Sound needs Depth

[SteelAngelOpera]

Ok... I use Fruity Loops 7 to mix my music - I play Symphonic metal and to mix the strings in with the guitars I do a lot of midi programming, so FL Studio works really well for this.

From there, I transfer an untouched MP3 file over to Sonar and record the vocals... and then once it's all EQ'd, cleaned up, and ready to go...

Suddenly I notice it sounds flat. Not like flat in pitch, like... it's coming off of a Nintendo game system. Flat. There's no depth to the sound. I listen to bands like Leave's Eyes and Nightwish - there sound is so huge, it just wraps around the user... but mine is flat. Bam, bam, left and right stereo. There's no depth.

I've tried using surround sound panners (yeah, don't have any clue how to work those), Reverb chambers... nothing seems to be working. Anyone have any idea how to fix this? You can find my work at www.myspace.com/steelangeloperafan .

Thx.

Steel

 

[Zack Uidl]

why are you using mp3 files? bad move there

 

[botus99]

what are you using for monitors?

 

[|Thanatos]

I read the title "Sound needs Opeth"


Anyway, I think some of the problem may be due to the fact that you use mp3 instead of high quality wavs when exporting/importing stuff.

 

[Notuern]

After listening to those tracks, I have to say that I think your problem lies in that you don't give each instrument its own space in the mix.
Use EQ, Multiband-Compression & Sidechaining to let everything in the mix have its own place, otherwise you will end up with a flat undefined mush of sounds.
I recorded a symphonic "black metal"-song in the style of Dimmu Borgir a while ago, I'm gonna look around and try to find my old FL-projects to send over to you.


http://media.putfile.com/Need-to-get-a-hobby (Only drums, but programmed & mixed in FL, and I think it has depth.)
http://media.putfile.com/ballad-77 (Only guitars, and more overcompressed drums, but I think it has depth too.)
http://www.myspace.com/lastshoutofficial (This mix has been made ALOT better, and myspace fucks it up even more. >,<)

Now I know that neither of those are perfect examples, but I think that they have a good depth.

 

[paladin shredder]

to mix something that has depth, you need to mix with the mindset that what you are hearing is 3-dimensional. left, right, up, down, forwards, backwards. obviously the left and right is taken care of with panning. up and down usually refer to the frequency's of the instruments, the bass sounds more like its coming from the bottom and the highs are at the top. so ask yourself, "does this particular instrument rely mostly on bass, mids, highs, or a combination?" only a few instruments really take up the whole spectrum.

then backwards and forwards is achieved by volume, but also reverb/delay. obviously if you want something up front in a mix, you make it loud and dry (no reverb). you want something in the background, you lower the volume and make it wet (lots or reverb). the hardest part is deciding on volume vs. reverb for each instrument. this is where you start creating a "space" for the instruments. not everything can be in the same place if you want depth. that means lowering the reverb on the things you want "up front" and lowering the volume and maybe adding reverb to what belongs in the background. the best way to find out what goes where is just by listening to professional cds. start hearing where everything is comparative to everything else.

edit: ok here's a good rule you can try since you are using samples in fruity loops. DON'T use an equalizer on any pre-made samples. only use eq on things you've recorded yourself. instead, try using volume vs. reverb to achieve the sound you're after. find the right place in the stereo image first. remember, those samples are pre-made that way for a reason!

 

[Notuern]

to mix something that has depth, you need to mix with the mindset that what you are hearing is 3-dimensional. left, right, up, down, forwards, backwards. obviously the left and right is taken care of with panning. up and down usually refer to the frequency's of the instruments, the bass sounds more like its coming from the bottom and the highs are at the top. so ask yourself, "does this particular instrument rely mostly on bass, mids, highs, or a combination?" only a few instruments really take up the whole spectrum.

then backwards and forwards is achieved by volume, but also reverb/delay. obviously if you want something up front in a mix, you make it loud and dry (no reverb). you want something in the background, you lower the volume and make it wet (lots or reverb). the hardest part is deciding on volume vs. reverb for each instrument. this is where you start creating a "space" for the instruments. not everything can be in the same place if you want depth. that means lowering the reverb on the things you want "up front" and lowering the volume and maybe adding reverb to what belongs in the background. the best way to find out what goes where is just by listening to professional cds. start hearing where everything is comparative to everything else.

+1

That was kind of what i tried to say with my message, but you gave it the technical view(Im too lazy for that nowdays.).

Also, panning instruments will give other instruments space to "move" in the mix too.
So thats another part of the equation.