Neurotheology - origin of spirituality?

Satori

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May 2, 2001
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Hey, here's an article... kind of what I've been saying all along, hehe

Satori


Is God a State of Mind?
Revelations: Brain X-Rays 'Show' Religious Experience

By Laurie Barclay, MD
WebMD Medical News

Reviewed by Dr. Jacqueline Brooks

April 11, 2001 -- Read the daily paper or watch the local TV news and a seemingly endless parade of chaotic, violent events unfolds: school shootings, terrorism, murder, child abuse. Many people make sense of these seemingly senseless events through a belief in a Supreme Being and faith that their God won't desert them in a time of need. This faith may be well placed, according to a Philadelphia-based radiologist -- well placed in the brain, that is.

In Why God Won't Go Away, released April 1 by Ballantine Books, co-author Andrew B. Newberg, MD, explains his theory that the human brain is hard-wired for religion. Just as the mind has the capacity for analytical thought, abstract mathematical reasoning, and invention of highly sophisticated technology, it also has the capacity -- and the built-in design -- to experience God.

Scientific study of how the brain works can't tell us if there is a God, he tells WebMD, but it can tell us about how human beings understand God.

"Our work -- neurotheology -- has a reverence for both science and religion," he says."

In a study to be published this month in Psychiatry Research and Neuroimaging, Newberg and a team of fellow researchers describe their study of the brain activity of eight Tibetan Buddhists in the throes of a peak meditative experience.

"We used meditation as a model ... for prayer and other types of intense religious experience," says Newberg, assistant professor of radiology at the University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine in Philadelphia.

Using a special X-ray procedure called SPECT, the scientists were able to see increased activity in the brain during meditation. Brain areas important in focused concentration were especially active.

Even more astounding was altered activity in a brain region that normally orients us and tells us where our bodies are in space. The different pattern of brain activity in this particular brain region may explain why meditators feel transported out of the physical world and into a spiritual realm that seems no less real.

"As the boundaries between self and physical surroundings go away, the meditator feels at one with something larger, whether a religious community, the world as a whole, or ultimately, God," Newberg says.

The brain activity patterns in the meditating Buddhists were similar to those in the praying Franciscan nuns, another religious group studied by Newberg. Hymns, chants, ritual dancing, and sacred rites may also intensify focus, block out external stimuli, and provide a pathway to mystical experience, even in nonbelievers.

"Too much meditation can over-drive brain areas and drop us into another universe for a while," says Laurence O. McKinney, director of the American Institute for Mindfulness in Arlington, Mass.

Analyzing the brain states of spiritual practices started in the 1960s when researchers from the Menninger Clinic in Topeka, Kan., first went to India to record the brain waves of yogis, McKinney says. He claims his group first coined the term 'neurotheology' in the 1980s, and then published the book Neurotheology in 1994.

"Explanations change every time we get a new [way to measure brain function], but eternal truths and eternal questions still remain," McKinney tells WebMD.

One of these new measurement techniques, called functional magnetic resonance imaging (MRI), has partially confirmed Newberg's findings.

In a study published last year in NeuroReport, investigators at the Massachusetts General Hospital and the Mind/Body Medical Institute in Boston used MRI to examine the brains of five experienced meditators and found increased activity in the regions involved in concentration and excitability.

"Additional brain regions involved in memory were also ... activated during meditation," Jeffery A. Dusek, PhD, associate director for clinical research at the Mind/Body Medical Institute, tells WebMD. Future plans for Dusek's team are to re-evaluate these findings in a three-year study funded by the Atlanta-based CDC.

Still, some experts advise against reading too much into Newberg's findings.

"Anything we do or feel, from a simple activity like moving a finger to the deepest passion like love or rage, has its own characteristic pattern of brain activity," says Pietro Pietrini, MD, PhD, who has used SPECT scanning to study brain activity in different emotional states -- for example, in healthy subjects imagining acts of aggression.

"This is a fascinating field that needs to be entered with extreme caution and a rigorous scientific approach," says Pietrini, a professor of clinical biochemistry and psychiatry at the University of Pisa in Italy.

"There is a complex interrelationship between mind, body, and spirit," Michael E. McCullough, PhD, tells WebMD. "Those behaviors and experiences designed to put people in touch with the transcendent may give them a survival advantage."

In an analysis of 42 different clinical studies, McCullough found that religious involvement was associated with lower death rate, even after accounting for obvious health advantages such as less alcohol and tobacco use and more social support.

Could active religious faith prevent illness or forestall death? "It's too soon to tell," says McCullough, associate professor of psychology at Southern Methodist University in Dallas.

"Understanding how the brain works can go a long way toward understanding the impact of religion, both physically and spiritually," says Newberg. With religious experiences such as meditation or prayer, heart rate and blood pressure decrease and changes in hormone levels may improve the function of the immune system, he explains.

Brain activity studies show that meditation is not just a passive experience but that increased excitability at peak meditation seems to confirm the "active bliss" reported by Newberg's study subjects.

"They feel profoundly calm, yet highly alert and intensely aware," Newberg says. "Spiritual experiences are more real to them than everyday reality like walking down the street. And they're not frightening, disorganized, or disorienting like drug-induced states or hallucinations seen in mental illness."

"We're looking at philosophy and religion in a more scientific way," says Pietrini, says. "Science has no way to prove or disprove a Creator, but finding unique patterns of brain activity corresponding to religious experiences is entirely compatible with religious beliefs."

Though skeptics may argue that God lives only in the mind of the faithful, Newberg suggests that the opposite conclusion is equally valid: "If there is a God, it makes perfect sense that He would create a way for us to communicate with Him."

"If truth were told, nearly all the nonbelievers would love a reason to believe," McKinney says. "Newberg believes he's done a good job providing some reasons, and for those who follow his path, I wish them well."
 
a quote I like:

"Whenever we read the obscene stories, the voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and torturous executions, the unrelenting vindictiveness, with which more than half the Bible is filled, it would be more consistent that we called it the word of a demon than the Word of God. It is a history of wickedness that has served to corrupt and brutalize mankind."

Thomas Paine (1737-1809), Anglo-American political theorist, writer. The Age of Reason, pt. 1, "Examination of the Old Testament" (1794).


Satori
 
I wouldn't be surprised to find out that religious groups "approve" or "give their blessing" to this kind of study.

Pharagraphs like "Could active religious faith prevent illness or forestall death? "It's too soon to tell," says McCullough" and "If truth were told, nearly all the nonbelievers would love a reason to believe" are bound to increase spiritual activity.

I'm sure someone else can come up with an appropriate slogan or TV-shop commercial of tomorrow.. :p
 
Great Article Satori,

it should be clarified that the article doesn't explain the essence and origin to religion- i.e., all that religion is/can/must be- that is, it's not a reductionistic study- but is merely a study attempting to develop that informational fund that scientists might use who are interested in such experiences from a neurokineseological view, asking the question what is religious experience neurologically? This study doesn't answer by asserting that religion IS neurological activity, and that's it's only reducible to such, and has no basis or reality beyond this. All it does is explain and attempts to correlate religious experience in neurological terms, and from within that neuroscientific paradigm.

Judging from the article you posted here, theirs is not a scientific effort that trashes on religion in anyway. In fact, I"m not sure if you already understand this, but the article is quite friendly and favorable towards religion, and even endorses it.

I cannot see in what way this artcile agrees with your positions on religion that for instance leagues christian belief/the christian with disease. This study almost explicity verifies and prescribes religion as healthful and authentically therapeutic (therefore good) thing.

How does it accord with any of what you've been saying?
 
Originally posted by Xtokalon
How does it accord with any of what you've been saying?

It doesn't completely, but partially, by providing insight into the way the mind works. It does in other ways as well, which I will outline.

"This faith may be well placed, according to a Philadelphia-based radiologist -- well placed in the brain, that is."

I am of the opinion that spirituality is innate to the human mind, NOT something external, something I've been saying all along, something this article agrees with.

I also thought it was revealing how they compared buddhists to nuns, showing how the experience in the 2 was similar. That is pure blasphemy to christians, and I sure you can see why.

"With religious experiences such as meditation or prayer, heart rate and blood pressure decrease and changes in hormone levels may improve the function of the immune system, he explains. "


If the spiritual experience was entirely granted by an external god, the buddhists would never have such as experience because buddhist meditation, by it's very nature, is turning one's back (ego) to thoughts, god, and everything (and even one's self for that matter). Perhaps you aren't aware that meditation is a sin in christianity, anything that purposefully turns the mind away from 'god' is a SIN. Anything that denounces the christian ideal of god is a sin. Buddhists are more guilty of these things than anyone. Therefore, it seems kind of odd that "god" would award these buddhists with spritual experiences and all the benefits which come with it, don't you think? After all, in christian theology, one must first believe and ask for god's grace in order to receive it. Why is god giving it's grace to these (nontheist/athiest) buddhists?


This study almost explicity verifies and prescribes religion as healthful and authentically therapeutic (therefore good) thing.

It also says that prayer and meditation have the same results/benefits, which is quite obviously pure blasphemy.

"Brain activity studies show that meditation is not just a passive experience but that increased excitability at peak meditation seems to confirm the "active bliss" reported by Newberg's study subjects. "

" "We used meditation as a model ... for prayer and other types of intense religious experience," says Newberg, assistant professor of radiology at the University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine in Philadelphia. "


Seems kind of odd that god would reward the ultimate sacreliege (meditation) with "active bliss". Seems odd that they would use meditation as a model for spiritual experience and equate it with "prayer". Meditation is about as completely far from prayer as you can get, as I'm sure you know, one is based in thought, egocentricism and desire, while the other is based in no-thought, selflessness, no-desire, and melding with one's environment. They could not be any more different.

A christian god would NOT reward non-believers with good health and bliss, yet, there it is. How would a christian explain this? Is it possible buddhists are receiving the grace of god while actively laughing at the idea that there even is a god? To christians this is simply not possible. There must be some other explanation. Perhaps spirituality (and all it's benefits) is innate to the human mind and not from an external god? That's what I've been saying since day one.

cheers,

Satori
 
A new twist on the never-ending battle of science vs. religion. Science constantly strives for measurable proof for explanations, while religion says - it is what it is.

We live in a world of "prove-its", so my hats off to science for taking the initiative in finding the answer. Religion hangs on to a book, with the pages crumbling over time. I see no attempt for religion to strive to strengthen their beliefs - they pass the "preach" down - and continue the same message. I evolve, science evolves, why shouldn't religion?

I still have no answer for the "Do I believe in God" question - I only state that as of today, I see science in the early lead.
 
Originally posted by Satori


"This faith may be well placed, according to a Philadelphia-based radiologist -- well placed in the brain, that is."

I am of the opinion that spirituality is innate to the human mind, NOT something external, something I've been saying all along, something this article agrees with.
Satori

That part of your post does support your position, though taken for what it is in itself, I cannot agree with it's "reductionistic" tinge that seems to be embedded in it- but this is a seperate issue that is perhaps too out of the way to discuss here.

Just to flirt with this however, "spirituality" is innate to the human mind, of course, but what isn't? God maybe innate to the mind as well, and indeed I remember coming over the idea that "god" and some link to the "hyperworld" can be "uncovered" by a neurological understanding of the human brain. So it's a study that is essentially neutral to relgions, and I think this point is even articulated (as I recall) in the article you posted.



I also thought it was revealing how they compared buddhists to nuns, showing how the experience in the 2 was similar. That is pure blasphemy to christians, and I sure you can see why.

Actually it wouldn't be. Expecially within catholicism (two thirds of all xtians are catholics), it is believed that all religions have within them a source of truth, or common truth, and what's important is "spirituality". So it isn't blashemous at all. If I had the resources, I would cite certain catechisms by the Pope stating such. (sorry if I don't, heh, too lazy)

If the spiritual experience was entirely granted by an external god, the buddhists would never have such as experience because buddhist meditation, by it's very nature, is turning one's back (ego) to thoughts, god, and everything (and even one's self for that matter). Perhaps you aren't aware that meditation is a sin in christianity, anything that purposefully turns the mind away from 'god' is a SIN. Anything that denounces the christian ideal of god is a sin. Buddhists are more guilty of these things than anyone. Therefore, it seems kind of odd that "god" would award these buddhists with spritual experiences and all the benefits which come with it, don't you think? After all, in christian theology, one must first believe and ask for god's grace in order to receive it. Why is god giving it's grace to these (nontheist/athiest) buddhists?


I think in the above you raise interesting issues.

First, I don't think any Christian believes that "enlightenment" or "that calm" is only exclusive to them, or beleives that it's only their due, if they experience "benefits" from prayer and such of course they attribute it to their god. But they don't think that such is IMpossible for anyone else. but of course, if you're muslim, you bleieve that such "benefits" are due to his your relationship with Allah, and if you're xtian you attribute such to "jesus"- it's an internal matter of faith. The point: that Buddhists get "calm" is not in any way a threat or anything of this matter to Christians, and perhaps more likely than not, this study on a whole confirms and bolsters their beliefs. My impression quite frankly is the guy who heads the "neurotheological" research which the article you posted is based on, is even looking actively to "prove god" by scientific means. That's the suspcion at least.

2) Christians do not condemn meditation per se. They may condemn those who aren't christian, praying to other gods or so, but in itself I've never come across any christian who has ever deemd "meditation" wrong to the extent they'd have explicit issues against it. The bible does not any where state "thou shalt not meditate." So it wouldn't be an issue for Christians.

"buddhist meditation, by it's very nature, is turning one's back (ego) to thoughts, god, and everything "

This is really a seperate issue, but I can't refrain from dealing with it. Buddhists beleive that what their doing is "selfless" that they do what they do, as I understand it, to "free themselves from their ego and will." In reality, they do it for selfish reasons, and the will that they lose is only a "will" of another kind that they trade in its stead. There is no way to escape this basic paradox. Pointing to differences between Christian worship/prayer and Buddhist meditation is an insubstantive issue, for that reason and others.

"Therefore, it seems kind of odd that "god" would award these buddhists with spritual experiences and all the benefits which come with it, don't you think.......prayer and meditation have the same results/benefits, which is quite obviously pure blasphemy. "

It would seem odd, I concede, so of course a Christian would not attriburte such "rewards" to God. Though of course the researchers conducting this study lump all such experiences together-- it's in need of finnesse, don't you think?. Just because some guy is actually enjoying limp bizkit, doesn' mean limp bizkit rules, you know? From the xtian pov, just because buddhsits are actually physically benefitted form meditiation wouldn't neccesarily mean that they are wrong and buddhists are right.


"Rewards" exists and would exist for buddhists, but this doesn't contravert the xtian position in any major way, as such doesn't have to be attributed to a god in any way. The study however does support the idea that religion- meditations and prayer- is healthful and positive, which is the larger imput I get from this research and your article, and this of course supports xtianity directly (and goes against the grain of what you've been pushing for) Indeed they seem to be saying, that if religon is actually physiologically healthful and therapeutic, and there are certain symptoms of this that appear neurokinetically, then religion (whatever its form may be) should be endorsed. And on an exterior level, the study goes so far as to suggest that because such benefits are "real" maybe "God" and such spiritual matters are real too. That's a thumbs up to xtians, though of course that leaves the issue of which religion is actually due to a god and what god, which is quite seperate from the study. But this again is exterior and a non-scientific, infratheological debate that has and always will exist.


Judgeing from the kinds of research they''ve been doing, the heading of "neurotheology" is something of a misnomer. It should be more like "the physiological effects of (religious) activities of x, y, z as documented in neurokinetic patterns" The latter takes away the "metaphysical" and even the psychological dimension and implications from such a study. In the end, the truth of the matter is that such "new studies" as "neurotheology" amounts to scientific hype only. There is- i can prove this- no "special compartment"or "hardwiring" that "makes us" religious, which is the ultimate thesis that *some* who conduct these studies are trying to establish. That kind of reductionism is simply invalid.

cheers,
 
hey Xtokalon,

I have deconstructed what we are both saying and found what I believe is the the 2 points in which we have a difference of opinion.

1) According to what I've read, meditation is a sin in christianity because it purposefully takes the mind away from god. Of course, I just read this in a book, it's just someone's interpretation and not necessarily accurate, but it sounded pretty believable to me cuz this author had spent many years as a christian priest and thelogian. Basically, he wrote that according to christian theology, one must always have reverence to god in all tasks and all aspects of life, that is, whatever you are thinking or doing you are supposed to be aware that god has it's ever watchful eye on you and behave accordingly. This is not to say that one must always dwell on god, as this is impossible, what it means is that one must not *purposefully* do/think something in which the *intent* is to pull one's mind away from christ/god. Buddhist meditation is doing just that, which is why I came to regard it as a sin according to christianity. Of course, the archaic and rhetorical language of the bible is such that it can be interpreted to mean just about anything, and this is just one interpretation.

2) You and I know that meditation and prayer are very similar and therefore reap similar benefits, however, christians do not know this and will argue against this idea. When a christian prays, he/she thinks the healing/calm comes from god/holy spirit/whatever. From this christian standpoint, meditation should not work to this end at all, and yet it does (and I think it works better than praying but that's just my opinion). I see this as a bit of a slap in the face to christian theology which asserts that the healing power of prayer comes directly from 'god', but obviously this is not necessarily the case. Meditation, hypnosis, and visualization all work as well or better than prayer, and I feel this leads one to conclude that one does not need faith in order to be healed. It suggests that healing is internally provoked and performed without outside influences regardless of a person's faith or lack thereof. Of course, you and I both know this already, but the christians (who are looking for ways to substantiate their assertion of the healing power of prayer through and externalized 'god') don't know this and many will refute it endlessly as the idea that prayer is just a form of self-healing is simply sacreliege to them. It's in this way that I feel the article is in agreement with me. Just the fact that the researchers would equate buddhist meditation with christian prayer is going a long way in saying that the beneficial aspects of meditation/prayer are internally driven. Perhaps they aren't aware that buddhism is a godless philosophy? Hmm..

I'm reminded of something I saw on tv once, you know, those hindu's who mutilate themselves without hurting/bleeding, etc. They claim to do it through the power of god which they tap into through meditation (which is not the same as selfless buddhist meditation, though the end result is likely the same). Well, on the sidelines were some atheist/sacreligious freaks (like me) who denouce the whole thing and call it bullshit. To prove their point, they perform the same feats of self-mutilation but before hand they do some kind of sacreliege to piss off their god, like drinking blood or whatever is a sin to them. Their claim is that the torturous acts they perform are done with the power of their own minds, not through god, which of course is the case as I'm sure you would agree. It would be awfully uncharacteristic of god to provide protection to those who openly mock it and seek to dismiss it as delusion. I don't know how the hindu believers (who use the self-mutilation thing to justify their faith) explain how non-believers/blasphemers are able to perform these feats, but my guess is that they simply disregard it and ignore it cuz it doesn't fit into their limited world view (just like modern christians dismiss evolution for example). I feel this story also illustrates the power of mind and debunks the idea that external forces are at work just the like the meditation-prayer comparison.

I believe the (somewhat paranormal) power of mind is much greater than anyone can believe, even me. I feel that we affect the expression of our macro world in ways that we can't yet understand, much the same way as the state of mind of a quantum physicist can affect the outcome of an experiment. I think that thoughts can create/project reality and that this phenomenon can explain a hell of a lot of the strange shit that goes on in our world that we attribute to god or other supernatural forces. Just an opinion.

Satori
 
Originally posted by Xtokalon
In the end, the truth of the matter is that such "new studies" as "neurotheology" amounts to scientific hype only. There is- i can prove this- no "special compartment"or "hardwiring" that "makes us" religious, which is the ultimate thesis that *some* who conduct these studies are trying to establish. That kind of reductionism is simply invalid.

You mentioned you could "prove this" so I'd like to take you up on that offer since I think that it's really impossible to prove or disprove, we can only create opinions based on cold logic. So I realize you can't prove this, I'd just like to hear your logic for coming to such a conclusion.

Keep in mind however that it may not apply to all people. Some people are born with a greater likelyhood to be a football player than a ballet dancer, as with everything, genetic variation makes all diversities a possibility.

I am of the opinion that humans are spiritual creatures by design, evidenced by the fact that humans have always felt as though they are a part of something greater than themselves and they concoct myths/legends to explain these inherent feelings. Of course, there is a huge political component to this as well, but I feel there is something more going on that people just acting on what they've been taught, I feel there is an instinctual aspect to spirituality as well. I don't mean all humans are like this, and those that are have varying degrees of spirituality, but I feel the majority of people feel that they are part of something greater, they feel a connectiveness with the universe (environment) which I think is a consequence of evolution, after all, purely in organic terms, we are our environment and it makes sense that the brain would evolve an understanding of this at some level of awareness. Speaking for myself only, I would say that sprituality was hard-wired in my brain and I have always had such feelings since I was old enough to think, even before christianity was rammed down my throat in catholic school. Therefore, it should be evident why I feel that this article's suggestion that spirituality is (or could be) a function of the human brain is completely logical and accurate (from my experiences with myself).

As you said: "Just to flirt with this however, "spirituality" is innate to the human mind, of course, but what isn't?" Exactly, what isn't? Therefore, how do you support your idea that "hardwiring" of spirituality is simply invalid reductionism? If god did not come from the minds of people who had these innate feelings of spirituality which they couldn't explain with their limited knowledge of human psychology, then where did 'god' come from? Why would humans concoct such ideas if the underlying ROOT of such ideas weren't already there in the first place?

I still feel that spirituality, just like sexual desire, fear of death, instincts to suckal, etc, are functions of the mind which need not be dramatized and externalized in order to be understood.

Satori