OT: Origin of power metal-style double bass

[urinalcakemix]

Bobby Jarzombek is overrated. He's got chops, no feel tho. His video wasnt that great other than "School" and "Peppered Cancer"

Virgil Donati is the man when it comes to the skins. in a Jazz, prog, metal, or solo situation, Donati just kicks. I have a video of him doing a straight 15 minute solo, holy shit. It was insane, chops feel and the best 4 way independence ever.

 

[Creeps]

Motorhead "Overkill" 1978/9

 

[adaher]

What would be the first frequent use of it? Helloween?

 

[mitthrawnuruodo]

Personally I credit Helloween for starting the trend that still exists today in power/speed metal.

Nah man, Judas Priest were doing it long before Helloween, see Exciter and Hell Bent for Leather.

 

[Wounded Land]

Personally, I've never heard anything before Helloween that could remotely be considered "power metal-style double-bass." Bill Bruford most emphatically did _not_ do this, nor did Peart. Same with Deep Purple and Black Sabbath
(one bass drum). I would buy the Accept or Motorhead explanations although I am not that familiar with either of those bands' outputs (I had "Ace of Spades" at some point, but I couldn't tell you where it is now).

Did Accept make the double-bass rhythm an integral part of their style, as Helloween did?

NP: Led Zeppelin I

 

[Bryan316]

Woosta: Virgil Donati IS the man. But... for some extreme, mind-blowing shit, I still think that Richard Christy (Sound of Perserverance) is gonna give Virgil a real test for who's the most extremely challenging power drummer.

Yes, Phil Rudd was to weed out all those posers. HAH!

Okay... then does anyone know if there's an example earlier than Motorhead's Overkill with full-out double bass?

 

[edgeofthorns]

I've always felt that the rapid fire bass drumming started becoming popular after Iron Maiden started speeding things up with Powerslave and Somewhere in Time (that's when I first noticed it). Of course, Helloween took it all a step further with the Keeper Albums. Personally I credit Helloween for starting the trend that still exists today in power/speed metal. Others (like Accept) had used the technique before them on certain songs, but Helloween made it their trademark sound.

I agree with your comment about Helloween. In addition, King Diamond's Mickey Dee, along with Helloween, made the powermetal style, double bass drumming a signature sound.

 

[Trans-Siberian Outcast]

Nah man, Judas Priest were doing it long before Helloween, see Exciter and Hell Bent for Leather.

True. But like I said in my original post, there were several bands already using that technique on certain songs. But Helloween was the first to make it their "sound". And I believe that was the spirit of the question (that's how I understood it anyway).

Hell, half the speed/power/flower metal bands out there sound like Helloween clones. That should tell you something right there.

 

[J-Man]

Okay, here is the scoop, did some research and one of the very very first drummers(after Louie Bellson) to really use the Double Bass to an advantage in their music was>>>>>1. Carmine Appice when he was with Vanilla Fudge, and then......2. Tommy Aldridge with Black oak Arkansas. Wow that really tells my age.

 

[King Lek]

I like Black Oak...have an album packed away somewhere....and used to have a Vanailla Fudge 8-track.....hmmm...wonder where that is.

 

[Formerly known as Chris F5]

Rainbow-Kill th eKing
Queen-Stone Cold Crazy,all power metal like double bass

 

[Petethedrummer]

Virgil Donati is the man when it comes to the skins. in a Jazz, prog, metal, or solo situation, Donati just kicks. I have a video of him doing a straight 15 minute solo, holy shit. It was insane, chops feel and the best 4 way independence ever.

I agree that he's the man, but Marco Minneman has him beat on the independence. He's extremely extremely ridiculous

 

[dargormudshark]

I'm not even gonna read the posts answer is...

KIIILLLL THEEEEE KIIIIIIIIIIINNNGGGGGG, STRIIKEE HIM DOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWWNNNNNNNNN!

or if you wanna go back earlier it's Fireball by Deep Purple.

 

[Bryant]

Don't know about rock music, but for power metal, it all started with Accept - Fast as a Shark.

Joe

I am certain that Stefan Kaufmann (Accept) wasn't the first to play double bass, but I haven't found anything earlier than "Fast as a Shark" that is comparable to that as far as speed and aggression. Accept probably didn't get some of the deserved noteriety that bands like Priest, Scorps and Maiden did because they were TOO heavy and "out of the box." I am a HUGE Accept fan, so I am admittedly biased, but that band "started" a lot of shit, yet gets rarely credited for it.


Bryant

 

[dargormudshark]

Okay, here is the scoop, did some research and one of the very very first drummers(after Louie Bellson) to really use the Double Bass to an advantage in their music was>>>>>1. Carmine Appice when he was with Vanilla Fudge, and then......2. Tommy Aldridge with Black oak Arkansas. Wow that really tells my age.

don't forget Cozy!!! Lee Kerslake also did some as well as the drummer from Queen. oh and Michael Giles from King Crimson. On "Pictures of a City" he is throwing double bass all over the place..fucking awesome

 

[Wounded Land]

I was thinking about this over the weekend, and I think that a good parallel to this that would shed light on the discussion is the issue of fingertapped guitar licks. People like Steve Hackett used tapping in the early '70s, but it wasn't until Eddie Van Halen in the late '70s that it became the cornerstone of a guitarist's style.

That, to me, is very helpful. Who is the Eddie Van Halen of power metal-syle double bass? Who is the Steve Hackett?

 

[hyperdesire]

As far as Happy Metal, its Warlord (1984), Helloween (1985) and X-Japan (1987).

 

[Yngvai X]

Rainbow-Kill th eKing

THANK YOU

It took two pages for someone to mention Kill the King by Rainbow? You want the birth of powermetal, in general not just the double bass thing, its that song. 1978.

Also, According to Helloween's bio on metal-archives.com, the song Murderer was written in 1978 as well, so that could be it as well.