So I need some guttural help.

[Kabookie]

I've just started into the whole grindcore scene recently, and I was interested in learning a certain type of screaming, mostly gutturals, I've been trying forever to achieve vocals like these:




No matter what I try I can't achieve the technique, so I was wondering if someone out there could possibly help me.

If this is in the wrong section, can a mod please move it.


So if you can help me, or anyone, please do!


If you need to contact me any other way:

email = kalebwtf@gmail.com
steam = kabookie
aim = ieatedyounagger


Thanks again.

 

[Alter]

Wrong section.

 

[panzerfaust666]

I dont know much about vocals.But if thats actually you, It sounds pretty good I think

 

[General Zaroff]

aim = ieatedyounagger

 

[cookiecutter]

My secret: chocolate milk

 

[Pessimism]

That's the dude from Malodorous; what most people don't realize is that there are two things most rely on for exhales.

One, the tongue - never under-estimate the tongue, its position is what will get you varying thickness and texture, especially when you combine that with your breathing exercises.

Two, is that how you sound with music can be totally different when compared to how you sound without music. Now, this isn't always true, some people can sound the same either way, to explain why it may sound different: all other sound will flow in conjunction with the sound you produce, and if there are frequencies that just don't go well together at all, you will be able to tell (shitty tonal harmony). It should also be mentioned that many people who do exhale vocals can also (and sometimes tend too) rely on the bottom end of what is heard (i.e. I mean is that the lower tuned instruments also lend tonal quality and texture to the vocalist).


Also, no one is immune to vocal chord damage; be careful, do not put too much strain on your chords, and no, you do not need to be at YELLING VOLUME in order to do gutturals. Some people do perfect gutturals as whispers, some talking level, some loud as hell - it's all about how you are built. Remember to use your diaphragm to push the air through your throat, and not the throat itself.

And if anyone can give me a reason for why inhales are "the gay" then please do; and if that reason is because there are scene kids in shitty death-core bands that use it...well, that's a pretty pathetic reason. What matters is the sound, and how it can be replicated.

 

[~Derek~]

What kind of vocals does Dying Fetus use? That's the kind I want to learn to do.

 

[The Ozzman]

I want to learn how to do gutturals correctly, but don't want to pay the eleventy billion dollars to do the zen of screaming stuff

 

[Pessimism]

Prob a mix of both (exhale or inhale - dying fetus is pretty damn easy to do with either of them), it could go either way; the point isn't how you do it though, it's how you sound doing it. There are many techniques, pick one that suits you and just try it. Yes, technique is one of the most important aspects, but so is comfort. If inhaling makes you unable to breather and exhaling is easier than by all means exhale; likewise if exhaling destroys your voice but inhaling gives you the same sound as an exhale then by all means exhale.

Just try a few different techniques and see what suits you.

 

[Pessimism]

I want to learn how to do gutturals correctly, but don't want to pay the eleventy billion dollars to do the zen of screaming stuff

I wouldn't buy it till I've talked to at least 20 people who have bought it that I have heard in person un-mic'd. The shit certainly has a lot of hype though... although that really doesn't mean shit when it comes to how well it teaches.

 

[The Ozzman]

I wouldn't buy it till I've talked to at least 20 people who have bought it that I have heard in person un-mic'd. The shit certainly has a lot of hype though... although that really doesn't mean shit when it comes to how well it teaches.

Well, if I were to do vox in a band, I'd definitely have to do training so I wouldn't blow my voice out. Just don't know of anyone around here who would teach the guttural type vox.

 

[Kabookie]

That's the dude from Malodorous; what most people don't realize is that there are two things most rely on for exhales.

One, the tongue - never under-estimate the tongue, its position is what will get you varying thickness and texture, especially when you combine that with your breathing exercises.

Two, is that how you sound with music can be totally different when compared to how you sound without music. Now, this isn't always true, some people can sound the same either way, to explain why it may sound different: all other sound will flow in conjunction with the sound you produce, and if there are frequencies that just don't go well together at all, you will be able to tell (shitty tonal harmony). It should also be mentioned that many people who do exhale vocals can also (and sometimes tend too) rely on the bottom end of what is heard (i.e. I mean is that the lower tuned instruments also lend tonal quality and texture to the vocalist).


Also, no one is immune to vocal fry; be careful, do not put too much strain on your chords, and no, you do not need to be at YELLING VOLUME in order to do gutturals. Some people do perfect gutturals as whispers, some talking level, some loud as hell - it's all about how you are built. Remember to use your diaphragm to push the air through your throat, and not the throat itself.

And if anyone can give me a reason for why inhales are "the gay" then please do; and if that reason is because there are scene kids in shitty death-core bands that use it...well, that's a pretty pathetic reason. What matters is the sound, and how it can be replicated.

Your probably the most helpful that anyones been, but what I don't get is how does he get that almost sewer gross nasty guttural sound type thing, you know, where it almost sounds like he's gargling on something gross.

That's what i'm trying to achieve.

 

[Pessimism]

Well, if I were to do vox in a band, I'd definitely have to do training so I wouldn't blow my voice out. Just don't know of anyone around here who would teach the guttural type vox.

I agree, which is why I took an operatic vocal training class in college - I highly recommend doing something like this.

Your probably the most helpful that anyones been, but what I don't get is how does he get that almost sewer gross nasty guttural sound type thing, you know, where it almost sounds like he's gargling on something gross.

That's what i'm trying to achieve.

It's a weird thing to describe; but I'll try in detail here:
First things first (and something I didn't really hint on in the last post); Jaw positioning: think of your inner mouth as an empty space that has a few objects here, there, a little bit of everywhere. Not only do you have a tongue that manipulates sound, but your ability to contort the empty space itself with your own jaw will change the pitch, timbre, and volume of the air that passes through the esophagus.

For "gurgly" shit there are a few ways and methods that can replicate the wet texture. One technique involves the tongue being placed at the tip of the bottom or top teeth with a slight curve along its body; lip positioning is important, but this is usually dependent on the structure of your jaw - so it would be a bit too hard to even explain - experiment with different shapes and angles (inwards, outwards, etc.)
Now, the throat itself is usually a little more constricted (I am not referring to your vocal chords, think more of the potion of your neck that is right where your jaw is above), and the constriction is important because it is used to force the exhaled/inhaled air into a pathway that will flow over your tongue and around the empty space in your mouth to create a sound. by altering the shape of this pathway, you are able to change the sonic texture and volume - but be warned, although all techniques can be applied to ex/inhaling, they are achieved differently (mainly due to tongue placement and breathe allotment).

Now, if you want the sewer sound without wetness (ala prostitute disfigurement) you basically force the air through smaller openings between your tongue and your mouth (most people do it with a tiny little 'o' on their lips, but it isn't necessary). The trick isn't just which portions are in the correct position though, it's the strength of the air flowing out of you. You don't have to push hard, but there better damn well be pressure - if done right you will not only have your normal overtone, but there will be a higher pitched undertone accompanying it.

 

[cookiecutter]

I just gurgle my saliva as deep in my throat as possible

 

[~Derek~]

Prob a mix of both (exhale or inhale - dying fetus is pretty damn easy to do with either of them), it could go either way; the point isn't how you do it though, it's how you sound doing it. There are many techniques, pick one that suits you and just try it. Yes, technique is one of the most important aspects, but so is comfort. If inhaling makes you unable to breather and exhaling is easier than by all means exhale; likewise if exhaling destroys your voice but inhaling gives you the same sound as an exhale then by all means exhale.

Just try a few different techniques and see what suits you.

Ok, I haven't learned to inhale yet, these are some exhales I recorded myself doing a while back though, Im guess I should try to go lower than that? How do I do inhales?

 

[Pessimism]

I'm going to try to upload some examples on youtube; let me see if my camera will record sound decently (my only option).

stick around, hopefully this won't take long.

 

[Kabookie]

I agree, which is why I took an operatic vocal training class in college - I highly recommend doing something like this.




It's a weird thing to describe; but I'll try in detail here:
First things first (and something I didn't really hint on in the last post); Jaw positioning: think of your inner mouth as an empty space that has a few objects here, there, a little bit of everywhere. Not only do you have a tongue that manipulates sound, but your ability to contort the empty space itself with your own jaw will change the pitch, timbre, and volume of the air that passes through the esophagus.

For "gurgly" shit there are a few ways and methods that can replicate the wet texture. One technique involves the tongue being placed at the tip of the bottom or top teeth with a slight curve along its body; lip positioning is important, but this is usually dependent on the structure of your jaw - so it would be a bit too hard to even explain - experiment with different shapes and angles (inwards, outwards, etc.)
Now, the throat itself is usually a little more constricted (I am not referring to your vocal chords, think more of the potion of your neck that is right where your jaw is above), and the constriction is important because it is used to force the exhaled/inhaled air into a pathway that will flow over your tongue and around the empty space in your mouth to create a sound. by altering the shape of this pathway, you are able to change the sonic texture and volume - but be warned, although all techniques can be applied to ex/inhaling, they are achieved differently (mainly due to tongue placement and breathe allotment).

Now, if you want the sewer sound without wetness (ala prostitute disfigurement) you basically force the air through smaller openings between your tongue and your mouth (most people do it with a tiny little 'o' on their lips, but it isn't necessary). The trick isn't just which portions are in the correct position though, it's the strength of the air flowing out of you. You don't have to push hard, but there better damn well be pressure - if done right you will not only have your normal overtone, but there will be a higher pitched undertone accompanying it.

Thank you so much, you seriously have no idea, but I do have 1 more question, when i'm forcing air out, should it be in a way as if i'm just going "GRRRRRRRRRR" but changing the pitch and positioning?

 

[Pessimism]

Yes, but there is always more than one way to do something; try it and experiment; then ask these questions: is it comfortable? - do I want to be louder or quieter? - does this hurt like a bitch? - what are the pro's/con's of this technique? - etc.





Here is a typical inhale for me; granted I haven't done one in about three weeks, but the idea is still the same.

Do you hear the undertones? They come in a little ways into the video (near the end it is most obvious), but when you hear it it should be obvious. This is due to a few things, one is the current state of your vocal chords, if they are damaged or not. the second comes from the inhalation of air and how it travels down your esophagus; because with the inhaling technique you are passing air through the cusp of your vocal folds first (instead of doing the normal vibrating pattern that comes with speech) you will get different sounds. This may feel wierd, but it shouldn't do any damage (unless of course you are breathing in glass or any type of shit that is chunky or will destroy your lungs.

 

[Kabookie]

Yes, but there is always more than one way to do something; try it and experiment; then ask these questions: is it comfortable? - do I want to be louder or quieter? - does this hurt like a bitch? - what are the pro's/con's of this technique? - etc.





Here is a typical inhale for me; granted I haven't done one in about three weeks, but the idea is still the same.

Holy shit.

That's pretty much the sound i'm looking for, just a bit deeper and exhale.

 

[Pessimism]

Also, I'm helping you as an individual - meaning no one else. Don't give anyone links to this or anything; I'd prefer vids or pics of me not circulating the net.