They still worship the sun or Saturn !

[hexwind]

Hey guys , I was rambling on Google last time and I found some old documentaries of Jordan Maxwell , talking about religion and politics, like, The three mainstream religions are based on Sun/Saturn worshipping ! and he says do your homework. I'm doing it lol, and i wanna share some ideas with you !
here are the links :
[ame]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8394844811105390386[/ame]
[ame]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8701863412120241475&hl=en[/ame]
http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=jordan+maxwell+the+naked+truth&hl=en&emb=0#

well.. there are some stuff misrepresented, example , he says that the black square is a symbol of Saturn worshipping, and that's why in Mecca (the religious Islamic city) there is a black Square, otherwise known as Qu'aba, but it's not actually a "black square" , it's only a cover made by the Turkish when they controlled that place in a certain point.
Discuss. i would be glad to see your opinions
Thank you ^^

 

[hexwind]

wtf, no one is interested in such things?? !

 

[Hox]

Sorry, Saturn does not interest me. I am all about Satan.

 

[Crepuscularia]

I actually do think this is an interesting topic; especially how pagan ceremonies and rituals have found their way into Christianity.

I just don't have four hours to spare to watch the videos.

Holy crap those are long.....

 

[hexwind]

^ do it once u got time lol !

 

[Vamos]

Personally I see no problem with the notion that certain pagan elements have been incorporated into Christianity. There are two extremes when it comes to this issue, first there are those who refuse to admit any pagan influence (specially from Hellenism) in Christianity and Judaism and others who go overboard and infer that Christianity is nothing more than a fabricated pagan mystery religion and then go out of their way to "prove" a bunch of similarities between pagan religions and Christianity.

I am very much of the same mind of St. Augustine when it comes to this: "Moreover, if those who are called philosophers, and especially the Platonists, have said anything that is true and in harmony with our faith, we are not only not to shrink from it, but to claim it for our own use [...] all branches of heathen learning have not only false and superstitious fancies [...] but they contain also liberal instruction which is better adapted to the use of the truth."

The videos are a bit long to watch now but I have seen these arguments made several times and I used to be into them before

 

[Kenneth R.]

wtf, no one is interested in such things?? !

The topic is highly interesting, however the conclusions drawn are hardly substantiated. Essentially while people may find theology fascinating, they are not the least interested in what amounts to conspiracy theory and wind.

 

[metal_wrath]

Good thread

 

[ajntorinj]

He's right; Christians do worship the son.

 

[hexwind]

He's right; Christians do worship the son.

Yeah, but he claims that they worship the SUN not the son ov God.

 

[Vamos]

They never make up their mind. We worship the sun, a pagan god, ours is a mistery religion, a copycat of Mithraism, Zoroathrianism, St. Paul was actually a gnostic and Jesus never existed, etc, etc. It seems that people are willing to consider any sort of thory about Christianity, everything but what is contained in the Scriptures. I think that not even serious skeptics are taking stuff like this seriously.

 

[ajntorinj]

Yeah, but he claims that they worship the SUN not the son ov God.

Thanks for explaining my joke to me.

 

[Nasty-Fire]

^^ Yes but who cares about the Scriptures?

 

[Vamos]

^^ Yes but who cares about the Scriptures?

I do.

 

[Nasty-Fire]

¬¬ ... come on I know you do. But I mean, there is no proof that the Scriptures are more right about "Jesus" than anything else. It's a damn book. I think all these theories are precisely alternatives to the Scriptures and such things.

 

[Vamos]

Well, if you ignore manuscript evidence and also the long unbroken tradition that believed in the Scriptures as well as testimony from non-Christian sources, then you could say that. Even atheists no longer take the claims of people like the ones in the video seriously (others like them are Acharya S). Anyone who claims that Christians worship the sun or any "creature" show an abysmal ignorance of both the Jewish and Christian tradition. You could argue that certain pagan symbolism has been adopted and incorporated into the faith in order to better convey certain beliefs (and I personally see no problem with that), but that is a far cry from worshiping the sun.

 

[Nasty-Fire]

Well, if you ignore manuscript evidence and also the long unbroken tradition that believed in the Scriptures as well as testimony from non-Christian sources, then you could say that.

Manuscript evidence!? Well, maybe long unbroken tradition believed in the Scriptures, but the epoch of Jesus is so far in the past that it's easy to believe that the Scriptures were modified during the years, and we don't know at which point. Anyway, I'm out of this thread since I don't know shit about all this, but I'll listen to these video with pleasure. I never get your points anyway.

 

[hexwind]

Thanks for explaining my joke to me.

Dude, we have different cultural background so we might not get each other's jokes

 

[hexwind]

Well, if you ignore manuscript evidence and also the long unbroken tradition that believed in the Scriptures as well as testimony from non-Christian sources, then you could say that. Even atheists no longer take the claims of people like the ones in the video seriously (others like them are Acharya S). Anyone who claims that Christians worship the sun or any "creature" show an abysmal ignorance of both the Jewish and Christian tradition. You could argue that certain pagan symbolism has been adopted and incorporated into the faith in order to better convey certain beliefs (and I personally see no problem with that), but that is a far cry from worshiping the sun.

You seem like a christian aren't you? Could you explain why people go to worship their God in a church? did Jesus mentioned the Church as a temple? Did he tell you that he IS the Son ov God? All this sounds like a false beliefs or sth, i'm not trying to offend your religion (or Christianity in case you aren't a christian) but i'm just trying to know about it.

 

[Vamos]

You seem like a christian aren't you?

I am a Roman Catholic.

Could you explain why people go to worship their God in a church? did Jesus mentioned the Church as a temple?

He called it his house and a place of prayer and that is very much what we go to Church to. Even from Old Testament times, when God was dealing with the Jews as a nation, he told them to build a place for prayer/worship and even dedicated a group of people for the priesthood and to handle things related to the temple. Christ did not come to abolish the notion of a Church and in fact you see in the New Testament that they speak about priests, bishops, church and the like and of Christians gathering together for worship.

Did he tell you that he IS the Son ov God?

Me in particular? No. But he sure did all over the gospels. Here is one example: “Jesus saith to them: But whom do you say that I am? Simon Peter answered and said: Thou art Christ, the Son of the living God.” (Matthew 16:15-16). He accepted the answer. He also answers in the affirmative when the Jews ask him whether he is the Son of God (Matthew 26:63-64; Luke 22:70).

Hope that helps.