school shootings

[Lord SteveO]

If you haven't gone to an American public high school, this thread is meaningless to you.

What, so by you're strange point of view if we don't go to school in the USA we have no right to comment here? I guess that includes me, Norsemaiden and Neith and a whole load of others too then?
Just because we didn't go to school there does not mean we don't have a right to talk about bullying.
We all experiensed it at school in some form so don't try to tell us this thread isn't for us.

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

no, i do not consider bullying a valid excuse for killing someone
fortunately, neither does US law

if they believed they could have gotten away with an insanity plea, they might not have killed themselves after killing the valedictorian and those other specific people that they believed deserved to die
the valedictorian was killed not despite being validictorian (as her mother insists) the valedictorian was killed because she was the valedictorian (that's why the other girls under the table hugging her survived with only superficial wounds)

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

What, so by you're strange point of view if we don't go to school in the USA we have no right to comment here? I guess that includes me, Norsemaiden and Neith and a whole load of others too then?
Just because we didn't go to school there does not mean we don't have a right to talk about bullying.
We all experiensed it at school in some form so don't try to tell us this thread isn't for us.

yes
american school really is a totally different universe than schools in other countries
but
that doesn't make a non-american's post invalid
unless their saying something like insisting that the americans are exxagerrating or lying or something like that

 

[infoterror]

What, so by you're strange point of view if we don't go to school in the USA we have no right to comment here?

Where did I talk about "rights"?

My point is that you probably won't understand it; already, I see the evidence of that.

Come visit.

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

american schools suck
we get it already

 

[NeverIsForever]

if they believed they could have gotten away with an insanity plea, they might not have killed themselves after killing the valedictorian and those other specific people that they believed deserved to die
the valedictorian was killed not despite being validictorian (as her mother insists) the valedictorian was killed because she was the valedictorian (that's why the other girls under the table hugging her survived with only superficial wounds)

wait, are you saying it's a bad thing the school shooters then committed suicide? as in "our world would be better off with these teenage murderers still at large in it"?

i confess i don't follow that logic.

 

[infoterror]

american schools suck
we get it already

Not what I meant. The social climate is entirely different than what others have reported of European schools and there are other issues introduced by the lack of a dominant culture in America.

 

[Xorv]

Maybe the kids wanted to go down with a band, ya know? Living in a small town with their life leading into nothing. Why not commit one of the most tragic events to ever occur in America?

Whatever....those guys are f**ked up

 

[infoterror]

Maybe the kids wanted to go down with a band, ya know?

Like Slayer?

 

[Volcano14]

bullying is a problem in every school in america, but shootings dont happen daily, monthly...or even yearly.

shootings are rare but knife attacks and fistfights are surely more frequent. Not to mention suicides and depressions

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/3041756.stm

kids will always be picked on...it isnt going to change. how can we assure ourselves that no matter how badly people get picked on they dont do anything like this?

sending to school only those who really want to go, having the rest do homeschooling. Besides if we're in a free market economy then we should really let the customers decide what kind of schooling they think is best for them

I think our future grand children, who will be mostly self educated with either books or computers, will look at this era and think that its public education system was so weak because of its egalitarian one size fits all philosophy and age segregation and the uselessness of much of what is taught in elementary and high school.

 

[Norsemaiden]

Like Slayer?

Wonderful! Slayer Day is a great idea.

 

[Xorv]

shootings are rare but knife attacks and fistfights are surely more frequent. Not to mention suicides and depressions

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/3041756.stm


sending to school only those who really want to go, having the rest do homeschooling. Besides if we're in a free market economy then we should really let the customers decide what kind of schooling they think is best for them

I think our future grand children, who will be mostly self educated with either books or computers, will look at this era and think that its public education system was so weak because of its egalitarian one size fits all philosophy and age segregation and the uselessness of much of what is tought in elementary and high school.

lol....uselessness? looks like it finally caught up with you. It's spelled taught, you dummie.

Anyways.....how is what is taught in high school and elementary useless? What do you think should be taught instead? eh?

 

[Neith]

yes
american school really is a totally different universe than schools in other countries
but
that doesn't make a non-american's post invalid
unless their saying something like insisting that the americans are exxagerrating or lying or something like that

For you to say that it would require you to come to school in other countries and experience it. Have you? I'm not saying that our schools are actually like yours, but for our opinion not to count because we don't have experience of American schools would basically make your above statement nonsense. Anyway, the original question was directly related to America, but bullying in general.

Also, I don't follow what you're saying about the parents knowing with absolute certainty that their kids were responsible.

 

[Volcano14]

lol....uselessness? looks like it finally caught up with you. It's spelled taught, you dummie.

corrected. typos happens. I shouldn't try to use that as an excuse but I'm not a native english speaker by the way

Anyways.....how is what is taught in high school and elementary useless? What do you think should be taught instead? eh?

Less courses, only the basics and the important. We should spend less time there and move on to higher stages earlier. Those who understand quicker than the others should be able to progress more rapidly without waiting for the group to catch on. If this can't happen in a "normal" school then school officials should be required to propose home schooling and not whine if the students decide that they feel better elsewhere.

we had arts classes which I cannot thank for getting me interested in arts, painting, architecture, etc. Same for music courses

we had those irritating 'personal growth' classes in which we were supposed to discover our inner selves and share it with the group uke:

we had useless history classes. We could have learned more simply by reading a history book or just reading a history class manual by ourselves. Nobody cared and probably no one remembered the content

we had gym classes in which we did less than if we had been at a gym

we had an economics course in which we didn't even learn how to do a budget or calculate elementary stuff

we had useless computer science classes. I would have learned more by using that time to do computer stuff by myself

the biology class was kids' stuff. I would have learned more by reading a book like 'Biology for Dummies' or something like that.

and there was no way to avoid these courses without being reprimanded by the school and risking expulsion or some other punishment. It was just an irritating waste of our time. I should have been homeschooled during all those years instead of attending a school.

 

[speed]

corrected. typos happens. I shouldn't try to use that as an excuse but I'm not a native english speaker by the way

Less courses, only the basics and the important. We should spend less time there and move on to higher stages earlier. Those who understand quicker than the others should be able to progress more rapidly without waiting for the group to catch on. If this can't happen in a "normal" school then school officials should be required to propose home schooling and not whine if the students decide that they feel better elsewhere.

we had arts classes which I cannot thank for getting me interested in arts, painting, architecture, etc. Same for music courses

we had those irritating 'personal growth' classes in which we were supposed to discover our inner selves and share it with the group uke:

we had useless history classes. We could have learned more simply by reading a history book or just reading a history class manual by ourselves. Nobody cared and probably no one remembered the content

we had gym classes in which we did less than if we had been at a gym

we had an economics course in which we didn't even learn how to do a budget or calculate elementary stuff

we had useless computer science classes. I would have learned more by using that time to do computer stuff by myself

the biology class was kids' stuff. I would have learned more by reading a book like 'Biology for Dummies' or something like that.

and there was no way to avoid these courses without being reprimanded by the school and risking expulsion or some other punishment. It was just an irritating waste of our time. I should have been homeschooled during all those years instead of attending a school.

I take it you're an American?

I think the entire system needs serious change--and fast. The biggest problem is our dependence on standardized testing, and the standardized mediocrity factories, education colleges have become. Not to mention how education is funded in the United States (which may, on second thought, be the biggest problem of all).

Ive unfortunately been a substitute teacher in History, Geography, Social Studies, Literature, and Economics at two school districts. I would have if it was my career. One receives one class a day of somewhat intelligent students, while the rest are purblind, putrid pubescents, with nothing rattling around in their coiffed heads, but video games, bad music, and whether they are popular--and if not, how they can become popular.

 

[Volcano14]

I take it you're an American?

canadian

I think the entire system needs serious change--and fast. The biggest problem is our dependence on standardized testing, and the standardized mediocrity factories, education colleges have become. Not to mention how education is funded in the United States (which may, on second thought, be the biggest problem of all).

how is it funded ? I mean besides fees and subsidies

I don't have the numbers to compare Canada VS USA but the results are atrocious in your country. And these are post high school institutions :

"Only 31 percent of college graduates can read a complex book and extrapolate from it. That's not saying much for the remainder."

source:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/24/AR2005122400701.html

maybe our students are sorted out better by our systems here but I think the blacks and 2nd generation mexicans factor makes the situation worse in the US. Add to that the Diversity-is-Our-Strength mantra and it pretty much makes schooling institutions worthless as a means to educate the youth.

Ive unfortunately been a substitute teacher in History, Geography, Social Studies, Literature, and Economics at two school districts. I would have if it was my career. One receives one class a day of somewhat intelligent students, while the rest are purblind, putrid pubescents, with nothing rattling around in their coiffed heads, but video games, bad music, and whether they are popular--and if not, how they can become popular.

it's the same here although again it might be a bit worse in America. Schools can't make these people more mature and it makes life either boring or horrible for those intelligent and curious students who have the misfortune of being surrounded by idiotic TeENZ all day - and all year.

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

wait, are you saying it's a bad thing the school shooters then committed suicide? as in "our world would be better off with these teenage murderers still at large in it"?

i confess i don't follow that logic.

sorry the post you quoted was suppossed to be 2 seperate statements

1
if they believed the could get away with pleading insanity they wouldn't have killed themselves

2
they specifically made sure that they killed those specific people that they thought deserved to die and the other people that got shot weren't killed because the shooters didn't want to kill innocent people

 

[Horus]

I thought I did post in this thread....


I actually believe that something like the 2nd statement sounds like the shooters still have some degree of sanity, so that kinda kills the entire "Pleading Insanity" idea. Because obviously, somebody would've figured out that there was a pattern (the only word I can think of) behind who the shooters were killing. There's no way to get out of a situation like that, and I guess they thought death was the only way out.

 

[LORD_RED_DRAGON]

I actually believe that something like the 2nd statement sounds like the shooters still have some degree of sanity, so that kinda kills the entire "Pleading Insanity" idea. Because obviously, somebody would've figured out that there was a pattern (the only word I can think of) behind who the shooters were killing. There's no way to get out of a situation like that, and I guess they thought death was the only way out.

that was the point i was trying to make

 

[Tongue_Ring]

if the Columbine kids had lived, they would have gone to prison, and they would have gotten more "fanmail" than any other prisoners, ever, because the average american kid knows exactly what they were going through, if those kids were alive they'd be worshipped like gods