set up.........
Guitar: EMG 81 bridge, 85 in the neck - using bridge pick up for rhythm
Pedal: Level 12 o clock, Tone 10 o clock, drive 9 o clock
Amp: Bold power/silicon diodes, channel 3 in modern/red mode, Presence 8-9 o clock, master 11 o clock, gain 12-1 o clock (12 most of the time), Bass 11:30, mid 10 o clock and treble 11:30 again.

I'm finding that the mid range frequency sits around the 1 to 2k area and need to move it up to about the 1.8 to 3k area. I've worked on this amp for aaaaaaaaaaages trying to get it like it is and still finding it boomy cos of the crap room I'm in, which I can fix but the mid just doesn't sit the way I want it too.

Any help is most greatly appreciated by anybody.

Thanks
- Rick

 

[Metaltastic]

Hmm, sounds like you've got it dialed in pretty well, and you're using an SD1 - all I can suggest really is to try the amber channel in all the modes (Vintage I think would work best), that might shift the mids up a bit, as well as dropping in EL34's into the power section. If that doesn't do it, I can't think of much else! Oh, but what cab are you using?

 

[Manicompression]

yeah dude, metaltastic is dead on, if you arent happy with the modern channel boosted with the sd-1 than you should try using the vintage setting for rythms, I actually like that sound quite a bit and despite its vintage designation it really nails alot of metal sounds from the recent, and seems more widley applicable. however, I dont like boosting under that setting much. And again, as Metaltastic said the 6l6's that come with it stock are associated with that low mid "thunk" , you should try el34s which are more commonly associated with that brighter british sound. there is a sight called eurotubes that has lots of usefull tube recommendations for the dual solo. Your settings as seem pretty good as well, however i usually have the drive at 7, the level almost cranked and the tone at 2 (o clock postions) on the modern setting. I also have the mid at 12 and the treb at 1 on the amp.

 

[Morgan138]

Have you tried putting some kind of EQ in the effects loop? Maybe a simple parametric, which would allow you to dial in a boost or cut at exactly the frequency you're looking for. There are a bunch of Boss RPQ-10s on ebay (1/2 rack unit with 2 bands plus input and output gain) that shouldn't be too expensive to try out.

 

[DemolitionX]

Hrmmm...... I was thinking about doing a few things given that the amp is dialled in fine.

Metaltastic: I got a V30 speaker cab and using an SM57 straight on just a little off the centre of the dustcap. Even listening to it in the room doesn't allow me to move away from the 'darker' sounding mid range and up into the brighter ones. I did try the mode in vintage and it sounds like it's really really boxy and cardboardy. The mid range sits even lower in vintage mode, around the 800hz region and is just really bad for that. The tone is pretty full still but not to my liking.

I also find I can't crank the master on red mode much past 11 o clock as when I switch to my lead sound on channel 2 vintage mode, that can come up even quieter in volume which I definitely don't want.

The other thing I was thinking which was what Morgan suggested. Get en EQ but my fx loop is set to channel 2 as I have a DD3 in there for my lead tone. Given that the loop runs in series, makes it too hard to do what I want there. I would like it if an EQ pedal only worked on channel 3 full time and none of the others as I'm happy the way they are. Other thing would be to try out some different pedals like a modded tube screamer or Maxon 808 or something like that to try and see what that does for me. Or, alternatively use external switching with a midi controlled fx eq of some sort.

I'm not too keen on changing tubes all around either to be honest. I'll post a sound clip shortly of what I got coming out of it and see if anybody out there can tell me what I could do to make it more gooderrer.

Cheers and thanks for the help!

 

[viggen666]

it's just the voicing of the amp, i don't think there much to do about it.
recto is great, but not if you want a high mid voicing.

changing to el34 might change it a bit, but don't expect miracles here.

 

[Ermz]

I'd beg to differ. Listen to the Dual Recto tone on Chaosphere, or the Cab/speaker comparison clips Andy did. Plenty of high mid to be had. It's just about helping the amp. The Recto is an amp that, by itself, can be very flabby and fizzy. With some EQ and overdrive tightening it can live up to its potential. It's not as straightforward as dialing a Peavey.

 

[Metaltastic]

I'd beg to differ. Listen to the Dual Recto tone on Chaosphere, or the Cab/speaker comparison clips Andy did.

Also Devin Townsend Band - Synchestra, and I think Accelerated Evolution as well, the tones on those are like a 5150 with more awesome bite IMO.

 

[LSD-Studio]

... or the Cab/speaker comparison clips Andy did.

didn't kow those were Recto

 

[beyond dead]

what mic are you using? mic position, choice of mic and preamp are to blame if you cant get a nice tight bite out of a dual recto with an sd1!!! i use maxon 808 or zw od on the amber channel, with modern voicing, silicone diodes with the variac set to bold and the tone is perfect for a wide range of different tones with little tweaking.

try throwing a condenser in the mix, and experiment with other mic positions.
andy stated that he still had the original tubes in his recto and his sound is

 

[DemolitionX]

I'm using an SM57 straight in front of the cab. It's just off to the side of the dustcap slightly. Pretty common technique to use, alot of great recordings have used these sorts of settings and managed to pull that high mid up nicely. As Ermin said, it definitely is not as straight forward to dial in as a 5150. It's kinda got me stumped how I have dialled it in quite well, yet I seem to not be able to get the tone it should make. Very bizarre indeed. The only other condensor I got here is a Rode NT2A which is obviously used for vocals and I don't think it would help much.

There has to be a way to do it and it definitely isn't the pedal which is making it sound like that. Even without the pedal, those frequencies are still there but just muddier and more boomy. I did try dialling in more presence initially but all it did was create a harsher tone overall and somewhat masked the lower type mid signal I was getting. The amp is being a monster headache for me but I just gotta keep trying. I wish they just had a 'good' knob on them. It could be like this: "Do you want to make sound better?" Select YES or NO. Got me why nobody has thought of that yet anyway with all the gizmos and gadgets around these days.