SteveSaks: Hi Neil its SteveSaks from LivingForMetal.com Thanks for taking time to talk with us here, I really appreciate it. I was actually at the Roseland Ballroom show in August of 84 that you played at with Anthrax and was wondering what are some of your memories about that show and period of time in your career?
Neil Turbin: Wow , thats amazing that you were there at that show. We just killed. We just broke the cherry on that place...haha, Let me re- phrase that...I would say that we fucked that place as hard as it could be fucked. We were the first metal band that had ever been in that place, you know it was a historic place.
SS: Yeah , I know. That was the first time I was ever there to see a concert.
NT: Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers had famous moments at Roseland. It was just a weird vibe. I was walking around before sound check and there was tension in the band.
The management company of the band had it in for me...Making threats towards me when we played in Canada, I mean life and death threats. You know I was taking vitamins because they werent feeding us properly, I mean if we stopped at a Dennys that was the highlight of the trip.
We werent getting paid... it was bare bones. I didnt have the kind of support system where people were just throwing money at me. You gotta do what you gotta do, But thats how it was for bands, especially if you have a management company thats putting money somewhere else. I mean they were selling merchandise and stuff but I guess it was more important to pay for peoples habits than to take care of the band...to have a proper place to eat or sleep. I mean Im not trying to say something negative, Im just being honest you know? I just dont care if they dont like it...fuck em. But the reality is thats the way that they did me. It was like the whole organization against Neil Turbin...It wasnt just the band.
SS: I dont know why? Cos me and my friends were huge Anthrax fans back then and really liked your vocals and heavy style as well on Fistful Of Metal. So we were confused when all of that went down, because we really liked you...It just seemed personal to me kinda.
NT: Well they really tried to gloss over it, But thats fine with me. That was actually the best day in my life...the moment that I had the opportunity to leave Anthrax.
I mean these were people that were not nice...not the nicest people I could think of on the planet. Im not trying to sat anything bad about the band, but it was the best day of my life...a day of freedom, a day of being free of oppression, because thats what was in the band. I wasnt somebody who was gonna follow orders, you know? Im just not. I have ideas, I have input and I have values. Although Im the front man of the band they really craved the attention. For me I was apart of the team. I believed their was strength in the team, I believe in the team...But thats not what other people believed. They believed in themselves coming first, and the management kinda set it up that way too.
I was excluded from a lot of interviews...I mean they brought someone else over seas(Ian) to do all the promotion, so it kinda became this thing with Jonny Z(band mgr.) and Scott.
So they basically tried to push me out of the picture basically and they didnt wanna hear what I had to say. I mean I asked him for a long time When am I gonna see some kind of money, anything . I mean the album was already out for six months, I was asking him You must have re-cooped something by now, youre selling out shirts...weve been on the road touring, weve been selling out places...Cant I get 100 bucks? Cant I get 200 bucks? You know what I got? A bunch of excuses. So it wasnt going in a good place with the band. So at that point they just needed to get someone who was gonna take orders...and it wasnt gonna be me.
SS: How did you feel when you finally left Anthrax and maybe thinking about what could have been?
NT: I was glad to be out of it. I already did what I did and wrote what I wrote, and played a lot of places...And yeah it could have gone a lot further. And it would have gone in a heavier direction, it wouldnt have been sobouncy or so fluffy or so goofy...with me still singing it would have been Harder, Angrier, Faster and Meaner and all of the elements of what I was about on the first album Fistful .
SS: What are some of your memories and experiences recording your first album with Anthrax - Fistful Of Metal?
NT: Fistful Of Metal was quite an ordeal cause we had one idea in mind... and the best laid plans of are mice and men, as they say..John Steinbeck. We had planned to record the album where Metallica had recorded their first album Kill Em All and we actually went to that studio called Music America , and it was in Rochester New York.
So basically we were up there in Rochester for like 3 nights on a basement floor while the studio was being re modeled, and you know how that goes with the contractors?...they said it would take a day or two but now were there going on a week, And we said this is fucking nuts and we got tired of sleeping on the floor and it was freezing cold up there, I mean really cold so we were staying in the studio at that time. So then we finally got to stay in this persons house for a night or two...I mean they were really nice, they were cooking us dinner, and you can just imagine a bunch of fuckin kids up there coping with shit, pretty much the whole band was up there.
SS: Wow, that must have been something?
NT: Yeah, The idea was we were gonna do the rhythm tracks first and the band was gonna play through the songs and then we were gonna come back, but man it was such a fiasco...to really think about it.
SS: Sounds like it...haha
NT: And then we ended up going to this little studio that we checked out, and that studio was just not happening. So after that experience we were up there and they were making calls and I guess Carl Canedy got involved.
SS: Oh, he got involved after you already started recording Fistful? I didnt know that?
NT: Yeah, so the other studio wasnt making it so then we ended up going to Pyramid in Up State New York in Ithaca, so it was kinda a trek from where we were, quite a drive to get there. So we finally get there to Pyramid... so fuckin horses, Tarzan and all that bullshit in this town, and it was a nice place going through Ithaca and Courtland where Ronnie Dio is from and also Doug Finestein of The Rods... He took me to his log cabin when I was up there that he built, Really cool dude, nice guy and down to earth.
SS: Sounds like you had a few nice memories?
NT: There just wasnt a love affair, It wasnt a match made in heaven...more like a match made in hell. You have these guys who were under minding me like every fucking moment. They were plotting the whole time. There was a lot of turmoil in that band. I think trust and respect dont come for free...theyre earned. And those were the things that didnt exist for the band that might be in question...So thats pretty simple...without trust and respect you aint got shit, especially in a relationship with someone. So once that trust and respect is gone the equivalent to that is divorce and its an ugly one...so its too bad.
One thing is that Scott and Charlie made all the decisions , and its kinda funny the thing with Dan Lilker is hes kinda blaming me for his reason being out of the band. Its like Oprah says you can come out of denial now or later but if it takes you 30 takes to play an Alice Cooper song, I mean he could play the busy shit..it was unbelievable so by the time we got to do the vocals we had 2 days to do the vocals on the album. It was terrible. I needed more time to do it right...It was a compromise, the vocals on Fistful Of Metal were compromised because we had to Jam Fuck the vocals cause we had to rush them.
SS: I always wondered whats the beginning intro effect right before Deathriders kicks in?
NT: If I tell ya...Ill have to kill you.
SS: HaHa Do a lot of people ask you that question?
NT: No, But Ill tell you cause your cool people...Basically we took a 24 track reel of the band and Chris Bubacz the engineer basically rewound the tape. Its not like playing a tape on your home stereo , you hear whats on the tape and while its moving, so instead of rewinding or fast forwarding ...youre hearing all of that stuff cos its 24 tracks without any artifacts. So its basically the band playing then reversed real quickly on the tape.
SS: Thanks I always wondered what that sound was.
NT: Yeah we were innovative with that stuff like that. Like Scott wanted to do Im Eighteen... He insisted on it. I wanted to do an AC/DC cover instead. They were always shooting down my ideas. So it surprised me that they came out with the name of the album Armed and Dangerous, the name of the song that was my idea?
SS: I wanna talk about your last album Threatcon Delta a little. What was your idea and inspiration behind it? And how did you get to the point where you saidOK Im back and I want to put out a Metal album again ?
NT: The Threatcon Delta was something that evolved, it wasnt just something like Great I want to put out an album It was something that I wanted to put out an album, whether it was a band or an album that represented me. So that was the idea to put out an album that represents me. And it wasnt so much to try to do a solo project...but really the album became what it is because I didnt have a band, it wasnt something of an organic process. It was something like Hey we believe that Neil has got to get back out there. We negotiated with Metal mayhem first then some other folks got involved, and became pretty much of lets say it didnt do anything to sell cds...But some people really like it, and it brought me back to the point where, yes Im back on the radar screen. We played some really cool festivals with Testament, Motorhead, Primal Fear .and different festivals around the globe.
SS: Well I was glad to see you back again, like many of your fans were as well. When I heard the first song Cut To The Chase I was surprised at how heavy it was, what a great opener.
NT: Well thanks man, I appreciate that
SS: Any new shows coming up for your new band Deathriders?
NT: Well yeah were doing the Sweden Rock festival in June. And as you said the band is now called Deathriders..
SS: Are you recording the new album now?
NT: Yeah, I have a recording studio, its state of the art . Im learning pro tools and working with a great engineer. So Im not working on anyones clock. So if they think its coming out next week...its not, But its not gonna be any Guns n Roses experience either, were not looking to take too long. But its got to have enough songs, gotta have good songs, really good songs...everything be right there. The thing is like I said before about Threatcon Delta, that it wasnt an organic album...Well whats an organic album? Well whats organic...you get an egg that a duck or chick lays or a fuckin penguin, and you raise it and you nurture it and bring it to a point where it can evolve organically, you know you just dont force fuck it...Just dont try to write an album in 2 weeks. There are bands that do that and do it well, But I dont go down that route. I think if you rush , the lyrics wouldnt be as good , and the song quality too.
SS: Who is in Deathriders?
NT: On guitar we have Kurt James, a brilliant guitar player, I met him when I auditioned for Driver with Rudy Sarzo and Tommy Aldridge and he was playing guitar back then here in LA, you know we were in our 20's with Hollywood and the Rainbow and the Sunset strip.
SS: Ive never been out there.
NT: You gotta come out here sometime, its still a great place, still got the same people running it and their great people and its a fun place, but the scene is not what is use to be...its pretty hard to re capture something, kinda like the 69 Mets.
SS: Yeah, What Ive noticed with Metal even during the early Anthrax days to the late 80's it was special before the internet was available. When an album came out it was special. Theres some good bands out their now, but I think the luster has worn out. The scene in general is less full of surprise and excitement like it was back then, for example its like when I was young I had to wait for Christmas morning to open my presents...But these days they open their presents Christmas eve, theres no anticipation and excitement like there was in the beginning.
NT: Youre absolutely right, I think you hit the nail on the head.
SS: We appreciated things ...Like buying a new album and holding it our hands and reading the lyrics...Like I have tons of cds and I think to myself..Jesus if I sold all of them I could probably buy a car with the money I spent on them. And these days they can get everything online, I think many take music for granted..
NT: Its a whole new world, I usually dont look at it that way, but I appreciate you pointing it out that way. They do take things for granted. They got Ebay, if I mean before you couldnt fuckin find certain albums or something that was rare. Youd have to come across it at a record store.
SS: Yeah like Bleeker Bobs in NYC.
NT: Well yeah. Id go there and say OK Im gonna get these 10 albums, and then Im gonna come back when I get more money and get these 10 next, maybe pick up a Kerrang or Metal Forces or Kick Ass Monthly magazine too.
SS: Or Sledgehammer Press?
NT: Yeah, Sledgehammer Press that too.
SS: Yes thats how it was back then in the Metal scene. What highlights did you have after that era performing in your career? After you moved on from Anthrax?
NT: Well what was exciting for my career, of course would have been great to put out product, but I was playing with Claude Schnell from Dio. And Claude is basically a concert pianist inside of a rock band. What you heard him play with Dio is great like Egypt The Chians are on, All the fools sailed away. But that wasnt what he was capable of, I mean what a brilliant fucking player. I played some stuff with him for 3 or 4 years. I was singing some very Broadway-esque, very operatic type of material, very classical influence. Some Elton John type melodies, very elegantly melodic. It was elegant in how it was well written like Meatloaf kinda.
SS: Like a musical Journey...
NT: Yes a musical trip, an adventure...like Kansas. It started at point A and ended up at point S. It was unique cos we worked off of point counter point type melodies.
The reason I bring that up is because a lot of people dont know that about me. Claude was a Juliard music student. It was me and Claude working in a big room with a marble floor and a Steinway piano. The guy from Anthrax or whatever you want to call me..singing over a grand piano
SS: I never knew that
NT: Its about as far from the picture of a thrash metal person that youd expect, but very musical. And you gotta be able to hold your ground, If its just you and a fuckin piano...you better be able to hold your fuckin water man! Or well see the pee stains flowing out.
SS: haha, damn
NT: No fuckin bullshit, and that had a genuine impact on me and what it brought out of me. My grandmother was a Soprano, and when I use to go over there I would hear the classical music. My grandfather played the Mandolin, so it was a natural course of progress. So where I find myself today is a very progressive neo classical meets thrash kind of world..
SS: What are some of your influences as a singer?
NT: For me Im a singer and Ive been listening to singers for awhile . And we know Luciano Pavarotti and Enrico Caruso...Caruso was the first fuckin Metal guy, that guy was a mother fucker back in old days. You know who else is also Metal? Christina Aguilera...I mean her vocal delivery is like a 45 caliber bullet. She may be a little blonde thing that weighs 98 pounds, but her delivery is intense.
SS: How do you write lyrics for your songs, do you have a lyric book or something you write them down in? Whats your method?
NT: Not really, I think its good to have a piece of paper with a pencil or pen...a lot of paper...and a lot of things crossed out or changed or written over, cos sometimes youre looking for the right word and you havent hit it yet. So basically just pen and a lot of pieces of paper.
SS: I noticed youre great coming up with lyrics, its obvious you put a lot of thought into the them, theyre very clever and tongue and cheek.
NT: Thank you
SS: What are some of the song titles on the new album youre working on now?
NT: Well since your bringing that up I might have to play you one of my songs I did here in my studio, and you can tell me what you think? Cos talk is cheap and actions matter. I guess the problem with me is that Im too honest in my interviews, like what do I have to hide?
SS: Did you write these new songs on guitar as well? Or were they vocal melodies?
NT: I write it all man. Guitar parts, vocal melodies, drum patterns.
Back to the other guys in the band, Beau Simpson on guitar along with Gene McEwen on drums & Shaun Hill on bass. Me and Beau have been bouncing ideas of each other, weve written a lot of our songs in MIDI, I sing the melody, we work out the drum patterns and the guitar and its transcribed like a music book you buy in a store. So after we have a complete song in MIDI, Ill work on lyrics and vocals to that, like Ill have an idea already ..like the song Im gonna play you Riders Of The Apocalypse so you can get an idea of how it sounds...its over the phone but you can get an idea of what the new album A Fate Worse Than Death will sound like. (Plays songs over phone...which to me sounds like the strongest and best vocals and melodies I have ever heard from him...hands down..Killer, epic power Metal with soaring vocals)
SS: Wow, thanks Neil...That was excellent. I can tell it was really worked on a lot. It was very heavy and almost epic sounding. The vocals lines and melodies were very catchy and the strongest Ive heard from you thus far.
NT: Hey, Thanks man.
SS: Is that how the rest of the new album is gonna sound too? It sounds much more mature than Threatcon Delta.
NT: Yeah I agree, it was built from the ground floor. Its all ideas that we had the ability to nurture. Some deep meanings to these songs and the album. And when its all together and done it will definitely be the best thing Ive ever done. I know people say that all the time, But this ones really ground floor with the input to make it happen.
SS: Well from hearing the song Riders Of The Apocalypse I can tell you really crafted and worked on it alot...any idea when it will be out? I know you are not rushing it?
NT: Thank you, I would like it to be out in 2006, were already halfway through almost so maybe early 2007...But it would nice to get it out in 2006.
SS: How did you feel the response and feedback was for Threatcon Delta?
NT: Like I said it got me back on the radar screen, But I think people are judgemental and are quick to judge and even though after I read your review and your take on it seemed like you had an open mind. I thought what really impressed me the most is that you really approached it with an open mind and I thought after speaking with you on this interview thats what really impressed me the most... that you really approached it with an open mind, and you really covered a lot of areas, you know?..youre not just saying Oh youre so wonderful and you sing so great..youre hitting all those high notes
SS: HaHa
NT: Youre not trying to bullshit me, and Im not trying to bullshit you. Its very cut and dry here and were just talking about things that might be of interest to people
SS: Yeah I agree with you.
NT: Im just sticking with what I believe and Im not saying what I think people wanna hear
SS: Youre not candy coating it
NT: As far as Threatcon Delta. It was an opportunity to get back me back out there, re establish my presence , these days with the internet I did it without a publicist and without a band. I just like to go out there a play live with other Metal bands and have fun for people who can appreciate it. Were not having a contest...There are so many great Metal bands , whats the point of trying to compete...Like who can run the fastest?
SS: I think it should be like Italian food...you know?..If you like it , you can never have too much of it.
NT: Exactly, youre right and thats a better way to look at it. I just wish more people would look at it and appreciate it that way.
Well since 2003 I put my own solo band together and it evolved into Deathriders. And now in 2006 Ive kept it going for awhile now. Thats the key, survival. If someone notices thats cool, and if they dont well thats alright too. Yeah its nice to be appreciated for what you do. I just need to be true to myself.
SS: I understand exactly what you mean, you have to live with yourself...
NT: Yeah, and for me I want to be able to play Live like I do on the record and sound believable. And thats exactly where Im coming from, so things havent changed really.
My deliverys gonna be Fierce, my execution is gonna be Fierce. And thats what is in my heart...Just Fierce. When I get up on stage I just wanna be Fierce...and maybe thats a good name for a song Fierce haha.
SS: Would you say the new album is heavier and more fierce than Threatcon Delta?
NT: Without a doubt, yes. Without a doubt. I was demonstrating some different aspects with what I can do with Threatcon Delta, and I think that accomplished that. It wasnt an album that was widely distributed. So its still kind of hard to get album..but its out there.
SS: How many songs do you plan to have on your new album A Fate Worse Than Death?
NT: Well its gonna be an album thats gonna have 12 - 15 tracks. What were doing is building the strongest ones, you know? Anything thats not the strongest ones will be moved to the side..It doesnt matter how far in or how far long it is, well use it for spare parts at that point. Im gonna put out an album thats gonna stand up and people are gonna hear that. And if they dont like me then they dont have to like me...But if they like my stuff I did in the past well they definitely wont be disappointed. Because this will be stronger than any previous songs I have ever done before, theres a few songs that Ive written that people will say How can you write something stronger than that?... Well you know what? Youd be surprised.
SS: I cant wait to hear the rest of it.
NT: Well like youve heard the song Riders of the Apocalypse...The delivery of the actual guitar and drums..Those are parts that I wrote. Its not like I can only write some words. Some people wanna portray it like Oh this guy can only write a few lyrics. Well actually with Armed and Dangerous they tried to say that I wrote additional lyrics. No I didnt write additional lyrics, I wrote all the lyrics. I wrote all the Melodies...Someone might have changed one word or something, so they said Oh he wrote additional lyrics..But thats the business that we are in. The people that have the money have the power and are in control...Those are the people that are gonna tell you how they want you to see it.
SS: I know exactly what you mean, and trust me a lot of people are smart enough to read between the lines.
NT: And thats what A Fate Worse Than Death will be. It will be a new level of intensity for people who are fans of Fistful, in terms of drumming and in terms of the vocals and a song writing standpoint, another strong song people seem to like from it is Angry World too...thats a standout track . Well if youre looking for Fistful Of Metal 2 , Well maybe that will happen at some point, But this wont be it. But this will definitely be my best yet. Its a new world order, for sure.
SS: Sounds great Neil, Just a few more questions... Name a favorite concert youve been to recently?
NT: Last year I went to a lot of great shows, but probably one of the best was Iron Maiden at OzzFest . Because Maiden withstood all of that bullshit that Sharon Osbourne pulled. It was a disgusting display, I dont have anything to prove and I have no ones ass to kiss and Im not afraid of her money or nothing. I mean I respect Ozzy and I think Sharon is a shrewd business person...Lets not confuse that, shes a very sharp lady...But I think it was disgusting to treat people like that...to order people to throw eggs.
SS: How many eggs did they throw at Iron Maiden?
NT: Like they had a fucking hen house out in back. They kept hitting Bruce Dickinson, they kept hitting Jannick Gers, they kept hitting Nicko McBrain, Dave Murray, Adrian Smith & Steve Harris. They were all being pelted.
They impressed me with their professionalism. They would have played if those were bullets instead of eggs. They would have kept playing. I mean these guys had that look on their faces like they were fucking marching for the Queen of England. There was nobody that was gonna stand in their way. I just respect them deeply for that. Most human beings would have folded, they would have got mad, they would have reacted...These guys didnt even break a sweat, They didnt break stride. What ever Bruce Dickinson said or done to Sharon Osbourne???doesnt warrant this...She showed how low of the person she is...it was disgusting.
SS: Yes that was a sad day for Metal, I agree. I always wondered have you ever met Joey Belladonna ?
NT: One time in the elevator at the attorneys in New York. I guess Scott brought him in to show me likeLook who I got type of thing, The problem with Scott is he just didnt communicate.
Another time was at a show here in California with a friend of mine and Im in the lounge area, and Joey kept looking over like every 2 seconds it was really weird. So one of the promoters said wait here Ill go get Joey etc. ... Well he wouldnt come out to meet me, she said to me that Joey said he doesnt wanna come out to meet you because it might confuse the fans??
SS: Was this when he was back in Anthrax?
NT: No before, it was a few years ago. So whatever floats your boat, but thats fuckin bullshit...But you know what it didnt hurt my feelings or anything. I would have of just said Hey, whats up? I was just surprised he couldnt be a man, he couldnt be a man and shake my hand and go how you doin man? maybe he was intimidated because he wasnt in Anthrax at the time, who knows? I was just gonna be courteous . Its like when you hold the door for the person you know or dont give a fuck about or you can take that door and slam it in their fuckin face. And Im from New York so I have no problem slamming the door in someones face if they deserve it...Its just a common fuckin courtesy .
SS: I know what you mean. One last thing... If its the year 2009. And its the 25th anniversary of Fistful Of Metal . Any chance if you were approached would you play again at Roseland Ballroom again...for a reunion show of sorts?
NT: Id say keep dreaming
SS: Thats what I thought, I was just curious though.
NT: Im not really interested to be honest...what for? nostalgia? to make money? Im not desperate to make money or to work with people that are less than respectful or courteous people. I choose not to be around people like that...simple as that.
SS: Thanks Neil for the taking the time to talk with us here at LivingForMetal.com . I really look forward to your new album and look forward to seeing you live very soon as well.
NT: Well thanks , But I just think that your cool people Steve...for someone whos been to the Roseland show just blows me away.
SS: Yeah it was a great show and memory, Ill definitely catch you guys when you come back to New York.
NT: What was your highlight of the Roseland show?
SS: I think Just seeing you guys storm the stage and head bang to Deathriders which was my favorite song at the time. There was such an electricity in the air that night.
NT: It was great that particular night.
SS: Well it was a New York crowd for sure, everyone there wanted to see Anthrax really.
NT: I just thought that we killed. All I can say is that at that point in time that was the pinnacle...That was like the best show the band had ever done, and it was kinda weird to me that they already had it planned out with management, it wasnt just the band but management too. The management was tired of me asking for money and eventually they stopped taking my calls, anyways thats a sad story, But thats life... thats the way it goes.
All I can say is that I have control over my destiny at this point and Im working on my own songs and not having people that want to put their agenda in front of the music. Anyone who wants to put their agenda in front of the music better get out of the way cos theyll get run over haha.
Alright brother.
SS: Ok thank you Neil I appreciate it, thanks for your time
NT: Take care
SS: You too buddy
NT: Have a good night.
Neil Turbin: Wow , thats amazing that you were there at that show. We just killed. We just broke the cherry on that place...haha, Let me re- phrase that...I would say that we fucked that place as hard as it could be fucked. We were the first metal band that had ever been in that place, you know it was a historic place.
SS: Yeah , I know. That was the first time I was ever there to see a concert.
NT: Fred Astaire and Ginger Rogers had famous moments at Roseland. It was just a weird vibe. I was walking around before sound check and there was tension in the band.
The management company of the band had it in for me...Making threats towards me when we played in Canada, I mean life and death threats. You know I was taking vitamins because they werent feeding us properly, I mean if we stopped at a Dennys that was the highlight of the trip.
We werent getting paid... it was bare bones. I didnt have the kind of support system where people were just throwing money at me. You gotta do what you gotta do, But thats how it was for bands, especially if you have a management company thats putting money somewhere else. I mean they were selling merchandise and stuff but I guess it was more important to pay for peoples habits than to take care of the band...to have a proper place to eat or sleep. I mean Im not trying to say something negative, Im just being honest you know? I just dont care if they dont like it...fuck em. But the reality is thats the way that they did me. It was like the whole organization against Neil Turbin...It wasnt just the band.
SS: I dont know why? Cos me and my friends were huge Anthrax fans back then and really liked your vocals and heavy style as well on Fistful Of Metal. So we were confused when all of that went down, because we really liked you...It just seemed personal to me kinda.
NT: Well they really tried to gloss over it, But thats fine with me. That was actually the best day in my life...the moment that I had the opportunity to leave Anthrax.
I mean these were people that were not nice...not the nicest people I could think of on the planet. Im not trying to sat anything bad about the band, but it was the best day of my life...a day of freedom, a day of being free of oppression, because thats what was in the band. I wasnt somebody who was gonna follow orders, you know? Im just not. I have ideas, I have input and I have values. Although Im the front man of the band they really craved the attention. For me I was apart of the team. I believed their was strength in the team, I believe in the team...But thats not what other people believed. They believed in themselves coming first, and the management kinda set it up that way too.
I was excluded from a lot of interviews...I mean they brought someone else over seas(Ian) to do all the promotion, so it kinda became this thing with Jonny Z(band mgr.) and Scott.
So they basically tried to push me out of the picture basically and they didnt wanna hear what I had to say. I mean I asked him for a long time When am I gonna see some kind of money, anything . I mean the album was already out for six months, I was asking him You must have re-cooped something by now, youre selling out shirts...weve been on the road touring, weve been selling out places...Cant I get 100 bucks? Cant I get 200 bucks? You know what I got? A bunch of excuses. So it wasnt going in a good place with the band. So at that point they just needed to get someone who was gonna take orders...and it wasnt gonna be me.
SS: How did you feel when you finally left Anthrax and maybe thinking about what could have been?
NT: I was glad to be out of it. I already did what I did and wrote what I wrote, and played a lot of places...And yeah it could have gone a lot further. And it would have gone in a heavier direction, it wouldnt have been sobouncy or so fluffy or so goofy...with me still singing it would have been Harder, Angrier, Faster and Meaner and all of the elements of what I was about on the first album Fistful .
SS: What are some of your memories and experiences recording your first album with Anthrax - Fistful Of Metal?
NT: Fistful Of Metal was quite an ordeal cause we had one idea in mind... and the best laid plans of are mice and men, as they say..John Steinbeck. We had planned to record the album where Metallica had recorded their first album Kill Em All and we actually went to that studio called Music America , and it was in Rochester New York.
So basically we were up there in Rochester for like 3 nights on a basement floor while the studio was being re modeled, and you know how that goes with the contractors?...they said it would take a day or two but now were there going on a week, And we said this is fucking nuts and we got tired of sleeping on the floor and it was freezing cold up there, I mean really cold so we were staying in the studio at that time. So then we finally got to stay in this persons house for a night or two...I mean they were really nice, they were cooking us dinner, and you can just imagine a bunch of fuckin kids up there coping with shit, pretty much the whole band was up there.
SS: Wow, that must have been something?
NT: Yeah, The idea was we were gonna do the rhythm tracks first and the band was gonna play through the songs and then we were gonna come back, but man it was such a fiasco...to really think about it.
SS: Sounds like it...haha
NT: And then we ended up going to this little studio that we checked out, and that studio was just not happening. So after that experience we were up there and they were making calls and I guess Carl Canedy got involved.
SS: Oh, he got involved after you already started recording Fistful? I didnt know that?
NT: Yeah, so the other studio wasnt making it so then we ended up going to Pyramid in Up State New York in Ithaca, so it was kinda a trek from where we were, quite a drive to get there. So we finally get there to Pyramid... so fuckin horses, Tarzan and all that bullshit in this town, and it was a nice place going through Ithaca and Courtland where Ronnie Dio is from and also Doug Finestein of The Rods... He took me to his log cabin when I was up there that he built, Really cool dude, nice guy and down to earth.
SS: Sounds like you had a few nice memories?
NT: There just wasnt a love affair, It wasnt a match made in heaven...more like a match made in hell. You have these guys who were under minding me like every fucking moment. They were plotting the whole time. There was a lot of turmoil in that band. I think trust and respect dont come for free...theyre earned. And those were the things that didnt exist for the band that might be in question...So thats pretty simple...without trust and respect you aint got shit, especially in a relationship with someone. So once that trust and respect is gone the equivalent to that is divorce and its an ugly one...so its too bad.
One thing is that Scott and Charlie made all the decisions , and its kinda funny the thing with Dan Lilker is hes kinda blaming me for his reason being out of the band. Its like Oprah says you can come out of denial now or later but if it takes you 30 takes to play an Alice Cooper song, I mean he could play the busy shit..it was unbelievable so by the time we got to do the vocals we had 2 days to do the vocals on the album. It was terrible. I needed more time to do it right...It was a compromise, the vocals on Fistful Of Metal were compromised because we had to Jam Fuck the vocals cause we had to rush them.
SS: I always wondered whats the beginning intro effect right before Deathriders kicks in?
NT: If I tell ya...Ill have to kill you.
SS: HaHa Do a lot of people ask you that question?
NT: No, But Ill tell you cause your cool people...Basically we took a 24 track reel of the band and Chris Bubacz the engineer basically rewound the tape. Its not like playing a tape on your home stereo , you hear whats on the tape and while its moving, so instead of rewinding or fast forwarding ...youre hearing all of that stuff cos its 24 tracks without any artifacts. So its basically the band playing then reversed real quickly on the tape.
SS: Thanks I always wondered what that sound was.
NT: Yeah we were innovative with that stuff like that. Like Scott wanted to do Im Eighteen... He insisted on it. I wanted to do an AC/DC cover instead. They were always shooting down my ideas. So it surprised me that they came out with the name of the album Armed and Dangerous, the name of the song that was my idea?
SS: I wanna talk about your last album Threatcon Delta a little. What was your idea and inspiration behind it? And how did you get to the point where you saidOK Im back and I want to put out a Metal album again ?
NT: The Threatcon Delta was something that evolved, it wasnt just something like Great I want to put out an album It was something that I wanted to put out an album, whether it was a band or an album that represented me. So that was the idea to put out an album that represents me. And it wasnt so much to try to do a solo project...but really the album became what it is because I didnt have a band, it wasnt something of an organic process. It was something like Hey we believe that Neil has got to get back out there. We negotiated with Metal mayhem first then some other folks got involved, and became pretty much of lets say it didnt do anything to sell cds...But some people really like it, and it brought me back to the point where, yes Im back on the radar screen. We played some really cool festivals with Testament, Motorhead, Primal Fear .and different festivals around the globe.
SS: Well I was glad to see you back again, like many of your fans were as well. When I heard the first song Cut To The Chase I was surprised at how heavy it was, what a great opener.
NT: Well thanks man, I appreciate that
SS: Any new shows coming up for your new band Deathriders?
NT: Well yeah were doing the Sweden Rock festival in June. And as you said the band is now called Deathriders..
SS: Are you recording the new album now?
NT: Yeah, I have a recording studio, its state of the art . Im learning pro tools and working with a great engineer. So Im not working on anyones clock. So if they think its coming out next week...its not, But its not gonna be any Guns n Roses experience either, were not looking to take too long. But its got to have enough songs, gotta have good songs, really good songs...everything be right there. The thing is like I said before about Threatcon Delta, that it wasnt an organic album...Well whats an organic album? Well whats organic...you get an egg that a duck or chick lays or a fuckin penguin, and you raise it and you nurture it and bring it to a point where it can evolve organically, you know you just dont force fuck it...Just dont try to write an album in 2 weeks. There are bands that do that and do it well, But I dont go down that route. I think if you rush , the lyrics wouldnt be as good , and the song quality too.
SS: Who is in Deathriders?
NT: On guitar we have Kurt James, a brilliant guitar player, I met him when I auditioned for Driver with Rudy Sarzo and Tommy Aldridge and he was playing guitar back then here in LA, you know we were in our 20's with Hollywood and the Rainbow and the Sunset strip.
SS: Ive never been out there.
NT: You gotta come out here sometime, its still a great place, still got the same people running it and their great people and its a fun place, but the scene is not what is use to be...its pretty hard to re capture something, kinda like the 69 Mets.
SS: Yeah, What Ive noticed with Metal even during the early Anthrax days to the late 80's it was special before the internet was available. When an album came out it was special. Theres some good bands out their now, but I think the luster has worn out. The scene in general is less full of surprise and excitement like it was back then, for example its like when I was young I had to wait for Christmas morning to open my presents...But these days they open their presents Christmas eve, theres no anticipation and excitement like there was in the beginning.
NT: Youre absolutely right, I think you hit the nail on the head.
SS: We appreciated things ...Like buying a new album and holding it our hands and reading the lyrics...Like I have tons of cds and I think to myself..Jesus if I sold all of them I could probably buy a car with the money I spent on them. And these days they can get everything online, I think many take music for granted..
NT: Its a whole new world, I usually dont look at it that way, but I appreciate you pointing it out that way. They do take things for granted. They got Ebay, if I mean before you couldnt fuckin find certain albums or something that was rare. Youd have to come across it at a record store.
SS: Yeah like Bleeker Bobs in NYC.
NT: Well yeah. Id go there and say OK Im gonna get these 10 albums, and then Im gonna come back when I get more money and get these 10 next, maybe pick up a Kerrang or Metal Forces or Kick Ass Monthly magazine too.
SS: Or Sledgehammer Press?
NT: Yeah, Sledgehammer Press that too.
SS: Yes thats how it was back then in the Metal scene. What highlights did you have after that era performing in your career? After you moved on from Anthrax?
NT: Well what was exciting for my career, of course would have been great to put out product, but I was playing with Claude Schnell from Dio. And Claude is basically a concert pianist inside of a rock band. What you heard him play with Dio is great like Egypt The Chians are on, All the fools sailed away. But that wasnt what he was capable of, I mean what a brilliant fucking player. I played some stuff with him for 3 or 4 years. I was singing some very Broadway-esque, very operatic type of material, very classical influence. Some Elton John type melodies, very elegantly melodic. It was elegant in how it was well written like Meatloaf kinda.
SS: Like a musical Journey...
NT: Yes a musical trip, an adventure...like Kansas. It started at point A and ended up at point S. It was unique cos we worked off of point counter point type melodies.
The reason I bring that up is because a lot of people dont know that about me. Claude was a Juliard music student. It was me and Claude working in a big room with a marble floor and a Steinway piano. The guy from Anthrax or whatever you want to call me..singing over a grand piano
SS: I never knew that
NT: Its about as far from the picture of a thrash metal person that youd expect, but very musical. And you gotta be able to hold your ground, If its just you and a fuckin piano...you better be able to hold your fuckin water man! Or well see the pee stains flowing out.
SS: haha, damn
NT: No fuckin bullshit, and that had a genuine impact on me and what it brought out of me. My grandmother was a Soprano, and when I use to go over there I would hear the classical music. My grandfather played the Mandolin, so it was a natural course of progress. So where I find myself today is a very progressive neo classical meets thrash kind of world..
SS: What are some of your influences as a singer?
NT: For me Im a singer and Ive been listening to singers for awhile . And we know Luciano Pavarotti and Enrico Caruso...Caruso was the first fuckin Metal guy, that guy was a mother fucker back in old days. You know who else is also Metal? Christina Aguilera...I mean her vocal delivery is like a 45 caliber bullet. She may be a little blonde thing that weighs 98 pounds, but her delivery is intense.
SS: How do you write lyrics for your songs, do you have a lyric book or something you write them down in? Whats your method?
NT: Not really, I think its good to have a piece of paper with a pencil or pen...a lot of paper...and a lot of things crossed out or changed or written over, cos sometimes youre looking for the right word and you havent hit it yet. So basically just pen and a lot of pieces of paper.
SS: I noticed youre great coming up with lyrics, its obvious you put a lot of thought into the them, theyre very clever and tongue and cheek.
NT: Thank you
SS: What are some of the song titles on the new album youre working on now?
NT: Well since your bringing that up I might have to play you one of my songs I did here in my studio, and you can tell me what you think? Cos talk is cheap and actions matter. I guess the problem with me is that Im too honest in my interviews, like what do I have to hide?
SS: Did you write these new songs on guitar as well? Or were they vocal melodies?
NT: I write it all man. Guitar parts, vocal melodies, drum patterns.
Back to the other guys in the band, Beau Simpson on guitar along with Gene McEwen on drums & Shaun Hill on bass. Me and Beau have been bouncing ideas of each other, weve written a lot of our songs in MIDI, I sing the melody, we work out the drum patterns and the guitar and its transcribed like a music book you buy in a store. So after we have a complete song in MIDI, Ill work on lyrics and vocals to that, like Ill have an idea already ..like the song Im gonna play you Riders Of The Apocalypse so you can get an idea of how it sounds...its over the phone but you can get an idea of what the new album A Fate Worse Than Death will sound like. (Plays songs over phone...which to me sounds like the strongest and best vocals and melodies I have ever heard from him...hands down..Killer, epic power Metal with soaring vocals)
SS: Wow, thanks Neil...That was excellent. I can tell it was really worked on a lot. It was very heavy and almost epic sounding. The vocals lines and melodies were very catchy and the strongest Ive heard from you thus far.
NT: Hey, Thanks man.
SS: Is that how the rest of the new album is gonna sound too? It sounds much more mature than Threatcon Delta.
NT: Yeah I agree, it was built from the ground floor. Its all ideas that we had the ability to nurture. Some deep meanings to these songs and the album. And when its all together and done it will definitely be the best thing Ive ever done. I know people say that all the time, But this ones really ground floor with the input to make it happen.
SS: Well from hearing the song Riders Of The Apocalypse I can tell you really crafted and worked on it alot...any idea when it will be out? I know you are not rushing it?
NT: Thank you, I would like it to be out in 2006, were already halfway through almost so maybe early 2007...But it would nice to get it out in 2006.
SS: How did you feel the response and feedback was for Threatcon Delta?
NT: Like I said it got me back on the radar screen, But I think people are judgemental and are quick to judge and even though after I read your review and your take on it seemed like you had an open mind. I thought what really impressed me the most is that you really approached it with an open mind and I thought after speaking with you on this interview thats what really impressed me the most... that you really approached it with an open mind, and you really covered a lot of areas, you know?..youre not just saying Oh youre so wonderful and you sing so great..youre hitting all those high notes
SS: HaHa
NT: Youre not trying to bullshit me, and Im not trying to bullshit you. Its very cut and dry here and were just talking about things that might be of interest to people
SS: Yeah I agree with you.
NT: Im just sticking with what I believe and Im not saying what I think people wanna hear
SS: Youre not candy coating it
NT: As far as Threatcon Delta. It was an opportunity to get back me back out there, re establish my presence , these days with the internet I did it without a publicist and without a band. I just like to go out there a play live with other Metal bands and have fun for people who can appreciate it. Were not having a contest...There are so many great Metal bands , whats the point of trying to compete...Like who can run the fastest?
SS: I think it should be like Italian food...you know?..If you like it , you can never have too much of it.
NT: Exactly, youre right and thats a better way to look at it. I just wish more people would look at it and appreciate it that way.
Well since 2003 I put my own solo band together and it evolved into Deathriders. And now in 2006 Ive kept it going for awhile now. Thats the key, survival. If someone notices thats cool, and if they dont well thats alright too. Yeah its nice to be appreciated for what you do. I just need to be true to myself.
SS: I understand exactly what you mean, you have to live with yourself...
NT: Yeah, and for me I want to be able to play Live like I do on the record and sound believable. And thats exactly where Im coming from, so things havent changed really.
My deliverys gonna be Fierce, my execution is gonna be Fierce. And thats what is in my heart...Just Fierce. When I get up on stage I just wanna be Fierce...and maybe thats a good name for a song Fierce haha.
SS: Would you say the new album is heavier and more fierce than Threatcon Delta?
NT: Without a doubt, yes. Without a doubt. I was demonstrating some different aspects with what I can do with Threatcon Delta, and I think that accomplished that. It wasnt an album that was widely distributed. So its still kind of hard to get album..but its out there.
SS: How many songs do you plan to have on your new album A Fate Worse Than Death?
NT: Well its gonna be an album thats gonna have 12 - 15 tracks. What were doing is building the strongest ones, you know? Anything thats not the strongest ones will be moved to the side..It doesnt matter how far in or how far long it is, well use it for spare parts at that point. Im gonna put out an album thats gonna stand up and people are gonna hear that. And if they dont like me then they dont have to like me...But if they like my stuff I did in the past well they definitely wont be disappointed. Because this will be stronger than any previous songs I have ever done before, theres a few songs that Ive written that people will say How can you write something stronger than that?... Well you know what? Youd be surprised.
SS: I cant wait to hear the rest of it.
NT: Well like youve heard the song Riders of the Apocalypse...The delivery of the actual guitar and drums..Those are parts that I wrote. Its not like I can only write some words. Some people wanna portray it like Oh this guy can only write a few lyrics. Well actually with Armed and Dangerous they tried to say that I wrote additional lyrics. No I didnt write additional lyrics, I wrote all the lyrics. I wrote all the Melodies...Someone might have changed one word or something, so they said Oh he wrote additional lyrics..But thats the business that we are in. The people that have the money have the power and are in control...Those are the people that are gonna tell you how they want you to see it.
SS: I know exactly what you mean, and trust me a lot of people are smart enough to read between the lines.
NT: And thats what A Fate Worse Than Death will be. It will be a new level of intensity for people who are fans of Fistful, in terms of drumming and in terms of the vocals and a song writing standpoint, another strong song people seem to like from it is Angry World too...thats a standout track . Well if youre looking for Fistful Of Metal 2 , Well maybe that will happen at some point, But this wont be it. But this will definitely be my best yet. Its a new world order, for sure.
SS: Sounds great Neil, Just a few more questions... Name a favorite concert youve been to recently?
NT: Last year I went to a lot of great shows, but probably one of the best was Iron Maiden at OzzFest . Because Maiden withstood all of that bullshit that Sharon Osbourne pulled. It was a disgusting display, I dont have anything to prove and I have no ones ass to kiss and Im not afraid of her money or nothing. I mean I respect Ozzy and I think Sharon is a shrewd business person...Lets not confuse that, shes a very sharp lady...But I think it was disgusting to treat people like that...to order people to throw eggs.
SS: How many eggs did they throw at Iron Maiden?
NT: Like they had a fucking hen house out in back. They kept hitting Bruce Dickinson, they kept hitting Jannick Gers, they kept hitting Nicko McBrain, Dave Murray, Adrian Smith & Steve Harris. They were all being pelted.
They impressed me with their professionalism. They would have played if those were bullets instead of eggs. They would have kept playing. I mean these guys had that look on their faces like they were fucking marching for the Queen of England. There was nobody that was gonna stand in their way. I just respect them deeply for that. Most human beings would have folded, they would have got mad, they would have reacted...These guys didnt even break a sweat, They didnt break stride. What ever Bruce Dickinson said or done to Sharon Osbourne???doesnt warrant this...She showed how low of the person she is...it was disgusting.
SS: Yes that was a sad day for Metal, I agree. I always wondered have you ever met Joey Belladonna ?
NT: One time in the elevator at the attorneys in New York. I guess Scott brought him in to show me likeLook who I got type of thing, The problem with Scott is he just didnt communicate.
Another time was at a show here in California with a friend of mine and Im in the lounge area, and Joey kept looking over like every 2 seconds it was really weird. So one of the promoters said wait here Ill go get Joey etc. ... Well he wouldnt come out to meet me, she said to me that Joey said he doesnt wanna come out to meet you because it might confuse the fans??
SS: Was this when he was back in Anthrax?
NT: No before, it was a few years ago. So whatever floats your boat, but thats fuckin bullshit...But you know what it didnt hurt my feelings or anything. I would have of just said Hey, whats up? I was just surprised he couldnt be a man, he couldnt be a man and shake my hand and go how you doin man? maybe he was intimidated because he wasnt in Anthrax at the time, who knows? I was just gonna be courteous . Its like when you hold the door for the person you know or dont give a fuck about or you can take that door and slam it in their fuckin face. And Im from New York so I have no problem slamming the door in someones face if they deserve it...Its just a common fuckin courtesy .
SS: I know what you mean. One last thing... If its the year 2009. And its the 25th anniversary of Fistful Of Metal . Any chance if you were approached would you play again at Roseland Ballroom again...for a reunion show of sorts?
NT: Id say keep dreaming
SS: Thats what I thought, I was just curious though.
NT: Im not really interested to be honest...what for? nostalgia? to make money? Im not desperate to make money or to work with people that are less than respectful or courteous people. I choose not to be around people like that...simple as that.
SS: Thanks Neil for the taking the time to talk with us here at LivingForMetal.com . I really look forward to your new album and look forward to seeing you live very soon as well.
NT: Well thanks , But I just think that your cool people Steve...for someone whos been to the Roseland show just blows me away.
SS: Yeah it was a great show and memory, Ill definitely catch you guys when you come back to New York.
NT: What was your highlight of the Roseland show?
SS: I think Just seeing you guys storm the stage and head bang to Deathriders which was my favorite song at the time. There was such an electricity in the air that night.
NT: It was great that particular night.
SS: Well it was a New York crowd for sure, everyone there wanted to see Anthrax really.
NT: I just thought that we killed. All I can say is that at that point in time that was the pinnacle...That was like the best show the band had ever done, and it was kinda weird to me that they already had it planned out with management, it wasnt just the band but management too. The management was tired of me asking for money and eventually they stopped taking my calls, anyways thats a sad story, But thats life... thats the way it goes.
All I can say is that I have control over my destiny at this point and Im working on my own songs and not having people that want to put their agenda in front of the music. Anyone who wants to put their agenda in front of the music better get out of the way cos theyll get run over haha.
Alright brother.
SS: Ok thank you Neil I appreciate it, thanks for your time
NT: Take care
SS: You too buddy
NT: Have a good night.
