Tastes differ...

Chephren

New Metal Member
Jan 5, 2010
21
0
1
Austria
"A lack of direction and discipline makes The Never Ending Way of ORwarriOR both a massive disappointment and a colossal failure

"Mabool was an unbelievably fresh listen when it was released six years ago. Of course fresh is a conflicted word to use when concerning Orphaned Land, who put almost 8 years of work into the album. One could easily assume that by the time of it's release the Isreali four[-hundred] piece outfit would have grown pretty tired of what fans were being newly exposed to. So now, another six years in waiting we've got Mabool's long awaited follow-up. The Never Ending Way of ORwarriOR begs the question of how Orphaned Land can match Mabool's freshness. How can they re-capture the impact of an album fans have had six years to absorb? On first listen, the answer is blatant if contrived---the solution, it would seem, would be to more or less release the same album over again. As far as aesthetic goes, The Never Ending Way of ORwarriOR comes about as close as a Vietnamese knock off. It features many of the same sounds and ideas, but captures none of Mabool's intangibles and effervescence.

Obviously crafted with all-things-grandiose in mind, The Never Ending Way of ORwarriOR falls hardest as a result of its grandeur. Everything from the album's overlong title to its bloated hour and eighteen minute run-time feels like fodder for comparisons, but what made Mabool so special was how naturally it flowed from point A to point B and how it did so while developing a story that may or may not have mattered to the listener. On The Never Ending Way of ORwarriOR, Orphaned Land seem to be throwing things in just for the sake of doing so. As a result, it's a tedious listen; I think it took somewhere around four attempts for me to make it through the entire thing in one sitting. It certainly feels like it took six years to make, but only because it's chock filled with everything from choirs to misplaced modem sound effects (surely a result of enlisting egomaniac and self-proclaimed super-producer Steven Wilson). It sacrifices cohesion and linearity for sheer girth and when it comes to contemporary metal, I'm a firm believer that thin is in. It takes about 15 minutes before we get to “Treading Through Darkness”, the first part of the two-track “The Path”. I'm not sure the wait is warranted---both “Sapari” and “Bereft in the Abyss” are underdeveloped and lacklustre and even “From Broken Vessels” feels out of place sandwiched between what is largely a nonsequitur of an intro and a disposable acoustic 3 minutes of melodrama. Nonsequitur might be the word that best captures the album as a whole, with “The Pilgrimage to or Shalem” (or “The Path – Part Two”) being little more than an extended wank session. A seven and a half minute wank session that undermines its first part, which is easily the best song on the album and a highlight of the band's growing catalogue.

More or less all of the album's faults follow this pattern. I'd call it formulaic, with the key ingredient to its recipe being over-saturation. Whether it's the feeling that every song begins and ends with a middle eastern women singing God knows what (obviously trying to echo the street-singing found on Mabool) or the fact that its full of 7 minute songs that go nowhere, many of The Never Ending Way of ORwarriOR's faults can be chocked up to over-ambition and Steven Wilson's deplorable work as producer. Having made a career out of being in love with his own ideas, Wilson never sees fit to reign the band in and as a result we're left with songs like “The Pilgrimage to or Shalem” and “The Warrior”, two seven-plus minute tracks featuring little more than hair-blowing-in-the-wind soloing, with the latter opening with a nauseating voice-over. Pair those with the album's forgettable opening 15 minutes and we're at nearly half an hour of throwaway, and for what? That's 40 minutes of music with about 8 that aren't terrible, a trend that's sadly present throughout the rest of the album. “Treading Through Darkness” and “Codeword: Uprising” are the only songs I can truly call good from start to finish. Even the best parts of “Disciples of the Sacred Oath II” and “In Thy Never Ending Way” are surrounded by vapid chugging, soloing and displaced crooning---filler in other words. There simply aren't many hooks to be found and with an album as long as this one that makes for a tedious, frustrating listen.

Two and a half solid songs and a handful of memorable melodies scattered throughout 15 tracks and 80 minutes makes The Never Ending Way of ORwarriOR both a massive disappointment and a colossal failure. While it's not a consistently terrible album, that fact exists more as a result of the album's crippling inconsistency. When the band is on, they're on, and in a few instances they still show the unbridled potential we hoped they'd deliver on, but as a whole The Never Ending Way of ORwarriOR is evidence of a total lack of direction and discipline. The middle-Eastern instruments very rarely fit within the songs, usually popping in as little more than invokers of extended chug sections (meaning that you'll usually hear a pause in the track followed by an out of place middle eastern melody, which is then quickly transposed into down-tuned guitar chugging). Orphaned Land have gotten incrementally heavier and they're more determined to show their technical capabilities, but The Never Ending Way of ORwarriOR feels worse for it. The album took six years to make and I'd believe it; not because it's a success, but because it comes off as if they put absolutely every idea they amassed in 72 months of studio work into the album---both in run time and desultoriness."

source: sputnikmusic.com


I know that other people´s opinions do not have effect on me, but somehow, this kinda makes me upset and insecure... although I loved Sapari and the new song.... what about you?
 
There is a little amount of bullshit in that review (72 months of studio work...it was more like 6 months I think, and wtf is street singing? There was only a short sample at the beginning of 'birth of the three' but what it has to do with the female vocals?) but I'm kinda concerned now.
I heard so far 4 tracks from this album:
Sapari
Vayehi Or
Barakah ( it was on youtube)
and Disciples of the Sacred Oath II.

Sapari was okay, kinda catchy but really flat.
Vayehi Or was catchy too but had a replay value of 4 listenings, after that it just sound boring.
I've heard Disciples of the Sacred Oath II like 10 times to really know what's going in that song, but it's really has some awkward riffs and have an overall feeling of lack of direction, kinda forgetable song.
Barakah is just uninteresting. It has a cool catchy melody at the beginning but then it's just filled with "by the book" riffs and goes nowhere.

Even that 4 out of 15 tracks are disappointment for me, I'll still check out the full album when it will come out.
However, my great expectation for that album has been really crubed now.
 
When will they all get it: Steven Wilson did NOT produce this album...
Otherwise this is a review with arguments, nothing to say about it. Kobi already said (and as reads this review): this album is long, very long. And very heavy. Some will digest it, some other not...
Still by reading some comments in the review i suspect some kind of bad faith because Steven Wilson is named on the album and the attacks are indirectly for him...
 
Hehe, this sounds like a typical review for an experimental and intricately composed progressive metal or art-rock release done by a non-progressive metal fan.
Alternative forms of composition are just not easy to digest.
 
If I only gave what I listened to one chance, I would be listening to nothing. Just about everything I listen to now, I did not care for at first. Over months did I get into most of the bands who are now my favorites. I like all three songs I've heard off of this album, especially Disciples of the Sacred Oath II. That guy definitely has something against Steven Wilson, and I would have to agree with Postmodernist that that guy probably doesn't even listen to progressive metal, hence making ORwarriOR difficult for him to digest.
 
Hehe, this sounds like a typical review for an experimental and intricately composed progressive metal or art-rock release done by a non-progressive metal fan.
Alternative forms of composition are just not easy to digest.

Man, listen to some classical music. Most progressive metal is TERRIBLY composed cut-and-paste nonsense. Composition and structure (along with emotional expression) are actually the genre's biggest weakpoints, and I'm a huge fan of it. This band especially falls into that niche. It's absurd to write this guy's review off as 'he just doesn't get the style'. There's nothing particularly alternative about the composition style of prog-metal, it's just pieced together for the most part. Try '60s texture music, serialism, spectralism, aleatory music... hell, even minimalism for an 'alternative form of composition'.

With that said, Orphaned Land has always sucked, and while what this guy says about Steve Wilson is at least partially true, the attacks at him are misplaced.
 
Hey FrogHawk, you're giving your recommendation to a wrong person. A far incomplete list of my musical preferences:

Liquid Tension Experiment, J. S. Bach, Tony Levin, Jordan Rudess, W. A. Mozart, John Petrucci, A. Vivaldi, Mike Portnoy, Dream Theater, California Guitar Trio, Niacin, Joe Satriani, L. Beethoven, Rakhmaninov, Haggard, Sviridov, Estatic Fear, ApocalypticA, Wagner, Yanni Hrisomallis, Loreena McKennitt, Steve Morse, Wolf Hoffman, Orphaned Land, Sepultura (90ies), Secret Garden, Pantera, Jesse Cook, Bugotak, Jacques Loussier Trio, The Cranberries, Shlomit Levi, Kyrgyz music, ethno/folk/tribal/world music, new-age/neo-classics, ethearal, flamenco, UneXpect, Emilia Autumn, Diablo Swing Orchestra, symphonic/atmospheric doom, thrash metal, art rock, jazz/fusion, avantgarde metal, arrangements of classics, Forest Stream, Altan Urag, Rodrigo y Gabriela, tributes to Metallica, symphonic, folk and jazz arrangements of metal, Vas, Irfan, Kopruler, Myriads, Chalice, Iron Maiden, sXe hardcore, Frozen Throne, Arcane Grail, Narsilion, Adorned Brood, Dead Can Dance, Blackmore's Night, oriental metal, Gregorian, Armenian music, Persian music, Kevin Moore, Arabic music, Yemeni Music, Jewish music, The Doors, The Moon and The Nightspirit, God Is An Astronaut, Bryats Band, Beliy Den', Richard Cheese, The Merlons of Nehemiah, Morgenstern, Yasmin Levy, Trans-Siberian Orchestra, Graveworm, Therion, Shroud of Bereavement, Azam Ali, Rise Against, Bol'shoy Detskiy Hor, Räfven, klezmer music, Atargatis, Dolapdere Big Gang, Aghora, Amaseffer, Shostakovich, Australian indigenous music, African indigenous music, post-rock, intellectual dance music, athentic medieval music, shamanic music, Sami music, Siberian music, throat singing, opera (Verdi, Bizet), Bolivar music, Serbian music, Macedonian music, Bosnian music, authentic music of India, Buddha lounge, meditative music, dark and neo-folk...

I tried minimal techno, also post-industrial, experimental noise, minimal folk - that kind of music is not something I like however I see the point in them and I would just avoid writing a review about music (meaning genre) which I lack liking or understanding of.

If you are so destructively critical about Orphaned Land's way of composing, please tell me at least one song from any band which would combine synagogue chant, Qu'ran chant, growling, thrash metal riffs, syncopated drum patterns, Middle Eastern stringed instruments and flutes and Yemeni singing.
 
Man, listen to some classical music. Most progressive metal is TERRIBLY composed cut-and-paste nonsense. Composition and structure (along with emotional expression) are actually the genre's biggest weakpoints, and I'm a huge fan of it. This band especially falls into that niche. It's absurd to write this guy's review off as 'he just doesn't get the style'. There's nothing particularly alternative about the composition style of prog-metal, it's just pieced together for the most part. Try '60s texture music, serialism, spectralism, aleatory music... hell, even minimalism for an 'alternative form of composition'.


There are in fact those who find it offensive to have their favorite genre (metal, in this case) messed with in any way. They see experimentation and progression as a way of saying that there is something wrong with metal. Those people would obviously have a problem with Steven Wilson and Orphaned Land so what Postmodernist says is a very possible explanation, but no one can be sure if this is why he dislikes the album. As the title of this thread suggests, sometimes tastes simply differ.

Actually, I don't see how you fail to see the parallel between Orphaned Land's music and Classical music. Just listen to the songs; Rainbow (The Resurrection), The Evil Urge (especially the outro), or simply go to their website and listen to the beautiful piano piece in the teaser. All are quite emotional songs with strong Classical influences.
 
Look- tates differ. As for the whole discussion giving the cd such a low mark. I have seen about 40 reviews of the album at least. Most of them give the album 8/10 up to 10/10 and 2x album of the month from big mags. So- draw your conclusion from the average number of this total.
 
A summary of a rather observational review (my rough translation from Polish):

+ ORwarriOR has many beautiful acoustic pieces.
+ Much hot Middle Eastern folk.
+ Plenty of prog metal (incl. long guitar solos a-la John Petrucci), epic long tracks, includes many rhythm changes characteristic for progressive metal.
+ Kobi - the vocalist - is working out by 200% by singing in several absolutely different styles.
+ Growling and drive proportion approximately like in Mabool.
+ Many atmospheric effects used (also popular in progressive metal).
+ Female vocals used on 4-5 tracks, also using different manners of singing.
 
There is a little amount of bullshit in that review (72 months of studio work...it was more like 6 months I think, and wtf is street singing? There was only a short sample at the beginning of 'birth of the three' but what it has to do with the female vocals?) but I'm kinda concerned now.
I heard so far 4 tracks from this album:
Sapari
Vayehi Or
Barakah ( it was on youtube)
and Disciples of the Sacred Oath II.

Sapari was okay, kinda catchy but really flat.
Vayehi Or was catchy too but had a replay value of 4 listenings, after that it just sound boring.
I've heard Disciples of the Sacred Oath II like 10 times to really know what's going in that song, but it's really has some awkward riffs and have an overall feeling of lack of direction, kinda forgetable song.
Barakah is just uninteresting. It has a cool catchy melody at the beginning but then it's just filled with "by the book" riffs and goes nowhere.

Even that 4 out of 15 tracks are disappointment for me, I'll still check out the full album when it will come out.
However, my great expectation for that album has been really crubed now.

All I have to say so far: If you don't like Disciples Of The Sacred Oath II, I'm sorry to say you wont like this album: plain and simple.

Btw, saying that Disciples is "kinda a forgetable song", is a good proof of complete lack of music sense and knowledge to my understanding (I don't mean to offense, but it's natural for me to say things as I feel them, you could say that our tastes differ pretty much if you preffer). That or you just didn't listen to the song propertly in time and depth,'cause is basically one of the best songs, not only in this album but in OL whole career.

So that is, if you don't like it, better save your money for another record.

Regarding this review...well a review is an article of opinion, which mean you say just what you think of an album. My opinion to this review: the guy who wrote it don't like prog music and haven't even trie to understand this album.

I can understand it: when you are reviewing for a magazine or webzine or whatever you are licensed with labels you normally have a HUGE amount of albums (which can be like 20-40 albums per month) to listen and review and if you are not really interested in some of then but you have to review them anyway, you give em a couple of listens and you write what you think: it's not fair but it is as it is.

Peace!
 
As alredy commented about this "opinion":

Originally Posted by BC-A
But they deserve to have an opinion, moreover when it is argued...

and opinions are like balls, everyone has his own :D

but, i think, a review is more than express merely an opinion, everyone is able to say: I agree, I don't like, shit, chocolate.

The critic must go deeper traing to stay outside his taste, try to understand if the artist has been able to keep the goal regardless if you like it or not, regardless your expectation.

You can't like Michelangelo or Van Gogh or Picasso, but, if you are a "critic", you have to recognise their genius, their technical skill, their capacity to communicate through their art exactly what they wanted to.

In few words, you have to discover WHY the artist chooses a specific formula to say something and how this choise works in the context.

Then you can express an aesthetic opinion ("this is shit" )

I wonder, among other things, that almost no reviewer has noticed the improved ORWARRIOR's cinematic approach compared to the previous works.
The album is structured to keep high the listener's attention, alternating long tracks full of action with short pieces very melodic and relaxing as a good action movie.... and no one noticed...