Sims vs Amp when practicing
- Thread starter Plendakor
- Start date
He's Dead, Jim
Member
I can't imagine playing with any more than maybe 5, max 10 ms of lag...that's a lot! I have a Cube 15XL, which is admittedly smaller, but I think all Roland amps work with basically the same set of chips, as far as I know, and I never detected any lag.
chesterfieldblues
Member
Well for late night jamming I can deal with the 3ms of lag I get from my profire. Otherwise, amp all the way.
XxSicRokerxX
Gabriel R.
texisthebest
Member
Same problem here.
You will always get a lag using PC but the less lag the best you´ll play.
So IMO put all the fx at low, no antialiasing at all.
And use just what you need: (overdrive+)amp+cab
With the minimum buffer rate in your soundcard.
Just my 2 cents.
You will always get a lag using PC but the less lag the best you´ll play.
So IMO put all the fx at low, no antialiasing at all.
And use just what you need: (overdrive+)amp+cab
With the minimum buffer rate in your soundcard.
Just my 2 cents.
Nimvi
Member
Man... I just wrote a reply, and after checking back on it I realized that it doesn't answer your question AT ALL! 
Huzzah for reading comprehension.
But fuck it, I'm going to post it anyway, cause I'm interested in how you fine folks feel about this:
Aside from the buffer delay issue, I must say that I personally prefer to practice on a small amp over even the greatest amp sims.
The thing with practicing on amp sims that bothers me is that they don't sound like an amp and a speaker in my room; they sound like an amp and a speaker in a room, through a microphone, through a speaker in my room. For recording purposes that's fantastic, but for playing by myself, that just feels like something's missing.
Compare it to drawing an image and afterwards cropping it to contain the best possible view, before putting it in a nice frame. That's cool, but I would hate to draw in the frame from the start. I just wouldn't feel it that way.
So yes, IMO get a small amp setup to practice on, but find something you vibe with. It doesn't have to sound like a million bucks, as long as it keeps you coming back.
For reference: my big setup is mainly a 6505 through an Engl 4x12 V30 with a GT-10 for FX.
My practice setup is a RAT through a Box of Rock, through a simple delay pedal, into the FX return of a TSA15 combo (any other clean amp of the desired volume level would work).
I really enjoy that practice setup and its versatility so much that just looking at it right now makes me want to play. Anything that does that is a winner in my book. Maybe it's not the case for others, but I've personally never had that feeling towards an amp sim.
Huzzah for reading comprehension.But fuck it, I'm going to post it anyway, cause I'm interested in how you fine folks feel about this:
Aside from the buffer delay issue, I must say that I personally prefer to practice on a small amp over even the greatest amp sims.
The thing with practicing on amp sims that bothers me is that they don't sound like an amp and a speaker in my room; they sound like an amp and a speaker in a room, through a microphone, through a speaker in my room. For recording purposes that's fantastic, but for playing by myself, that just feels like something's missing.
Compare it to drawing an image and afterwards cropping it to contain the best possible view, before putting it in a nice frame. That's cool, but I would hate to draw in the frame from the start. I just wouldn't feel it that way.
So yes, IMO get a small amp setup to practice on, but find something you vibe with. It doesn't have to sound like a million bucks, as long as it keeps you coming back.
For reference: my big setup is mainly a 6505 through an Engl 4x12 V30 with a GT-10 for FX.
My practice setup is a RAT through a Box of Rock, through a simple delay pedal, into the FX return of a TSA15 combo (any other clean amp of the desired volume level would work).
I really enjoy that practice setup and its versatility so much that just looking at it right now makes me want to play. Anything that does that is a winner in my book. Maybe it's not the case for others, but I've personally never had that feeling towards an amp sim.
MrBongo
idiot at work
my little practice amp is easily 12ft away from my seat.
that´s about 10ms of delay as well, but it´s much more fun than playing through a sim
that´s about 10ms of delay as well, but it´s much more fun than playing through a sim
I was always annoyed by the latency too. Above 10ms it gets unbearable and it makes me lose my timing. If you got a powerful PC though and you can maintain a low latency and nice performance it shouldn't be that much of a problem.
@Nimvi: I feel the same. The cab plays a huge role in the final sound. And of course the mic picks up only a small part of that sound and it usually adds its own character too. Although I prefer the big and the practice setup to be one and the same. Now that makes you wanna play even more.
@Nimvi: I feel the same. The cab plays a huge role in the final sound. And of course the mic picks up only a small part of that sound and it usually adds its own character too. Although I prefer the big and the practice setup to be one and the same. Now that makes you wanna play even more.
texisthebest
Member
Melb_shredder
Orpheus: Melodic Death
botus99
Microphone Assassin
+1
I was able to play live drums with 3ms latency yesterday. Every time I bump up the buffer to the next setting (which makes it 6ms), keeping the feel alive is impossible.
Every time I compare Nebula/impulses with a new client or someone I'm jamming with the reaction is usually...
I'm with Nimvi on this one and for the same reasons.
I actually sold my big ass Blackstar-setup just the other day and am thinking about getting something small and simple for practising. Something that rather inspires me than works well live or recorded.
Soundwise, I can get decent enough guitar sounds with plugins, for my own use atleast: https://www.dropbox.com/s/w4pl5utcbxzpguh/Plugaritesti.mp3 <-- tried to make something useful after selling my amp.
But I hate sitting in front of the computer, playing. Plus, since my gear is in a different building from home, it's a pain in the ass to walk over to the studio, when I want to play something.
So all in all, for practising purpose, I'd take something small, convinient and inspiring, rather than something based on sonic values.
E: 21ms is shitloads of latency.. I keep mine around 1,5ms. All hail i7!
I actually sold my big ass Blackstar-setup just the other day and am thinking about getting something small and simple for practising. Something that rather inspires me than works well live or recorded.
Soundwise, I can get decent enough guitar sounds with plugins, for my own use atleast: https://www.dropbox.com/s/w4pl5utcbxzpguh/Plugaritesti.mp3 <-- tried to make something useful after selling my amp.
But I hate sitting in front of the computer, playing. Plus, since my gear is in a different building from home, it's a pain in the ass to walk over to the studio, when I want to play something.
So all in all, for practising purpose, I'd take something small, convinient and inspiring, rather than something based on sonic values.
E: 21ms is shitloads of latency.. I keep mine around 1,5ms. All hail i7!
I consider having a good ear, and I can't tell the diff between 5.8ms and 1.45ms, even 10ms does not feel annoying at all
I don't know man...when I play fast stuff and try to be tight I can tell there's a tiny lag even at 2-3ms. Not a deal breaker but still, it's there.
JoeMeek12397
Member
For me, even the smallest bit of latency ruins the feel that I'm after. In almost every situation I'd choose an amp.
MrBongo
idiot at work
put the amp 10ft away, and you got the same latency your computer has :Smug:
but that would mean no one of you could ever play live, like on stage and that stuff ?
but that would mean no one of you could ever play live, like on stage and that stuff ?
Jind
Grrrr!!! (I'm a bear)
- Mar 7, 2009
- 2,542
- 0
- 36
Sound travels 1130 feet / second. In milliseconds that's 1.13 feet / millisecond. However the more useful number is millisecond per foot which results as approximately .9 milliseconds/foot (rounded up from the actual .885) - so do the math for when a sound from a source hits you at any distance and you end up with the natural "latency" distance creates.
bryan_kilco
Member
In Reaper, your latency is ms is shown in the upper right hand corner, correct?
In a Profire 2626, the lowest buffer size is 64. I have a pretty powerful PC that was just built for me about 3 months ago and just yesterday I was trying to record guitars at 64 sample buffer and was getting crackles and popping. Sort bothered me as this thing SHOULD be able to handle it, and according to Reaper, I'm right around 3ms latency at 64 sample buffer (only running L1 on master and 4 instances of TSE 808, X50, LeCab, and EQ). If I set it higher to 128 samples, the problem is gone but I'm getting 4.3 ms latency. =/ It really isn't enough to throw me off though.
In a Profire 2626, the lowest buffer size is 64. I have a pretty powerful PC that was just built for me about 3 months ago and just yesterday I was trying to record guitars at 64 sample buffer and was getting crackles and popping. Sort bothered me as this thing SHOULD be able to handle it, and according to Reaper, I'm right around 3ms latency at 64 sample buffer (only running L1 on master and 4 instances of TSE 808, X50, LeCab, and EQ). If I set it higher to 128 samples, the problem is gone but I'm getting 4.3 ms latency. =/ It really isn't enough to throw me off though.
