We compared Neve 1073, Api 512 and SSL Duality preamps on a kickdrum today at college

[ahjteam]

Yeah, we have the midterm next week and we had like an extra hour after the recording lab class where we operate an SSL console (FYI to NSGuitar: a REAL SSL console ) and since the studio had three different kind of preamps (SSL, API and Neve), we decided to make a shootout on them. We split the kickdrum signal (AKG D112 ) on the Duality patchbay's multis and did two versions... One with "clean" settings and one with more "driven" settings on the preamps, and we tried to match the gain as close as possible. And to be honest... It wasn't even funny how similar they sounded. It was so subtle that it was more like level mismatch than tonal difference.

if you want to hear the clips, I can try to go and get the files from the computer later today if the room is not occupied.

edit: clips on post #9

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1338211/SSL_test.zip (~7mb)

Pretty straightforward deal here, two different takes on same preamps with different settings. _01 is clean and _02 is the driven.

Just so you know that we are just humans and we couldn't adjust the volume to be 100% exactly the same, so there is some minor +-1dB level difference between the preamp clips. Because we all know "louder seems better", so if you want to get a more neutral opinions on the clips, normalize all the files to -6dBFS peak level.

edit: oh yeah, I don't think these will be much of a use to anyone, but if you want, free feel to use the samples for whatever.

 

[narcossintese]

http://www.recordingreview.com/ has many shootouts like this. Preamps are overrated.

 

[C_F_H_13]

yep sounds about right.

There are differences, but 1db of eq will make the differences null and void in most situations. Where they do come into play though is the Slew rate, which decides how fast the pre deals with transients. Something like a snare will show greater differences in them then say a guitar. But I completely agree. In the room I'm working in right now we have 8 neve strips and an SSL and my 2 apis, and honestly they are all pretty interchangeable...

 

[Loren Littlejohn]

Doesn't matter until you start doing a whole song. What I would love to see (as controlled as possible, but I know this is impossible) is 3 songs recorded with the different preamps (same song 3 times, each one to a different preamp).

 

[christopher ridley]

Pres make such a huge difference.... obviously if you are using pre's that are $800+ each they are all gonna sound pretty decent. That doesn't mean they all sound the same. Neve, API, and SSL are all terribly different sounding pre's. Sure the difference isn't going to be the same as comparing them to an ART tube pre or something, but they are still very different sounding pre's and should be fairly easily distinguishable.

 

[Fragle]

guys, don't you know that all the subtleties stack up in a full mix?

anyways, it would be cool if you posted the files

now, ssl/api/neve are all high end pre's....i wonder how they compare to mid-level stuff.

 

[guitarguru777]

DUDE .. OMG perfect timing .. please post some clips!

 

[C_F_H_13]

guys, don't you know that all the subtleties stack up in a full mix?
.

Oh they do for sure, but not as much as stacking half a mix worth of tracks with 1 db of eq on each.

 

[ahjteam]

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1338211/SSL_test.zip (~7mb)

Pretty straightforward deal here, two different takes on same preamps with different settings. _01 is clean and _02 is the driven.

Just so you know that we are just humans and we couldn't adjust the volume to be 100% exactly the same, so there is some minor +-1dB level difference between the preamp clips. Because we all know "louder seems better", so if you want to get a more neutral opinions on the clips, normalize all the files to -6dBFS peak level.

edit: oh yeah, I don't think these will be much of a use to anyone, but if you want, free feel to use the samples for whatever.

 

[jval]

it's true, the preamp hype is way ridiculous. You'd probably hear more of a difference if you were testing those against some cheap focusrite or behringers, but once you're talking about high-end pres, it's all super subtle and matters less than people pretend.

also a kick drum is a relatively short sound so the difference is even harder to pick out.
couple weeks ago I did a few days tracking drums in a big room with an SSL and a bunch of outboard gear. I had it all spread out to different pres... Kick and toms on 1073s, snare on APIs, some on SSL, etc etc. After the first day I wish I just had it all on the SSL, such a pain having to move around the room to make adjustments.

 

[guitarguru777]

On my KRK's they all sound pretty much the same. Very very very miniscule differences in the extreme highs and extreme lows .... wow

 

[gabriel g.]

Yeah I dont need to listen to the clips to know what you guys mean.
First time I realy was blown away by high-class pres was when I tracked drums with Apis on Toms for the first time.
Driven into the red with 20dB output pad-cables.
Sounded like already mixed.

Same was with Audient on Snare top and Kick.

You hear a difference if you track a full song with only high-end pres + a quality clock.

 

[gabriel g.]

yep sounds about right.

There are differences, but 1db of eq will make the differences null and void in most situations. Where they do come into play though is the Slew rate, which decides how fast the pre deals with transients. Something like a snare will show greater differences in them then say a guitar. But I completely agree. In the room I'm working in right now we have 8 neve strips and an SSL and my 2 apis, and honestly they are all pretty interchangeable...

yeah IMO a realy good preamp give you realy tight and fast transients.
Thats the reason you say preamp XYZ is so punchy compared to a mackie onyx or a focusrite octo....

 

[ahjteam]

Thats the reason you say preamp XYZ is so punchy compared to a mackie onyx or a focusrite octo....

Well, I once compared in similiar split track fashion the SM Pro Audio PR8E (8 channels for 150€, do 1 channel for ~19&#8364 to SPL Track One (1 channel for 650&#8364, and eventho the gain control on the SM was horrible, they sounded pretty much identical.

http://www.ahjteam.com/upload/smproaudiopr8e_vs_spltrackone-01.wav

IIRC, SM on left and SPL on the right channel

 

[C_F_H_13]

yeah IMO a realy good preamp give you realy tight and fast transients.
Thats the reason you say preamp XYZ is so punchy compared to a mackie onyx or a focusrite octo....

While this statement is very true. I think alot of Neve lovers would disagree, being as Neve's are some SLOW ASS pres.

 

[gabriel g.]

sure but then we are at the colour-ing point and harmonic and unharmonic content, which gives you the sound.

question is, can you emulate it?

I realy felt the worth of better pres with the transients.
commin from mackie onyx, digi 003 and octopre to metric halo and audient.