Question about phase / comb filtering...
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Mikaël-ange
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Sometime I really thing nobody on Sneap forum read my fucking posts
What you tryed to achieve is call bi amping (same DI throught different amp/setup). Main problem you have is simply your daw can't properly work with ADC...
Lasse explained this fact before...
Btw, sorry for my bad english
drew_drummer
Dancefap
Automatic delay compensation, I thought....
Can you just clarify - do you have four separate DI's that are all different performances, or one performance per two tracks?
Can you just clarify - do you have four separate DI's that are all different performances, or one performance per two tracks?
Ok 4 rhythm parts total.
4 separate performances
Performance 1 & 2 play the same riffs but are separate performances of that riff, Performance 3 & 4 play same riff with harmonies to what 1 and 2 are playing 3 and 4 are also separate performances of the harmonized riff.
So its Technically 2 guitar parts doubled.
4 separate performances
Performance 1 & 2 play the same riffs but are separate performances of that riff, Performance 3 & 4 play same riff with harmonies to what 1 and 2 are playing 3 and 4 are also separate performances of the harmonized riff.
So its Technically 2 guitar parts doubled.
Mikaël-ange
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audio delay compensation
Many daw aren't phase accurate for some stupid reasons.
From what I hear about, Fredrik Nordström do bi amping all the time. Lasse too...
But both work with PTHD
Cakewalk Sonar 4 here. May get better results if I actually use Reaper or Sonar 8. Ill give it a shot.
Thanks
Thanks
burst
Member
When I was doing FOH for a band with one guitar playing through 2 different amps into one 1960 cab in stereo mode (so it's like one amp per side), I stumbled into the same phasing problem. Even when you standing near that cab you can clearly hear that those sides are just nulling each other out.
So maybe it's possible that two amps have different routing inside them, so the signal is coming to a speaker with tiny delay, and you need to find a spot where it's working to your advantage.
Just my 2 cents, and sorry for my bad English
So maybe it's possible that two amps have different routing inside them, so the signal is coming to a speaker with tiny delay, and you need to find a spot where it's working to your advantage.
Just my 2 cents, and sorry for my bad English
JHA
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When I was doing FOH for a band with one guitar playing through 2 different amps into one 1960 cab in stereo mode (so it's like one amp per side), I stumbled into the same phasing problem. Even when you standing near that cab you can clearly hear that those sides are just nulling each other out.
So maybe it's possible that two amps have different routing inside them, so the signal is coming to a speaker with tiny delay, and you need to find a spot where it's working to your advantage.
Just my 2 cents, and sorry for my bad English
That could be just improper wiring between the two halves inside the speaker ie the other is pushing "+" when the other is pulling "-". Could be fixed by flipping the wires from 1 speaker cable at the other end.
Also like someone already said if you have 2 different tube amps, each gain stage (1 half of tube) does invert the phase of the signal 180 degrees so for example an amp with 2,5 preamp tubes used and other with 3 are out of phase at output. Phase switch on the other channel fixes this though, but maybe it's not the case in here.
arv_foh
Brian K
When I was doing FOH for a band with one guitar playing through 2 different amps into one 1960 cab in stereo mode (so it's like one amp per side), I stumbled into the same phasing problem. Even when you standing near that cab you can clearly hear that those sides are just nulling each other out.
So maybe it's possible that two amps have different routing inside them, so the signal is coming to a speaker with tiny delay, and you need to find a spot where it's working to your advantage.
Just my 2 cents, and sorry for my bad English
this is completely possible, I've seen when recording multiple amps that one amp will be off by 10 or 15 samples.
Ok so this weekend I decided to use some reference DIs that we all know to show the issue. I wanted to make sure this wasnt isolated to the DI;s I was working with when I noticed it.
There are 3 DI's
1. Quad Tracked 5150
2. Quat Tracked Trem-o-verb
3. Quad Tracked with 2 Mesa and 2 5150
On mix 3 there is this odd nasally quality I am talking about in the OP.
http://www.jasoncohenitservices.com/phase
There are 3 DI's
1. Quad Tracked 5150
2. Quat Tracked Trem-o-verb
3. Quad Tracked with 2 Mesa and 2 5150
On mix 3 there is this odd nasally quality I am talking about in the OP.
http://www.jasoncohenitservices.com/phase
Mikaël-ange
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Listened your clip and I have to say I totally misunderstoud the point.
Bi amping is using same performance with different amp (like reamp the same DI through both amp), and have to do with phasing issue I pointed before.
In your case, it's only quad tracked guitars through differents amps (best way to operate when your DAW can't handle ADC).
So your problem sound like you have one amp in opposite phase from others. Typical when you use 5150 and rectifier. So flip the phase for one amp...
Good luck
Bi amping is using same performance with different amp (like reamp the same DI through both amp), and have to do with phasing issue I pointed before.
In your case, it's only quad tracked guitars through differents amps (best way to operate when your DAW can't handle ADC).
So your problem sound like you have one amp in opposite phase from others. Typical when you use 5150 and rectifier. So flip the phase for one amp...
Good luck
::XeS::
Member
+1
I think the problem is that not every amp are "phase accurate"....I mean it can happen that amp A produces a sound that has not the same phase of another amp..and that's the problem.
You have not to quad track to solve the problem but you have always to phase align the tracks after the recording.
I think the problem is that not every amp are "phase accurate"....I mean it can happen that amp A produces a sound that has not the same phase of another amp..and that's the problem.
You have not to quad track to solve the problem but you have always to phase align the tracks after the recording.
Guys,
this is group delay. It's a fact of life. There is no bending physics unfortunately.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Group_delay_and_phase_delay
this is group delay. It's a fact of life. There is no bending physics unfortunately.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Group_delay_and_phase_delay
Omega_Void
Your Eventual Destroyer
Every guitar amp includes an imperial fuck-ton of tone-shaping circuitry in addition to the user-adjustable tone controls.
All of these circuits introduce phase rotations at the frequencies adjusted, so phase-aligning the recorded tracks at one frequency will not lead to them being phase-aligned at all frequencies. Thus when you combine two amps the result will have unpredictable cancellations.
IME the only way to know what you're getting when blending is to monitor the blended tone while you dial -- e.g. blending multiple preamps through a common poweramp, or using multiple mic'd cabs.
All of these circuits introduce phase rotations at the frequencies adjusted, so phase-aligning the recorded tracks at one frequency will not lead to them being phase-aligned at all frequencies. Thus when you combine two amps the result will have unpredictable cancellations.
IME the only way to know what you're getting when blending is to monitor the blended tone while you dial -- e.g. blending multiple preamps through a common poweramp, or using multiple mic'd cabs.
Id use an IBP Phase Alignment Tool when recording 2 amps together which is'nt perfect but you can dial it in very close.
www.ascapestudios.com
www.ascapestudios.com
Mikaël-ange
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It's more simple when you reamp because amp are in phase or out of phase by 180°. So you just have to reverse phase on DI tracks before reamping.
If you don't plan to reamp you still have to reverse phase but with something like this: http://www.radialeng.com/di-jd7.htm
If you don't plan to reamp you still have to reverse phase but with something like this: http://www.radialeng.com/di-jd7.htm
