Transgender

[Charvelguy]

I wanna know if the fruit flies wore pink feather boas, demanded equality and went on a yearly parade down the middle of town...yes, inquiring minds.

 

[razoredge]

I wanna know if the fruit flies wore pink feather boas, demanded equality and went on a yearly parade down the middle of town...yes, inquiring minds.

naw, they were prolly locked up in a cell with nothing but other male fruitflys, so they got desperate and put their motor skills to work by rubbing up against each other, thereby determined to be performing erotic homosexual acts... but after all what would you do if you only lived for one season and making maggots was a priority motor function... opps, sorry I forgot you are now a insect and dont think... only act on impulse so I suppose thats a bad question

 

[razoredge]

umm, want me one of them "real jocks" after all... we know any "real jock" is gay... yeehaw...ridem cowboy

 

[The Poona of Peshwa]

Ok, you guys are right. Fucking attention-whore faggots probably want to get abused because they've got daddy-issues right? What's a guy to do when faced with such unrelenting annoying-ness? Pay no attention? Live and let live? No! Of course not. The natural thing to do is get repulsed and blame society for turning our kids into pansies! Why kowtow to one messed-up, mentally ill attention whore by sending the good wholesome boys who abused him to jail, thereby ruining a perfectly good life? The kid was asking for it after all.

People shouldn't be able to live their lives unmolested if it makes some people uncomfortable. That's the way it was throughout history, and that's the way it is now in our global democracy, in spite of constant PC re-inforcement in the media, in the government and especially in the labs, all paid for by shadowy liberal figures. Fuck science especially, it's both given us the nuclear bomb and freed us from genocides which did the handy-dandy task of rooting out the weak (which would have undoubtedly included trannies). I finally comprehend the subtleties and the razor-sharp logic of your position after all. You win, man. High five!

Gay fruit flies haha! That was a good one!

 

[razoredge]

global democracy..........
constant PC re-inforcement in the media..........

but you wouldnt understand the joke

Ok, you guys are right.

but I already know this

Fucking attention-whore faggots probably want to get abused because they've got daddy-issues

careful now your ignoring... constant PC re-inforcement in the media. Who knows what their problem is but its theirs not a problem that should be exposed to the children of normal decent people. Also use of logic predated "global democracy" and "political correctness" by centuries... apparently some now believe the later two cancel the need to apply logic

blame society for turning our kids into pansies!

now thats a whole nother topic right there but I dont think its got to do with the whole of society only a certain percentage... Im waiting for scientific data

the good wholesome boys who abused him to jail

they obviously broke a law but if the situation is where the poor poor dead child showed up for school in drag... his parents as well as school officials belong in the same jail cell, thats called accountability

That's the way it was throughout history

yes throughout history those that did not apply common sense have typically recieved some kind of attitude adjustment, this establishes a natural selection of thought, lets call it multiple choice that has one extremely bad answer

rock hot... me pick up rock ??? sure go ahead the politically correct media says its alright

government and especially in the labs, all paid for by shadowy liberal figures

great razor sharp interpretation, its no surprise you didnt hold up... its in who distributes the findings in select pieces, picking and choosing in order to keep the frosting free of finger prints

Fuck science especially, it's both given us the nuclear bomb and freed us from genocides which did the handy-dandy task of rooting out the weak (which would have undoubtedly included trannies).

this is partially true, but it is a fact that science has been a double edged sword, Im not aware that theres any denial of that but who would be surprised if some tried

I finally comprehend the subtleties and the razor-sharp logic of your position after all.

hate to disappoint you but you actually failed miserably

You win, man. High five!

There are no winners when logic fails to prevail

Gay fruit flies haha!

Isnt it ironic

 

[Seditious]

I'm sure all they are asking for is to be treated fairly, and equally.

that, and legislation against science.


an XY can get a drivers license to say he's XX... can I get one that says I'm 18 so I can fuck teenagers? who cares what science says my age is, that's not what I want to be, so just change the records, fucker.


fuck, lemme rape the bitch and prove to the cops I aint a suspect---the license shows I'm a woman, and you're lookin for a man, hah! oh, the suspect was about 6'2? good thing my license says 5'10!


I don't want rights taken from weirdos, and I don't want stupid ass laws repealed, all I ask for is equality.

 

[BlackMetalWhiteGuy]

I never walk away and never sway

Whoa, my country has a president who is JUST like this!

naw, they were prolly locked up in a cell with nothing but other male fruitflys, so they got desperate and put their motor skills to work by rubbing up against each other, thereby determined to be performing erotic homosexual acts... but after all what would you do if you only lived for one season and making maggots was a priority motor function... opps, sorry I forgot you are now a insect and dont think... only act on impulse so I suppose thats a bad question

If they were secluded with other male fruit flies exclusively, then it would not have been a logical deduction that homosexuality was the natural force at work. Homosexuality is defined by a preference for members of your own sex, and this is impossible to determine unless they have a choice. Also, I'm not sure if you know anything about breeding fruit flies, but based upon your posts, I'm guessing you don't, since you really have no concept of any form of science at all. Anyway, I have bred two generations of fruit flies in lab and the standard method for doing this is to take a plate of sedated male and a plate of sedated females, and pour them into them same container, returning a week later to collect the offspring. Thomas Hunt Morgan on the other hand was a bit of a fruit fly fanatic and for some reason had the motivation and inquisitiveness to actually sit around and watch them go at it. It was during this process that he noticed that some males will always try to mate with other males, regardless of the number of females present. And no, he couldn't have been mistaken about the actually sex of the fruit flies involved, because they are sexually dimorphic and this difference is very easy to distinguish.

razor-sharp logic

Haha, güd won

 

[Charvelguy]

I'm doing some reading on this Thomas Morgan. Of course, I want to know if he isolated and or somehow 'tagged' or marked the males that chose to make this preference and then put them in with only females to observe if they were truly making a preferential choice for only males or were on more on a 'breeding' frenzy, you know, the intense pull of the call of nature to procreate. Obviously, you see this behavior in cats, dogs, deer etc, the difference being is that humans have a higher cognative ability to override the hardwiring of basic instincts.
From what I read, his studies and observations were for genetic mutations; genetic studies...not for sexuality research.

I find it somewhat amazing they had to use virgin female fruit flies in their studies...umm, I'm quite sure they weren't wearing white so.. was it based upon size or age that it was determined they were virgins.
Fruit Fly virgins, of course, ..oh, I won't even go there.

 

[BlackMetalWhiteGuy]

I'm doing some reading on this Thomas Morgan. Of course, I want to know if he isolated and or somehow 'tagged' or marked the males that chose to make this preference and then put them in with only females to observe if they were truly making a preferential choice for only males or were on more on a 'breeding' frenzy, you know, the intense pull of the call of nature to procreate. Obviously, you see this behavior in cats, dogs, deer etc, the difference being is that humans have a higher cognative ability to override the hardwiring of basic instincts.
From what I read, his studies and observations were for genetic mutations; genetic studies...not for sexuality research.

I find it somewhat amazing they had to use virgin female fruit flies in their studies...umm, I'm quite sure they weren't wearing white so.. was it based upon size or age that it was determined they were virgins.
Fruit Fly virgins, of course, ..oh, I won't even go there.

You're right, his studied were of genetic mutations, but the fact that homosexuality can be passed along recessively through the siblings of homosexual fruit flies is certain significant to genetics as well as sexuality.

Also, it's important to use virgin females flies, because in many animal species, the females can retain sperm from copulations with previous males. Determining whether or not they are virgins is also quite simply. All you have to do is separate them by sex as "birth" and not re-introduce them to the other sex until you're ready to conduct your experiment.

EDIT: My bad, Thomas Hunt Morgan is one of the foremost authorities on the Drosophila genus, but he's not the one who studied their homosexual behavior. I ran a quick search for "homosexuality drosophila" and it turns out (from multiple research articles) that all species in that genus exhibit homosexual behavior at an early age as part of their normal social development. I also found a couple of articles addressing the genetic component of homosexuality in Drosophila species, but they were so heavy in genetic jargon that it's a bit of a struggle (for me) to even comprehend everything that they're talking about, so here's the abstract that I found to be the easiest (and shortest) to read.

Sexual orientation and courtship behavior in Drosophila are regulated by fruitless (fru), the first gene in a branch of the sex-determination hierarchy functioning specifically in the central nervous system (CNS). The phenotypes of new fru mutants encompass nearly all aspects of male sexual behavior. Alternative splicing of fru transcripts produces sex-specific proteins belonging to the BTB-ZF family of transcriptional regulators. The sex-specific fru products are produced in only about 500 of the 10^5 neurons that comprise the CNS. The properties of neurons expressing these fru products suggest that fru specifies the fates or activities of neurons that carry out higher order control functions to elicit and coordinate the activities comprising male courtship behavior.

Control of Male Sexual Behavior and Sexual Orientation in Drosophila by the fruitless Gene

Lisa C. Ryner 1, Stephen F. Goodwin 2, Diego H. Castrillon 3, , Anuranjan Anand 1, Adriana Villella 2, Bruce S. Baker 1, Jeffrey C. Hall 2, Barbara J. Taylor 4 and Steven A. Wasserman 3

1 Department of Biological Sciences, Stanford University, Stanford, California 94305, USA

2 Department of Biology, Brandeis University, Waltham, Massachusetts 02254, USA

3 Department of Molecular Biology and Oncology, University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center, Dallas, Texas 75235, USA

4 Department of Zoology, Oregon State University, Corvallis, Oregon 97331, USA

 

[razoredge]

Whoa, my country has a president who is JUST like this!

Maybe but hes an asshole, and no body is JUST like me... I have personal identity... I got my hair dyed pink, spiked in the middle and a big fat stud imbedded in my forehead... thats how I know Im different... Now leave me alone and stop picking on poor poor me............... I just want equality, I want to be treated fairy and I want people to stop stareing at me.

If they were secluded with other male fruit flies exclusively, then it would not have been a logical deduction that homosexuality was the natural force at work. Homosexuality is defined by a preference for members of your own sex, and this is impossible to determine unless they have a choice. Also, I'm not sure if you know anything about breeding fruit flies, but based upon your posts, I'm guessing you don't, since you really have no concept of any form of science at all. Anyway, I have bred two generations of fruit flies in lab and the standard method for doing this is to take a plate of sedated male and a plate of sedated females, and pour them into them same container, returning a week later to collect the offspring. Thomas Hunt Morgan on the other hand was a bit of a fruit fly fanatic and for some reason had the motivation and inquisitiveness to actually sit around and watch them go at it. It was during this process that he noticed that some males will always try to mate with other males, regardless of the number of females present. And no, he couldn't have been mistaken about the actually sex of the fruit flies involved, because they are sexually dimorphic and this difference is very easy to distinguish.

Maybe not a concept of science but at least I have concepts, science is still argueing, uncertain and proposing. ANYHOW, that whole artical you posted while interesting is still not 100% conclusive and does deal with mutant flies.

Haha, güd won

ya really think so ? I kinda felt like I was being poked with a butter knife. "cause its just not fair" holds little weight and represents a dull form of logic for a complex situation

This was precious :

"Nonviolently resolving confrontations is the hallmark of democracy."

not that I have noticed, nor have I seen any "resolutions" just increased chaos, then of course the apparent theory behind resolving this particular confrontation is to let the weak minority side have their own way... thats "democracy" of course...

 

[Charvelguy]

I happened to find this article from the NY Times which outlines some of the above discussed in a more layperson manner using less stuffy terminology.
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/03/science/03cell.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

I guess one thing is coming out of this is that I'm glad I'm not a fruit fly in a lab.

 

[razoredge]

I've been saying for decades that there was something wrong with their genes.... so much for gut instincts and practical logic.... never should have second guessed myself

the one scientist saying "I never chose to be heterosexual; it just happened." is precious, as if hes regreting or worse yet trying to imply its not the norm or that something had gone astray for him against his will. Absolutely priceless piece of PC right there

Now I just wanna know why the gay chubby lovers look like brothers ?

 

[BlackMetalWhiteGuy]

Maybe not a concept of science but at least I have concepts, science is still argueing, uncertain and proposing. ANYHOW, that whole artical you posted while interesting is still not 100% conclusive and does deal with mutant flies.

But unlike you, science is actually making progress. Also, "mutant" in this context doesn't imply physical deformation, it means that they have genetic alterations.

I happened to find this article from the NY Times which outlines some of the above discussed in a more layperson manner using less stuffy terminology.
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/03/science/03cell.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

I guess one thing is coming out of this is that I'm glad I'm not a fruit fly in a lab.

Yeah, I posted a similar link back on the page one.

 

[The Poona of Peshwa]

This was precious : not that I have noticed, nor have I seen any "resolutions" just increased chaos, then of course the apparent theory behind resolving this particular confrontation is to let the weak minority side have their own way... thats "democracy" of course...

Well democracy as practiced in the United States has given undue credit to the opinions of masses of unthinking douches like yourself, so don't be too hard on it. Like the above poster said, your straight-talkin' "I knows it when I sees it" mentality is reflected quite well in the current commander-in-chief, after all.

 

[razoredge]

This becomes more amusing by the day. So let me get this straight. You two and a tiny handful of others feel that:

Denying transgender is a mutation or mental illness is ..... progress ?

Boys trying to be girls... girls/boys is ...... progress ?

anybody that thinks about it and holds an opinion opposite of your own... must therefore be incapable of applying thought and you are the representation of .......... progress ?

Also, "mutant" in this context doesn't imply physical deformation, it means that they have genetic alterations.

excuse me here, I realize it is unpopular to apply independant thought as it may impede progress but this seems to imply that these fruity flys occured in a genetic alteration (mutation)?

I was also unaware until now that "mutation" only occurs in the physical state not also in the the mental state ...... this realization has suddenly made me feel ......... progressive

Well democracy as practiced in the United States has given undue credit to the opinions of masses of unthinking douches like yourself, so don't be too hard on it.

Really ? So this is what made The States stand so far apart and so far advanced from the rest of the world ? Wow, thats friggin awesome! Heres to the masses of unthinking douches

wait... but suddenly Im confused... does the fact that we are "unthinking douches" reduce us to the level of fruitflys or Bonobo monkeys in the mist of a frenzy ? Im suddenly feeling a fruitflyaphobia setting in

Unthinking douche that I am... I've often wondered... I noticed one of the first things animals do upon meeting... is stick their noses in each others genitals and apparently in the case of Bonobo monkeys they just start humping regardless... now in the case of some women(sorry seems natural to me)... I myself have felt that urge pass through my primitive conscience. So I've wondered if I became a more progressive advanced thinking douche than I currently am and just let it "all hang out" and greeted people in this fashion... could I do so and not expect to get the shit kicked out of me ? I mean what would be the harm of dropping to my knees every 100 feet or so on the sidewalk and sticking my nose between a sexy ladies legs ? Why would this make other people think "he aint right in the head" ?

But then again I've noticed another one of the first things animals do is posture off the intruder and if that should not work, they engage the intruder in physical force, often in force outnumbering the wondering stray and sending them on their way somewhat damaged if not dead.

Geeze... this progressive thinking stuff is blowing my mind... but what could I expect being a "nonthinking douche" and all like that

So please lets hear the profound thoughts of the great progressive thinkers involved in this conversation.... after all that is what I've been waiting for.

 

[BlackMetalWhiteGuy]

anybody that thinks about it and holds an opinion opposite of your own... must therefore be incapable of applying thought and you are the representation of .......... progress ?

I feel that since my opinion is rooted in my education of related topics and that since I can provide data to explain why I feel the way that I do that my opinion has more validity that that of someone who isn't educated in related fields and has no familiarity with any of the scientific aspects surrounding the subject.

For example, I consistently disagreed with deathmetalblackmetal before he stopped posting, but at least he could relate his thoughts in a scientifically sound manner and justify his opinions with actual data, although we often disagreed on how to interpret such data.

 

[razoredge]

Thing is everything I stated in regards to this topic has been supported by the data of others as well as observations of human behavior. At this point I see you and Poonna as only being pissed off because I bashed the necessity of science having any relevance on that fact that if you show up in school dressed in drag... you might get the shit kicked out of ya, so one might better apply some common sense. I even know studys of the human mind can explain why this happens but I dont need them, its blantently obvious and it is a natural primitive instinct of survival to avoid confrontation. Only in recent years are we trying to deny all these natural instincts and challenge them. So some have used rare primitive impulsive bisexual behavior in nature, painted it as erotic homosexual and used that to support people thinking they are the opposite sex as not having any internal issues. Many of my opponents even tried to deny they were born that way, when I gave them full credit for having issues they have no control over. But there is one thing they do have control over, accountability.

 

[waif]

Even then without science to back them up and actual proof we still couldnt believe a thing now could we ?

If we're asking them what's going on in their minds, I think we can trust them to tell us.

Wow, neither was I

Then how can you tell?

Yep, freak of nature

Fuck...showed up before.
It was a picture of the x-men, in case you were wondering. You don't seem to realize that mutations are natural - it's how evolution works.

Buts its primarily an issue with teenagers and those that never grow up

That's a cop out - dismissing gays as people who never grow up.
The reason it seems to be an issue with teenagers is that it's starting to come out now, and it's coming from teenagers, because a lot of older LGBTQ people suppressed themselves and hid it.

I've responded to this many times, why turn the tables on me ? Is that a offensive defense to cover up the lack of comprehension skills or displeasure in the fact that not everyone agrees with you ? Naw... its couldnt be

Okay, then. Explain to me how it hurts other kids when one kid wears a skirt.

She has her points but correctness in the exagerations is impossible... which is not hard for me to see your being in agreement

There are only slight exaggerations that accentuate the point, rather than undermining it.

Cant speak for people from the south but surely after reading this I can easily determine they are smarter and witier then you

I don't mean to be whateverist, but there's a large fundamentalist Christian element in the south that likes to deny reality.

Science is still argueing with itself so seriously... Me>science

This is called a debate. It's how they prevent themselves from being ridiculous. Science > you.

and this "known fact" was presented to you via _ _ _ _ _ ?

It's common knowledge that millions of Americans suffer from mental disorders. Are we really arguing this point?

and I am the only one that refuses to accept facts ?

Yes. Give me a fact and I'll accept it.

What is this, are you admitting to influencial trends existing amounst teens ?

?

No its not irrelevent... especially if said post I critized from thrashgirl full of exagerations and foolish conclusions was full of good points...

It is irrelevant because we're debating (or trying to) on a more hypothetical level, and so the numbers aren't really important. However, if we assume a school system to be about 4,000 kids, there will be more than one transgender kid.

Naturally as a great presenter of facts, you would know Im wrong about this ? Wait thats right, you have presented very little throughout this entire topic. In fact did you ever answer the question I asked about your exposure to an actual transgender ?

A. Yes.
B. Irrelevant. I explained before that personal experience isn't really applicable because your geographic locations will affect your experience.

I've stated it over and over but once again... your comprehension skills are :zombie:

Sorry. I guess I just don't see how seeing a guy wearing a skirt is such a traumatic and painful experience.

relevance only excapes me?

I was making fun of you because your arguments had become so ridiculous it wasn't worth pointing out the flaws in your thinking.

Really I have supplied many and dont need to be asked.... but where are yours ?

You haven't supplied a single fact or piece of hard evidence in this entire thread.

Speaking for yourself here ? I know "thousands upon thousands" of people I consider normal.

Everyone will be different in some way. Really, how big an element of someone's personality is sexual preference?

Identity disorders, paranoia are not normal. anxiety can be caused by several factors, all are illnesses

Thank you doctor.

Wouldnt know a "Emo" if I stepped on one

Do you not go outside?

I'm not surprised you would think that its the fault of straight society and not the mental disorder itself

Said mental disorder is clinical depression. Clinical depression has a cause. That cause is the suppression of said LGBT people.

Actually its more like "amusing to watch everyone dance around avoiding the obvious and whats been presented"

Keeping us guessing...good way to convince people you're right.

wow a couple thousands kids per school... I am living in the dark ages.

You said school system, which includes all the schools in the area. A single high school will have between a couple hundred (small rural) and 4 or even 5 thousand (large urban). Elementary schools will have less.

But this isnt you making a statement on gut feelings is it ?

No, there's this crazy thing called knowledge.

Not suprised you would need him to think for you as well

Irony is dead. You killed it.

You only linked to some traveling gay animal show which presented its case based on bias to support gay rights activists

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_animals#References
Have fun. Then come back and tell me that it's all lies created by the gay jewish bankers who rule the world.

No, Im not

Yes, you really are.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_disorder#Prevalence
Stats from the World Health Organization. Accept it: you're wrong.

Thats not the information I've gotten.

Not surprising, considering I don't consider Focus On The Family a reliable source.

Hate to break it to you but typically people are comfortable in the clothing they were brought up in.

Typically. Key word. This is obviously atypical behavior.

Duh, Duh and Duh. This is where I separate between someone with anxioty, depression or ADD from someone wanting to parade around dressed as the opposite sex, thank you for agreeing again and admitting the strong relevence of my point.

Again. Failure to distinguish between crossdressing and transsexuality. But anyhow, the point is that it's not clear that transsexuality is a mental disorder.

I have no idea what science, psychology rejections has to do with the obvious, maybe you needed them to determine this and I didnt Me > science and you

You've reject science - homosexuality in animals - and psychology - millions of people with mental disorders. Failure.

This statement is why I gave the second All I can say is you'll figure it out one day when you've had your fill or propaganda and see the self serving

This is really lame. "Oh, I'm older and I know better and shit." Fuck that. I'm not buying it. Come up with some actual evidence or stfu.

No they better wait for some scientist to do a study and determine that if you piss people off you get slapped up side the head

Unless you live in a country with laws that prohibit assault.

I've been on the delivering end and SHE was anatomically correct and loving it... and you know what... I can live with that

Good for you. I meant gay sex, though.

I've been awaiting someone to step forward and say that teenagers arent concerned with their sexual appeal... thanks for enlightening me..........

Of course they are. But just the idea of a guy wearing female clothing is a big deal for you. My point is sex appeal doesn't enter into it - just the concept of a guy dressing in women's clothing because it feels right to him bothers you so much.

Its not uncommon for you to write alittle and say nothing but this one really takes the cake

Some goths and punks do it.

are you sure ?


are you sure ?

Yes, you lackwit.

This is good because they dont belong in our public school systems

Should they be taken to a separate school for kids who aren't straight?

your interpretation of the story continues to amuse me

The story itself continues to amuse me

Normal straight kids get up go to school and dont try to stand out in the crowd nor do they live in an identity crisis, striving for the need for "personal identity" because they are aware that they carry their personal idenity with them everywhere they go... its not in their cloths, its not in some fashion trend... it lives inside them and they are comfortable

This is ignorant and mildly offensive. For one thing, straight kids seek to reaffirm their identity everywhere. Also, they totally try to stand out. A sexual identity crisis isn't the only identity crisis you can have, either. Furthermore, suggesting homosexuality or transsexualism is a fad is absurd, and assuming that their identity only goes as far as the clothing they wear is ridiculous.

Oh, sorry, I didnt mean to offend your sensitivities but in many instances it is overly obvious that some ignorances or misconceptions applied here are from a lack of experience. But you will understand this one day.

Fuck you, grandpa.

Doubt is a good thing, it leaves one free from disappointment when reality slaps them upside the face.

Have fun doubting those facts about animal homosexuality and mental disorders.

[/quote]SFIEMIBB[/QUOTE]
WTF? Explain your acronym.

No, I used that in reference to these cross cultures that apparently accept transgender openly also seem to have a different code of ethics from what you call western culture and the point of interest that they have had a very secluded lifestyle until recent years. So I think that holds great relevance... especially if someone wants to pull that acceptence card for transgenders while ignoring other very important facts of said cross culture.

OH MY GOD! Other cultures! They must be inferior deviants!

It's irrelevant. The point is that other cultures (which may not be as different as you think) are accepting of this stuff because they recognize it as natural. Further, that seclusion? What relevance does it hold?

Harassment is discouraged in school and as I stated many times, not enough, there is no control in schools, they are basically a nut house. However, lets say someone always starts trouble and then there is gonna be someone thats a finisher.

What if you were walking along the street and someone attacked you for preferring redheads to blondes?

This is how I feel about girlyboys in school... for christs sake get over it. Its very easy to avoid confrontation, surely you have figured that out by now ? THIS IS NOT PERSONAL OPINION ITS A FACT OF LIFE

Right. The idea is that they shouldn't have to avoid said confrontation. Are you saying Rosa Parks should have stayed in the back of the bus?

Maybe you should stop denying what is the natural norm in nature and believe that I have spent my life studying nature, so I'm allowed to dispute bias presentation as reality

I tried to rephrase this in a way comprehensible to normal humans and I think that you're saying that you have more experience than me. If so, it's you versus hundreds of scientists saying that homosexuality occurs in animals.

Thats why I know a freak show when I see it, someone that "aint right in the head" when I see it, an attention whore when I see it, recogonize that there is money involved in the science, psychology and the medical industrys, as well as in which way a governing body sways and am well aware of bias and refuse to be swayed or distracted and have no problem excepting the fact that if you dont look for trouble it wont find you.

Wow, you're amazing. So gay people are freakish attention whores backed by the crooked pill-pushing medical institution.

Fact based rebuttals ? Where are those ? Once you locate them how about showing me where mine are not.....

seems the evasive ones are those who fail to answer all the questions I asked and fail to put together a honest scenerio of the inner workings of the human mind that leads to the conflict involved with this topic.

Ask a stupid question, don't expect an answer.

naw, they were prolly locked up in a cell with nothing but other male fruitflys, so they got desperate and put their motor skills to work by rubbing up against each other, thereby determined to be performing erotic homosexual acts... but after all what would you do if you only lived for one season and making maggots was a priority motor function... opps, sorry I forgot you are now a insect and dont think... only act on impulse so I suppose thats a bad question

umm, want me one of them "real jocks" after all... we know any "real jock" is gay... yeehaw...ridem cowboy

Ok, you guys are right. Fucking attention-whore faggots probably want to get abused because they've got daddy-issues right? What's a guy to do when faced with such unrelenting annoying-ness? Pay no attention? Live and let live? No! Of course not. The natural thing to do is get repulsed and blame society for turning our kids into pansies! Why kowtow to one messed-up, mentally ill attention whore by sending the good wholesome boys who abused him to jail, thereby ruining a perfectly good life? The kid was asking for it after all.

People shouldn't be able to live their lives unmolested if it makes some people uncomfortable. That's the way it was throughout history, and that's the way it is now in our global democracy, in spite of constant PC re-inforcement in the media, in the government and especially in the labs, all paid for by shadowy liberal figures. Fuck science especially, it's both given us the nuclear bomb and freed us from genocides which did the handy-dandy task of rooting out the weak (which would have undoubtedly included trannies). I finally comprehend the subtleties and the razor-sharp logic of your position after all. You win, man. High five!

Gay fruit flies haha! That was a good one!

Darn tootin'

global democracy..........
constant PC re-inforcement in the media..........

but you wouldnt understand the joke

So don't make it. you seem to laugh privately a lot.

they obviously broke a law but if the situation is where the poor poor dead child showed up for school in drag... his parents as well as school officials belong in the same jail cell, thats called accountability

This is the single stupidest opinion any human being has ever expressed on this planet. Ever. Jesus fucking christ. Wow. I'm getting a bit of a rush just from reading that...

yes throughout history those that did not apply common sense have typically recieved some kind of attitude adjustment, this establishes a natural selection of thought, lets call it multiple choice that has one extremely bad answer

yes, clearly.

rock hot... me pick up rock ??? sure go ahead the politically correct media says its alright

Or maybe...instinct tells me I should do something that doesn't harm anyone else...oh, shit, a mob is lynching me!

great razor sharp interpretation, its no surprise you didnt hold up... its in who distributes the findings in select pieces, picking and choosing in order to keep the frosting free of finger prints

you just killed the concept of analogies. god that was bad.
no one is trying to spread some myth of homosexuality or transexuality in order to make money.

t

his is partially true, but it is a fact that science has been a double edged sword, Im not aware that theres any denial of that but who would be surprised if some tried

You know, the people who developed the nuclear bomb argued against it's use...

an XY can get a drivers license to say he's XX... can I get one that says I'm 18 so I can fuck teenagers? who cares what science says my age is, that's not what I want to be, so just change the records, fucker.

Wasn't aware of this.
Anyhow...

fuck, lemme rape the bitch and prove to the cops I aint a suspect---the license shows I'm a woman, and you're lookin for a man, hah! oh, the suspect was about 6'2? good thing my license says 5'10!

really poor analogy here...

Maybe but hes an asshole, and no body is JUST like me... I have personal identity... I got my hair dyed pink, spiked in the middle and a big fat stud imbedded in my forehead... thats how I know Im different... Now leave me alone and stop picking on poor poor me............... I just want equality, I want to be treated fairy and I want people to stop stareing at me.

A. Congratulations, you fail at stereotypes. Sounds more like a goth than a fag
B. Most homosexuals are not flamboyent and do not try to draw attention
C. Otherwise, you more or less captured what they want. Is that so wrong?

Maybe not a concept of science but at least I have concepts, science is still argueing, uncertain and proposing. ANYHOW, that whole artical you posted while interesting is still not 100% conclusive and does deal with mutant flies.

You mean scientists debate things and consider multiple possibilities instead of assuming they're right and going from there?
And yes, it isn't conclusive. But it's strong evidence.

This was precious : not that I have noticed, nor have I seen any "resolutions" just increased chaos, then of course the apparent theory behind resolving this particular confrontation is to let the weak minority side have their own way... thats "democracy" of course...

Congress: Last outbreak of violence was when a pro-slavery senator attacked another congressman for criticizing slavery.

This becomes more amusing by the day. So let me get this straight. You two and a tiny handful of others feel that:

Not such a tiny handful

Denying transgender is a mutation or mental illness is ..... progress ?

Well, yes, it it's not a mental illness.

Boys trying to be girls... girls/boys is ...... progress ?

People acting how they feel they should is good, yes.

anybody that thinks about it and holds an opinion opposite of your own... must therefore be incapable of applying thought and you are the representation of .......... progress ?

No. Anyone incapable of rationally debating this without devolving into absurd comparisons, anneccdotal evidence, and personal invective is wrong, however.

excuse me here, I realize it is unpopular to apply independant thought as it may impede progress but this seems to imply that these fruity flys occured in a genetic alteration (mutation)?

Indeed. As did every other aspect of all living things. We started as single celled organisms. Everything from there has been a genetic mutation. The genetic difference between homosexuals and heterosexuals is most likely a single allele, and it's unlikely that any genetic factor is fully responsible for sexual orientation.

I was also unaware until now that "mutation" only occurs in the physical state not also in the the mental state ...... this realization has suddenly made me feel ......... progressive

It should have made you feel stupid.

now in the case of some women(sorry seems natural to me)... I myself have felt that urge pass through my primitive conscience.

Who hasn't?

So I've wondered if I became a more progressive advanced thinking douche than I currently am and just let it "all hang out" and greeted people in this fashion... could I do so and not expect to get the shit kicked out of me ? I mean what would be the harm of dropping to my knees every 100 feet or so on the sidewalk and sticking my nose between a sexy ladies legs ? Why would this make other people think "he aint right in the head" ?

Because you're fucking with other people. If it's allowable for one gender to wear a garment in public, it should be allowable for both. It's not generally acceptable for anyone to go around naked or sexual harass random women, and no one is saying that should change.

But then again I've noticed another one of the first things animals do is posture off the intruder and if that should not work, they engage the intruder in physical force, often in force outnumbering the wondering stray and sending them on their way somewhat damaged if not dead.

Animals rarely engage in serious physical violence against members of their own species.

 

[razoredge]

If we're asking them what's going on in their minds, I think we can trust them to tell us.Then how can you tell?Fuck...showed up before.It was a picture of the x-men , in case you were wondering. You don't seem to realize that mutations are natural - it's how evolution works.That's a cop out - dismissing gays as people who never grow up.The reason it seems to be an issue with teenagers is that it's starting to come out now, and it's coming from teenagers, because a lot of older LGBTQ people suppressed themselves and hid it.Okay, then. Explain to me how it hurts other kids when one kid wears a skirt.There are only slight exaggerations that accentuate the point, rather than undermining itI don't mean to be whateverist, but there's a large fundamentalist Christian element in the south that likes to deny reality.This is called a debate. It's how they prevent themselves from being ridiculous. Science > you.It's common knowledge that millions of Americans suffer from mental disorders. Are we really arguing this point?Yes. Give me a fact and I'll accept it.It is irrelevant because we're debating (or trying to) on a more hypothetical level, and so the numbers aren't really important. However, if we assume a school system to be about 4,000 kids, there will be more than one transgender kid. A. Yes.B. Irrelevant. I explained before that personal experience isn't really applicable because your geographic locations will affect your experience.Sorry. I guess I just don't see how seeing a guy wearing a skirt is such a traumatic and painful experience.I was making fun of you because your arguments had become so ridiculous it wasn't worth pointing out the flaws in your thinking.You haven't supplied a single fact or piece of hard evidence in this entire thread.Everyone will be different in some way. Really, how big an element of someone's personality is sexual preference?Thank you doctor.
Do you not go outside?Said mental disorder is clinical depression. Clinical depression has a cause. That cause is the suppression of said LGBT people.Keeping us guessing...good way to convince people you're right.You said school system, which includes all the schools in the area. A single high school will have between a couple hundred (small rural) and 4 or even 5 thousand (large urban). Elementary schools will have less.No, there's this crazy thing called knowledge.Irony is dead. You killed it.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_animals#References
Have fun. Then come back and tell me that it's all lies created by the gay jewish bankers who rule the world.Yes, you really are.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_disorder#PrevalenceStats from the World Health Organization. Accept it: you're wrong.Not surprising, considering I don't consider Focus On The Family a reliable source.Typically. Key word. This is obviously atypical behavior.Again. Failure to distinguish between crossdressing and transsexuality. But anyhow, the point is that it's not clear that transsexuality is a mental disorder. You've reject science - homosexuality in animals - and psychology - millions of people with mental disorders. Failure. This is really lame. "Oh, I'm older and I know better and shit." Fuck that. I'm not buying it. Come up with some actual evidence or stfu.Unless you live in a country with laws that prohibit assault.Good for you. I meant gay sex, though.Of course they are. But just the idea of a guy wearing female clothing is a big deal for you. My point is sex appeal doesn't enter into it - just the concept of a guy dressing in women's clothing because it feels right to him bothers you so much.Some goths and punks do it.Yes, you lackwit.Should they be taken to a separate school for kids who aren't straight?The story itself continues to amuse meThis is ignorant and mildly offensive. For one thing, straight kids seek to reaffirm their identity everywhere. Also, they totally try to stand out. A sexual identity crisis isn't the only identity crisis you can have, either. Furthermore, suggesting homosexuality or transsexualism is a fad is absurd, and assuming that their identity only goes as far as the clothing they wear is ridiculous.Fuck you, grandpa.Have fun doubting those facts about animal homosexuality and mental disorders.

SFIEMIBB[/QUOTE]WTF? Explain your acronym.OH MY GOD! Other cultures! They must be inferior deviants!It's irrelevant. The point is that other cultures (which may not be as different as you think) are accepting of this stuff because they recognize it as natural. Further, that seclusion? What relevance does it hold?What if you were walking along the street and someone attacked you for preferring redheads to blondes?Right. The idea is that they shouldn't have to avoid said confrontation. Are you saying Rosa Parks should have stayed in the back of the bus?I tried to rephrase this in a way comprehensible to normal humans and I think that you're saying that you have more experience than me. If so, it's you versus hundreds of scientists saying that homosexuality occurs in animals.Wow, you're amazing. So gay people are freakish attention whores backed by the crooked pill-pushing medical institution.Ask a stupid question, don't expect an answer.Darn tootin'So don't make it. you seem to laugh privately a lot.This is the single stupidest opinion any human being has ever expressed on this planet. Ever. Jesus fucking christ. Wow. I'm getting a bit of a rush just from reading that...yes, clearly.Or maybe...instinct tells me I should do something that doesn't harm anyone else...oh, shit, a mob is lynching me!you just killed the concept of analogies. god that was bad.no one is trying to spread some myth of homosexuality or transexuality in order to make moneytYou know, the people who developed the nuclear bomb argued against it's use...Wasn't aware of this.Anyhow...really poor analogy here...
A. Congratulations, you fail at stereotypes. Sounds more like a goth than a fagB. Most homosexuals are not flamboyent and do not try to draw attentionC. Otherwise, you more or less captured what they want. Is that so wrong?You mean scientists debate things and consider multiple possibilities instead of assuming they're right and going from there?And yes, it isn't conclusive. But it's strong evidence.

Congress: Last outbreak of violence was when a pro-slavery senator attacked another congressman for criticizing slavery.Not such a tiny handfulWell, yes, it it's not a mental illness.People acting how they feel they should is good, yes.No. Anyone incapable of rationally debating this without devolving into absurd comparisons, anneccdotal evidence, and personal invective is wrong, however. Indeed. As did every other aspect of all living things. We started as single celled organisms. Everything from there has been a genetic mutation. The genetic difference between homosexuals and heterosexuals is most likely a single allele, and it's unlikely that any genetic factor is fully responsible for sexual orientation.It should have made you feel stupid.Who hasn't?Because you're fucking with other people. If it's allowable for one gender to wear a garment in public, it should be allowable for both. It's not generally acceptable for anyone to go around naked or sexual harass random women, and no one is saying that should change.Animals rarely engage in serious physical violence against members of their own species.[/QUOTE]

^ this was the biggest piece of shit post I have ever seen so I didnt read much of it

WHO estimated that about 450 million people worldwide currently suffer from some form of mental or behavioural disorder.[27] One in four people will suffer from mental illness at some time in life, according to a report from the WHO.[28][29] It was also found that the most frequent disorders were anxiety disorders, depressive, somatoform and substance dependence disorders.

Oh wow, you mean people have anxioty, get depressed and take drugs...... when you need numbers its easy to pill them up, especially in todays ball assed world

Homosexual (as well as bisexual) behavior is widespread in the animal kingdom. Animal sexual behavior takes many different forms, even within the same species and the motivations for and implications of their behaviors have yet to be fully understood as most species have yet to be studied.

yes very interesting artical. But then I know what Im reading about and you dont. Sounds just like the same issue as with humans to me..... :zombie:

 

[waif]

WHO estimated that about 450 million people worldwide currently suffer from some form of mental or behavioural disorder.[27]

Right. So lets say that the numbers are off by a fuckload. Instead of 450 million, it's only 350 million, a paltry and insignificant amount.

One in four people will suffer from mental illness at some time in life, according to a report from the WHO.[28][29]

I feel like it's their job to find these numbers, and they really aren't being paid to screw with the statistics, so I think it's a trustworthy figure.

It was also found that the most frequent disorders were anxiety disorders, depressive, somatoform and substance dependence disorders.

[/QUOTE]
Well, yes. Anxiety disorders and depression, as well as fucked up sleeping and stuff, are the most common. So what? They're legitimate mental disorders.

Oh wow, you mean people have anxioty, get depressed and take drugs...... when you need numbers its easy to pill them up, especially in todays ball assed world

First off, congratulations on inventing the phrase "ball-assed," I'm sure it will catch on.
Secondly, an anxiety disorder can be extremely serious, as can depression. What do you consider a real disorder?

yes very interesting artical. But then I know what Im reading about and you dont.

Care to spell out your credentials, Dr. Doolittle?

Sounds just like the same issue as with humans to me..... :zombie:

Well, yes, that's the point - animals also engage in homosexual activity. This was the point I've been attempting to get through your skull for several pages now.