Tracking DI guitars with RME Babyface - input clipping?

[ttiwguitar]

Hey guys, I'll preface this with the usual "sorry if this has been brought up before, I tried to search for it and couldn't find any useful info" apology... but I have a quick question for anyone who uses a Babyface for tracking guitars. My band is recording an EP next month and we'll be doing guitars and bass at home to be reamped later at the studio we'll be mixing at. I've been using the Babyface for a couple of months now and I love it, but I was doing some test tracks this week and noticed that when I plug my guitar into the instrument input on the side of the Babyface, the signal will occasionally jump over the 0 dB mark if I play with too much "gusto". I have a pretty heavy hand, so I'd rather not alter my picking technique to keep the signal from clipping... since the Babyface's instrument input is set at a non-negotiable level of +9.0 dB of gain, am I better off running a direct box into one of the Babyface's XLR inputs and adjusting the gain that way? Just doesn't make sense to me that the built-in instrument input would clip for any reason, especially since I'm not using active pickups. Any advice at all would be appreciated. Thanks dudes.

 

[colonel_claypoo]

since the Babyface's instrument input is set at a non-negotiable level of +9.0 dB of gain

so are you saying you can't change the gain and it's always set at it's lowest level of 9db or that you can't go below 9db. the latter case is true, you can't but I've never come across an instrument and player that would clip the input with the input gain set to 9db. most of my instruments seem to like it around 30.

you could try plugging the guitar into a direct box and connecting the XLR out to the breakout cable of the babyface. set the gain of your channel to 9db as well and see if it still clips.

however, I don't know why your guitar clips the input at only 9db of gain.
do you have anything else in your signal chain or is it: guitar-cable-instrument input?

 

[deLuther]

It`s not unusual to get clipping with passive pickups, specifications on RME site says: "Maximum Input Level for 0 dBFS: +12 dBu",
manual says: " Maximum input level TRS, Gain 9 dB: +12 dBu"
It`s not too much, SD SH/TB-4 with hard picking style can output more than that (it can output even more than +14.2 dbu).
Active pickups are much easier to deal with, they never output peak voltage greater than half of supply voltage minus some value (usually 1.5 V or more, depends on operational amplifier used and supply voltage).

 

[ttiwguitar]

so are you saying you can't change the gain and it's always set at it's lowest level of 9db or that you can't go below 9db. the latter case is true, you can't but I've never come across an instrument and player that would clip the input with the input gain set to 9db. most of my instruments seem to like it around 30.

you could try plugging the guitar into a direct box and connecting the XLR out to the breakout cable of the babyface. set the gain of your channel to 9db as well and see if it still clips.

however, I don't know why your guitar clips the input at only 9db of gain.
do you have anything else in your signal chain or is it: guitar-cable-instrument input?

Exactly, it won't let me lower the gain from 9.0 dB. Nothing in the signal but a guitar and a cable.

 

[ttiwguitar]

It`s not unusual to get clipping with passive pickups, specifications on RME site says: "Maximum Input Level for 0 dBFS: +12 dBu",
manual says: " Maximum input level TRS, Gain 9 dB: +12 dBu"
It`s not too much, SD SH/TB-4 with hard picking style can output more than that (it can output even more than +14.2 dbu).
Active pickups are much easier to deal with, they never output peak voltage greater than half of supply voltage minus some value (usually 1.5 V or more, depends on operational amplifier used and supply voltage).

Makes sense. I assumed active pickups were hotter by nature, but that's not necessarily true as they tend to squash dynamics a bit. Thanks for the info, guys... gonna try using a direct box next.

 

[deLuther]

EMG mentions 4.5 Vpp (peak to peak) when operating at 9 V, i.e. actual peak level is around 2.25 V.
http://www.emgpickups.com/content/wiringdiagrams/PowerTips_Tricks_0230-0190C.pdf
Blackouts slightly more output at 9 V - closer to 3 V.
Passive pickups does not have any restrictions.

 

[waltz mastering]

An easy fix would be to turn the volume control on the guitar lower or use a 10 dB pad and then adjust for the gain on sim if you're using one.

 

[deLuther]

Volume with passive pickups can affect tone, especial if moderately reduced, also there is tone compensating volume schematic on the Seymour Duncan site.
To use pad, pad must be present on particular interface

 

[ttiwguitar]

Turns out it was all due to the pickups being a little too close to the strings... duh. Thanks for the help, guys.

 

[deLuther]

Passive pickups can significant change output level with every millimeter, but also highs are reduced, it`s somewhat similar to effect of guitar volume.

 

[bryan_kilco]

This guy again....what up Allan?