I've tried searching for it... with no luck.
can anyone break it down for me?
I'm on an LE system/002.
If its possible?
can anyone break it down for me?
I'm on an LE system/002.
If its possible?
While we're at it... Sidechaining in Pro Tools?
- Thread starter AudioPhile777
- Start date
KeithRT99
BOOSH.
i belive you set up a gate on the track you want to gate, the you bus the the key to an open bus, and set the gate to that bus. or something like that.
i don't own pro tools so it's been awhile since i've done it.
i don't own pro tools so it's been awhile since i've done it.
haha let me find a tutorial for youTheres keys?
... oh man...
edit: see if this helps
http://duc.digidesign.com/showflat.php?Number=813741
Side-chaining in PT is a function of the plug ins that have the functionality .. so "searching for it" in PT is not going to work out for you until you load either a gate, expander, compressor, or limiter.
problem here is really that your trying to run before you can walk solidly... back to basics... that's the way to go. get down all the concepts on a fundamental level, read your manuals thoroughly and practice. then you'll never have to ask a question like this one... rather you'll be asking better questions like, "what's a creative way some of you use side-chaining?". that is the real benefit of a forum like this.
problem here is really that your trying to run before you can walk solidly... back to basics... that's the way to go. get down all the concepts on a fundamental level, read your manuals thoroughly and practice. then you'll never have to ask a question like this one... rather you'll be asking better questions like, "what's a creative way some of you use side-chaining?". that is the real benefit of a forum like this.
I think I have a good grasp of the basics... I wanted to try using the side chain to release my snare because I tend to have tons of bleed on that track from cymbals and hihat...
Most of the drummers I record play with their kit as compact as possible and are afraid to open it up...
Most of the drummers I record play with their kit as compact as possible and are afraid to open it up...
using the side chain to "release your snare", as opposed to just using the snare track itself means you need to either have a trigger "splat" track recorded, or you need to make a copy of your snare track to use as the "key" source. so, put one of the digirack gates on your snare track, then assign your snare trigger splat track to a free bus. then assign the Key Input of the Gate plug to the same bus... now the clean trigger track will open and close the gate that is on your snare track. you might bump the trigger track earlier in time by 30ms or so if you don't have "look ahead" on your gate plug... expirement until your snare attack is not affected by the gate.
the advantage of using the trigger splat track is obvious.. it's clean, and therefore will open the gate only on the actual snare strikes, keeping it closed during all the bleed between strikes. if you don't have a trigger track recorded and need to use a copy of your snare track, then there are two things that make this worthwhile... the ability to move it earlier in time to open the gate properly to preserve the attack on the original snare track, and the fact that you an use extreme eq in order to accentuate the attack of the snare.. and remember, both of these techniques work because you do not hear the key track, only the key input of your gate does, so you can make it as nasty sounding as you need to in order to emphasize the attacks of the snare and you can move it in time at will, with no worries of phase problems within the haas zone (30-35 ms or so), or flamming problems beyond it.
but to the original point in my first post in this thread.... you have access to the digirak and waves manuals, since you own PTLE and Waves Diamond, either as hard copies or online downloads... and i'm sure they explain all this... so everyone, READ YOUR MANUALS, lol.
elmuchoescadawg
Member
This maybe hijacking the thread a bit but are there any advantages to using a gate, with ot without trigger input into the side chain over using strip silence or similar?
I know the gate will also allow you envelope control but purely as a means to eliminate bleed are there any pros or cons?
I know the gate will also allow you envelope control but purely as a means to eliminate bleed are there any pros or cons?
strip silence is less than optimal IMO, because it's not really silence is it?.. even if you get the threshold right for the majority of the bleed between strikes you are likely to still delete ghost strikes or softer strikes... likely to spend more time drawing regions back out to retain decay and ghost hits than you would save... rather i sometimes simply highlight and delete sections that contain only bleed, which is much quicker really.
i tend to use the "select & delete" method on tom tracks because it's pretty quick, given that toms are only played at certain points in a track normally... but for kick and snare there's so many hits that it's faster to simply set up gates... saves you time and on some systems the sheer amount of regions you have created after "selecting & deleting" the silence on kicks and snares can eat a lot of processor power to keep track of... especially if you use fades on them.
elmuchoescadawg
Member
Fair point. When Ive been using strip silence on tracks Ive been breaking the Region down into sections to give me a bit more control but I see your point totally.
Having said that would you not have to make threshold adjustments on a gate just as much as you would on strip silence?
I do often have to go back and put in the beginnings of snare rolls
no, not so much, because that is what your "key" track handles.... the trigger splat track has relatively consistant levels compared to the actual track.. so the splat for a softly hit snare has much more amplitude than the softly hit snare itself...and since it's what is opening the gate you needn't fuss as much with the threshold setting as you would otherwise.
once again, in the absence of a trigger splat track, just copy the original track and eq/compress it as exteremely as you need to in order to emphasize attacks. actual trigger splats are preferable though... saves so much time.
elmuchoescadawg
Member
metalkingdom
the kinder, gentler me
- Jan 1, 2005
- 1,634
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so i don't know how to mic drums? does knowing how to mic drums automatically preclude using gates? was this a thread on how to mic drums?
no, i gave the real answer (at least as it pertains to this particular thread)..... using a gate does not presume the fact that drums were recorded badly. of course if they are recorded badly, i.e. with loads of bleed, gates can help quite a bit, but i's perfectly legitimate to use gates even with well mic'ed drums if that's the sound you want.
micing drums well is a whole other thread, this was on using gates. using the null points of cardioid microphones to your advanage while micing will certainly clean your tracks up quite a bit though and may leave you not feeling so much like bothering with gating or deleting anything, especially in more sparse rock arrangements.
i know what you're saying, this just wasn't the thread for micing technique, it was very specifically on how to set up and use key inputs for gates.
metalkingdom
the kinder, gentler me
- Jan 1, 2005
- 1,634
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My comment wasn't directed to you at all... It was in response to this - "I think I have a good grasp of the basics... I wanted to try using the side chain to release my snare because I tend to have tons of bleed on that track from cymbals and hihat... "
Which means that he obviously does not have a good grasp of the basics. A gate will never solve this problem, because there's still gonna be bleed on the snare hits when the gate opens up. Come to think of it, gating a snare track with lots of bleed is extremely frustrating because more often than not it will sound even shittier than it would without gating.
Learning how to properly mic drums is way more important than learning to use a gate w/sidechaining in the grand scheme of things.
Everything you said about gating is 100% correct, but it's still running before walking for this particular case. So my previous post should've said, "James Murphy just schooled you on your question of sidechain gating techniques, but that's not the solution to your problems - proper micing is."
One other thing - I keep seeing all of these different numbers for the Haas effect on the net, but I learned it was sub 18ms and that seems to be the number if you experiment with it.
greyskull
Member
- Mar 22, 2006
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thats exactly the reason i dont like gating snares, on tracks with bleed instead of having a constant ammount, which you can work with, it comes in with every snare hit... what a pain in the arse. i like expanders on snares more.
time to dust off my mastering audio by bob katz then!! forgot about that one! by name at least
