My guitar sounds like crap!!! HELP!!!

[owatariryo]

I've tried IRs, Nick Crow's master pieces, EQing, Panning,,,, but the result is still far from everyone else here.(I have to say you guys rock! and I suck..)
Yours are just like the sound in CDs, full and 3D while mine is flat and 2D...

I never had a chance to listen to someone else's just DI-ed sound
so I recorded a clip of my own DI guitar and hope someone can point out what my problem is.

#1 http://www.badongo.com/audio/17018273
#2 http://www.badongo.com/audio/17018288

Here's the chain:
Ibanez PGM300->Grace Design m101's Hi-Z in->ECHO Audiofire2->DAW
(clip#1 unprocessed, clip#2 with ampsim, EQed)

 

[kladdkaka]

i would recommend getting dropbox for uploading your files...this is a real hassle

 

[kladdkaka]

As far as the tone I quite like it, but then again don't really know what you're going for. Think its lacking some lows maybe

 

[ahjteam]

- Do you only have one take or have you doubled or quadtracked your guitars?
- Do you have bass guitar in the mix?
- Do you have drums in the mix?

 

[owatariryo]

Well my tone really sucks when comparing to what I'm after:http://recabi.net/site/media/

I don't know is it because of my skill or something else..

 

[owatariryo]

- Do you only have one take or have you doubled or quadtracked your guitars?
- Do you have bass guitar in the mix?
- Do you have drums in the mix?

http://www.badongo.com/audio/17018707 (Sorry Dropbox is downloading 34%..)

Here's a mix, but I really suck at mixing...

 

[ahjteam]

Here is a quick example of my quadtracked clip:

http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/1338211/howto_wallofsound.mp3

1: gtr, left 100%
2: gtr, right 100%
3: gtr, left 80%
4: gtr, right 80%
5: bass, center
6: drums
7: the whole mix

 

[owatariryo]

In my mix above I track 2 guitars and panned them 100% L-R, and I use Spectrasonics Trilogy for bass (well don't know if a real bass will help..), for the drum I use BFD or superior2.0 (cant remeber..)..

Well I found that my mixes sound flat and 2D and small compared to other ppl's. And I'm here to find out why.. check Recabinet's demo songs and you'll get what I mean.

My workflow is simple:
Guitar: PGM300->Grace m101's DI->Nick Crow's Ampsim&Kefir->EQ->Panning
Bass: Trilogy->comp or EQ or distortion or none
Drum: S2.0 or BFD->Tweak and tuning->comp&EQ->Group in one track and put Waves api2500 and Send Reverb on it
Master: Waves api2500->Sonnox EQ(mastering mode)

Anything wrong with that?? Should I change the PU of my GT?

 

[Yhanthlei]

In my mix above I track 2 guitars and panned them 100% L-R, and I use Spectrasonics Trilogy for bass (well don't know if a real bass will help..), for the drum I use BFD or superior2.0 (cant remeber..)..

Well I found that my mixes sound flat and 2D and small compared to other ppl's. And I'm here to find out why.. check Recabinet's demo songs and you'll get what I mean.

My workflow is simple:
Guitar: PGM300->Grace m101's DI->Nick Crow's Ampsim&Kefir->EQ->Panning
Bass: Trilogy->comp or EQ or distortion or none
Drum: S2.0 or BFD->Tweak and tuning->comp&EQ->Group in one track and put Waves api2500 and Send Reverb on it
Master: Waves api2500->Sonnox EQ(mastering mode)

Anything wrong with that?? Should I change the PU of my GT?

I'm sorry mate, but this has piracy written all over it

nvmd.

 

[myownsilence]

Why has it got piracy written all over it?

 

[ahjteam]

In my mix above I track 2 guitars and panned them 100% L-R, and I use Spectrasonics Trilogy for bass (well don't know if a real bass will help..), for the drum I use BFD or superior2.0 (cant remeber..)..

Well I found that my mixes sound flat and 2D and small compared to other ppl's. And I'm here to find out why.. check Recabinet's demo songs and you'll get what I mean.

My workflow is simple:
Guitar: PGM300->Grace m101's DI->Nick Crow's Ampsim&Kefir->EQ->Panning
Bass: Trilogy->comp or EQ or distortion or none
Drum: S2.0 or BFD->Tweak and tuning->comp&EQ->Group in one track and put Waves api2500 and Send Reverb on it
Master: Waves api2500->Sonnox EQ(mastering mode)

Anything wrong with that?? Should I change the PU of my GT?

Well this is the one that has a lot of unknown factors, for example if we just take the guitar under the scope:

We got the info that it is Ibanez PGM300 and according to google images that has three pickups, but:


- Can you get a decent tone that you like with a real amp using this guitar?
- Are they stock pickups or have you replaced them? are they active or passive and how they sound in general?
- which pickup do you use? Are you using bridge, neck or the single coil in the middle?
- How much do you have the volume knobs open and do you use the tone controls?
- What tuning is your guitar in and how heavy strings are you using?
- How hot do you record them to the DAW? Where do the peaks hit?
- What settings are you using in the amp&cabsim, what impulses and what eq settings


And last and not least:
- what is your aim with the tone? its just shooting in the dark if we don't know what your goal is.


PS: I personally like a real bass guitar over a synth. Just a personal opinion.

 

[Yhanthlei]

Why has it got piracy written all over it?

Well, he isn't sure if he used SD.2 or BFD, meaning he has it both, and can't remember which one he used

+Waves Api series

No offense if you did actually buy those, but this was my initial thought

 

[owatariryo]

- Can you get a decent tone that you like with a real amp using this guitar?

Yes to 90s' style solo and no to modern hi-gain, too bright and unfocused..

- Are they stock pickups or have you replaced them? are they active or passive and how they sound in general?
- which pickup do you use? Are you using bridge, neck or the single coil in the middle?

They are stock Dimarzio PAF Pro PUs in both bridge and neck(I used bridge for this clip), I didn't replace them.

- How much do you have the volume knobs open and do you use the tone controls?

Full volume and this guitar has no tone controls.

- What tuning is your guitar in and how heavy strings are you using?

Drop C# and the strings are 10-46

- How hot do you record them to the DAW? Where do the peaks hit?

Well I turn my DI up near the limit, and so my interface's line-in. the peaks in DAW of my guitar track was at about 1.5.

- What settings are you using in the amp&cabsim, what impulses and what eq settings

I use Nick Crow's 8505 and Kefir with GuitarHack's mesa trad quad edge impulse, EQ is an api560 with a hat shape curve, and cut a little around 1khz.

And last and not least:
- what is your aim with the tone? its just shooting in the dark if we don't know what your goal is.

Well I think it's not about the tone itself but the quality of the mix's sound. I dunno how to describe it but it seems that every track in my mix sounds so flat, 2D, vivid and no matter how I did like boosting or cuttng EQ, compressing, panning, adding reverb... It just don't sound as 3D as other ppl's work (recabinet's user demo for example). I know I am too noob and still have much to learn but I'm eager to know where and how to improve. Sorry for not being clear enough.

Well, he isn't sure if he used SD.2 or BFD, meaning he has it both, and can't remember which one he used

+Waves Api series

No offense if you did actually buy those, but this was my initial thought

Don't worry bro, I bought them with my studio partner, and S2.0 + Trilogy + Waves api bundle were 2nd hand, BFD2 was borrowed periodly from my friend(that's why I'm not sure which sampler it was). Sonnox is a 15-days DEMO and it has 0 days left now...

 

[Yhanthlei]

Now that I actually listened to your clip, I'd say the guitars sound a bit thin...
Maybe use a different IR? Catharsis' Awesometime Fredman could work better.
And 10-46 is too light for C# IMO



And sorry for suspecting you

 

[owatariryo]

I've fixed it and here's the newer version, compressed less than the former but still:
1) guitar=> no shape, vivid
2) bass=> no shape
3) drum=> no shape, vivid
4) toatal=> no shape, not real, 2D..

Can't figure out why..

 

[Jinko17]

I've fixed it and here's the newer version, compressed less than the former but still:
1) guitar=> no shape, vivid
2) bass=> no shape
3) drum=> no shape, vivid
4) toatal=> no shape, not real, 2D..

Can't figure out why..

how? what did you do? Thats a drastic change

 

[ahjteam]

btw, what are your monitors or do you mix with headphones?

Well I think it's not about the tone itself but the quality of the mix's sound. I dunno how to describe it but it seems that every track in my mix sounds so flat, 2D, vivid and no matter how I did like boosting or cuttng EQ, compressing, panning, adding reverb... It just don't sound as 3D as other ppl's work (recabinet's user demo for example). I know I am too noob and still have much to learn but I'm eager to know where and how to improve. Sorry for not being clear enough.

The bass guitar plays a big role in getting the guitars sound huge, but try this: grab this ampsim and this cabsim (or use Kefir) and this multiband compressor (or the Waves C4) and this distortion plugin

Then what you do is put them in your daw in that this order:

- Knucklehead (turn on the treblemaster feature for hi-gain sound)
- Our Cabinet Simulator or Kefir (use the ones that sounds best to you)

Then route them to a bus/group where you will have

- EQ (any will do) put a highpass filter at 90hz and lowpass filter at 10khz, nothing else
- GMulti. Use the default settings, but deactivate the mid and top bands by putting ratio to 1:1, stereowidening to 100% and level to 0dB. Then set the low band frequency and threshold so that you get less the low boom from palm mutes, it is usually around 100-180hz.

The quadtrack (four takes) and then pan them L100%, R100%, L80%, R80%.

For the L100% and L80% use the same settings on the preamp, for the R80% and R100% use the same settings, but different from the ones on the left. For example I used these kind of settings myself (hollow body guitar in drop C tuning with passive stock humbuckers and old strings) in this clip

Then use the camelcrusher and eq for the bass

 

[owatariryo]

how? what did you do? Thats a drastic change

I turned down the ratio of compression... Is the change really that shocking :zombie:?? Better or worse?

btw, what are your monitors or do you mix with headphones?

With sucky headphone

Thanks for the input! I will try them later!(After I really figured out the methods you provided )

BTW I found something strange about my DI sound.... my guitar sound relatively thin and small to other's. I guess that's why no matter how I tweak it just doesnt sound good??? I mean do you guys get fuller dry signals than mine when tracking thru DI? If so then why?? As I said I use Hi-Z input on my grace m101, and it ain't cheap and should not suck at DI right? Or is the power of my house making this as I'm living in a 40 yrs old apartment??? Does power affect equipment's performance that much???

 

[mick thompson]

Don't worry bro, I bought them with my studio partner, and S2.0 + Trilogy + Waves api bundle were 2nd hand, BFD2 was borrowed periodly from my friend(that's why I'm not sure which sampler it was). Sonnox is a 15-days DEMO and it has 0 days left now...

wow Yhanthlei he really kicked u in the teeth there!

 

[ahjteam]

With sucky headphone

This might be the main problem, my mixes sounded like total shite when I was using bad headphones and bad monitors

Thanks for the input! I will try them later!(After I really figured out the methods you provided )

BTW I found something strange about my DI sound.... my guitar sound relatively thin and small to other's. I guess that's why no matter how I tweak it just doesnt sound good??? I mean do you guys get fuller dry signals than mine when tracking thru DI? If so then why?? As I said I use Hi-Z input on my grace m101, and it ain't cheap and should not suck at DI right? Or is the power of my house making this as I'm living in a 40 yrs old apartment??? Does power affect equipment's performance that much???

If you can get yourself a DI-box, try to use it and see if you get better results with ground lift engaged