Why Are These Guitars And Vocals Fighting?

[Frak]

Hey guys,
Just finished recording vocals for one of my band's demo songs today, and I've noticed that they are fighting with the guitars. I've spent an hour or two trying to work out why and how to fix it but I can't quite put my finger on it. Any ideas?

Here's the link


Also, while you're at it, what else could be fixed? It's still in the early stages of mixing, but critique always helps.

EDIT: Uploaded a new version after the discussion below. Sounding much better. All that's left is some drum humanization and to tie up some loose ends.

 

[greyskull]

The both occupy a very similar area in the mid range.
You've gotta find a way of carving out a space for the vocals. I like to dip 2k ish a little as i hate that frequency anyway.

But use the seek and destroy method... boost an eq point and boost it up a fair way, move it around til the clashing between instruments is the worst possible; then pull a little of that OUT of the guitars.

 

[smy1]

Or do the opposite of what greyskull says:

1) solo the guitars and the vocals
2) then use an EQ cut on one of the tracks and sweep it
3) listen to at what point the other track becomes more clear

I like this method a lot and very often the cut will end up being in a totally different freq-area than I expected.

 

[Frak]

Okay, thanks for the replies guys.
Just gave it a try, the trouble maker was about 850hz.
Now, another problem. I feel like cutting that frequency has taken away a lot of the "shine" from the guitars. They sound pretty dull now. Is there another frequency I can compensate with or something? Or maybe another trick entirely?

EDIT: After playing with the EQ a bit further, I've made it all work together much better. Thanks guys! I'll post the updated track in half an hour or so.

 

[Nimvi]

Glad you've worked it out. I agree with both methods posted above by the way, and use them both all the time with succes.

About the guitars sounding a bit duller after having made room for the vocal, the trick is to use automation. Only make the EQ cut the vocalrange during the vocalparts, and bring those frequencies back in when the vocals are inactive. This not only takes care of the dulling-down issue, but also makes the mix sound much more alive. Even if people don't know what's going on, automation makes things sound less flat to anyone. Maybe you already know that, but no harm in mentioning it I guess

 

[JayB]

Glad you've worked it out. I agree with both methods posted above by the way, and use them both all the time with succes.

About the guitars sounding a bit duller after having made room for the vocal, the trick is to use automation. Only make the EQ cut the vocalrange during the vocalparts, and bring those frequencies back in when the vocals are inactive. This not only takes care of the dulling-down issue, but also makes the mix sound much more alive. Even if people don't know what's going on, automation makes things sound less flat to anyone. Maybe you already know that, but no harm in mentioning it I guess

Never thought of that, awesome tip!

 

[Pre Studio Productions]

Glad you've worked it out. I agree with both methods posted above by the way, and use them both all the time with succes.

About the guitars sounding a bit duller after having made room for the vocal, the trick is to use automation. Only make the EQ cut the vocalrange during the vocalparts, and bring those frequencies back in when the vocals are inactive. This not only takes care of the dulling-down issue, but also makes the mix sound much more alive. Even if people don't know what's going on, automation makes things sound less flat to anyone. Maybe you already know that, but no harm in mentioning it I guess

this^^

also, how did you get that soundcloud player in your post?

 

[Frak]

Glad you've worked it out. I agree with both methods posted above by the way, and use them both all the time with succes.

About the guitars sounding a bit duller after having made room for the vocal, the trick is to use automation. Only make the EQ cut the vocalrange during the vocalparts, and bring those frequencies back in when the vocals are inactive. This not only takes care of the dulling-down issue, but also makes the mix sound much more alive. Even if people don't know what's going on, automation makes things sound less flat to anyone. Maybe you already know that, but no harm in mentioning it I guess

Interesting concept Nimyi! I'll give it a try. Thanks for the feedback!

I still haven't uploaded the new version yet, basically just deleted all my drums and I'm redoing them from scratch with Metal Machine instead of SD's Avatar kit.

 

[Frak]

this^^

also, how did you get that soundcloud player in your post?

Excuse the double post.
When you are creating a post, there's a button on the top that is a picture of the soundcloud icon (the white cloud with orange background).
You can click that and put the link in between, or you could just type (SOUNDCLOUD)(/SOUNDCLOUD) - using square brackets instead of rounded ones.

 

[Butt Nekkid]

Voxengo´s GlissEq is the right tool for this kind of precision work. It has the ability to import other tracks frequency curves into another copy of GlissEQ. So it´s really easy to compare up to four curves at the same time.

http://www.voxengo.com/product/glisseq/

 

[amarshism]

I imagine you could use the side chain function on c6 for this problem. I might try it myself.

 

[Pre Studio Productions]

Excuse the double post.
When you are creating a post, there's a button on the top that is a picture of the soundcloud icon (the white cloud with orange background).
You can click that and put the link in between, or you could just type (SOUNDCLOUD)(/SOUNDCLOUD) - using square brackets instead of rounded ones.

Thanks a tonnnn man

 

[KHE]

Voxengo´s GlissEq is the right tool for this kind of precision work. It has the ability to import other tracks frequency curves into another copy of GlissEQ. So it´s really easy to compare up to four curves at the same time.

http://www.voxengo.com/product/glisseq/

thanks a lot for the tipp!!

just checked out voxengo`s SPAN for this (freeware), a 8channel spectrum-analyzer (without eq).

it took a little time to understand the routing (reaper and span), but now it works and i think this is very useful!

cheers!