Recording without bass

[Pukahontas]

Hey I've been lurking these forums for awhile now trying to break out of noob territory so bear with me. I've been working to get a good recorded guitar sound for my deathcore band but I'm having some troubles.

We don't play with a bassist so I have my 6505 combo setup to be pretty bassy and boomy. It sounds great in the huge room we're playing in but once its recorded its really fizzy and not very oomphy. I tried positioning my SM-58 all over the place and found that the fizz seems to only be coming from the center of the speaker cone, which sucks cause that's also where the best sounds come from as well (although still not nearly as thick a sound as I'd like). I'm guessing it's the stock sheffield speakers that are the source of the problem, which makes me sad because I'm really liking the tone I'm getting in the room otherwise.

I guess the two things I'm trying to figure out are:

1. Will swapping out the speakers with something like V30s resolve the fizz problem?

2. How can I get a really thick recorded guitar tone that will compensate for the lack of bass guitar? I'm pretty green at EQing and I'm not sure what to boost/cut out for this kind of setup.

Here is my signal chain:

LTD Deluxe /w 81/85 > OD-9 > Decimator > Stock 6505 Combo > SM-58 > Apogee Duet > Macbook

Any nuggets of wisdom are greatly appreciated.

 

[arv_foh]

2. How can I get a really thick recorded guitar tone that will compensate for the lack of bass guitar? I'm pretty green at EQing and I'm not sure what to boost/cut out for this kind of setup.

you can't. get trillian and program it or buy a cheap (but decent) bass guitar

 

[Morgan C]

Heck, even use a synth. This will never sound good. The bass of a guitar is boomy and transient and generally hard to control. The bass of a bass guitar needs to be the solid and unmoving foundation for the mix.

It's kinda like asking how to make your guitar more percussive to compensate for not having a drummer. Not gonna happen.

 

[Pukahontas]

Hmmm... I've heard it done before on say Pig Destroyer albums. How is Scott Hull pulling it off?

 

[arv_foh]

Hmmm... I've heard it done before on say Pig Destroyer albums. How is Scott Hull pulling it off?

just listened to part of two songs, but there is huge gap in the frequency spectrum that the bass guitar would fill in their songs... none of the stuff is "full" sounding like you get w/ a bass in the mix

 

[Damian B]

Bass is definitely necessary. A few guys have had *some* luck recording a guitar DI, pitch shifting it down one octave, and then processing it all to hell to get it sound like a bass guitar. It's a decent way to get demos to sound okay, but I wouldn't recommend it for a "real" recording. Also, pitch shifting plugins (or at least the standard one in Reaper) have really high latency, so you can't record with them on.

My recommendation is to buy a super cheap bass. Rondo Music has them starting at just above $100.

 

[Pukahontas]

I'd rather forego the bass but I do have one laying around so I'll give it a shot. Thanks guys.

EDIT: Am I going to need some plugins to make the bass sound decent or can I just record it straight? Before I got the Duet I tried this and the bass sounded like poop.

 

[Sloan]

mic the back of the cab?

 

[Jormyn]

- For reducing the fizz, V30s will definitely go a long way - I have the same amp, and that's the next thing on my shopping list. In the meantime, try placing your mic at an angle, but still pointed more-or-less at the center of the speaker. This should roll off a fair amount of the fizziness without gutting your tone.

- You can record a bass direct, compress the shit out of it, EQ to taste, and end up with something that'll probably work. You can do *better* with a good plugin like TSE's B.O.D, which is free, or at the very least a convolution reverb and some bass cabinet impulses.

- If you absolutely *have* to make do without a bass, record your guitar tracks with a normal tone and record a separate fake-bass track. Low frequencies don't sound very directional, so having two bass-heavy guitars on either speaker chugging away is awkward to mix and just doesn't sound right. Bass should be focused in the center of the stereo image - thus, a separate track.