EDIT: This post is not actually directed at Metaltastic- quote removed.
I think the point Jordan is making, and I agree entirely, is that one's
perception of the mix is so dependent on the performance- especially in today's day and age. Our ears are so used to hearing things that have been so meticulously quantized and tuned to perfection, when you hear a recording without that investment, it sounds sub standard. If you can get an immaculately tight performance without the editing, then I imagine it will sound good anyways, but when you're working with real audio you will almost necessarily need to do some moving around.
Anyone who's spent time interacting with seasoned, professional AEs that work with recording artists on major labels will tell you how critical editing is when producing a record that is going to stand up beside other contemporary acts. Consider the As I Lay Dying thread that was ressurrected recently. People seemed to be completely dumbfounded that they would spend 60 days tracking guitars. In a perfect world, sure your musician's come in and lay down 12 tracks worth of quad track rhythm guitar parts in 2 hours with no punches and no edits. But the truth is, even when it comes to the most highly sought after studio players, the performances are STILL edited to perfection for commercial pop stuff. Jordan can atest to this having been on a few Jonas brother sessions and I know a few veteran AEs myself who've worked on similar projects that would say the same thing. The only advantage in that case is the editing is fairly painless because the performances are already so close to perfect.
One last thing, I think it's important to always consider someone's credentials when determining if they have any insight into a given subject. I personally consider myself a hobbyist when it comes to this stuff so while I think I have a decent understanding of how to make music, I haven't invested (nor do I intend to invest) the amount of time necessary to really have my opinion hold much weight. Someone like Jordan on the other hand makes a living doing this, and while he admits he's still learning too, he probably has some valuable experience into real-world engineering that might be helpful. One of the major differences between Jordan's work and the X number of other bedroom studio engineers on the board (my self included, that's not a diss) and I think, the purpose of this thread, is to try to give us a sense of the scope of a live recording and subsequent mix. Of course there are a lot of other regulars on the board who are qualified to do this but as he pointed out, a common misconception is that it's "crazy" or "unreasonable" to spend 8 hours tracking a pair of rhythm guitars. It's pretty standard practice if you want that immaculate, modern sound we're used to hearing in contemporary metal. A lot of people seem to wonder why they can't take their mixes to the next level when they've only invested an hour or two into getting the source material
ready for mixing.
To summarize, what I'm getting at, is how crucial pitch and time are to our overall perception of a mix. I don't think any professional AE could "mix" poor performances to sound good in the modern sense without doing some major surgery on the source material first.
And sorry Metaltastic, that wasn't all directed at you, I just got going on a different tangent. You're obviously a very knowledgable individual on this forum.
), I can easily imagine an absurd amount of editing being involved in that if they were even slightly sub-par musicians! I must say jval, that does sound really goddamn good (not crazy about the kick, but man those guitars rule - was that really a Mesa 2x12?)
