Your experience with a FireWire PCI/PCI-e card?

Erkan

Erkan

mr-walker.bandcamp
Jun 16, 2008
3,305
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Uppsala, Sweden
mr-walker.bandcamp.com
HAI GUISE

oh sorry, geek mode was activated. Ahem.... anyway, so I bricked my new and shiny Gigabyte motherboard which had Texas Instruments FireWire built-in but now they're not sold anymore so I can't get a new one. In the swedish online computer stores, there's like 60% ASUS boards, 20% Gigabyte and the final 20% are just various random brands. I know the ASUS boards use something like LS chipsets for FireWire (can't remember what LS stands for but it's not Texas Instruments so...) so I'm thinking of simply getting an ASUS board without FireWire, and then just completing it with a FireWire card instead.

Is this a good idea? I've never dealt with FireWire interfaces before, or any FireWire device what so ever, hence why I'm asking. Should I go for PCI or PCI-express? Any compatibility issues to be aware of? The interface in question is a Profire 2626 (which has yet to arrive... damn slow delivery!).

An example would be: https://www.inet.se/datorkomponenter/kontrollerkort/firewire-2-portar-pcie/5400778/

This card is cheap as dirt and it's PCI-e and it's a TI chipset according to that swedish online store.

This one seems pretty flexible, lots of FireWire connections and TI chipset: https://www.inet.se/datorkomponenter/kontrollerkort/firewire-3-portar-pci-firewire/5400168/

Any info is greatly appreciated! Mucho love, good night :)
 
either one would be good, however its always wise to get the more expensive one when you are looking at something of that price. But, the cheaper one it a TI so i think that one would be more stable.

It call comes down to which one will be the most stable, so my vote would be on the TI.
 
Looks like most of the cost for the second one is just for FW800 ports and more FW400 ports; I'd go with the first dude, you should be fine, and if not, save the receipt and box! :)
 
Erkan said:
Should I go for PCI or PCI-express?
Click to expand...


HAI ERKAN, as far as I know PCI-E belongs to the Northbridge part of the motherboard whereas built-in firewire stuff and PCI stuff belongs to the Southbridge - which is very, very congested due to hard-disks, dvd/blu-ray drives, network cards/other pci cards etc. Shoving in a Firewire card into the PCI-E slot would yield you much better results than PCI or even built-in firewire, but you have to make sure of how many PCI-E slots your motherboard offers. If you're a hardcore gamer and you don't like your motherboard's built-in graphic chip you'd definitely want 2 slots. Now, some people would say that a high-end graphic card can really congest your northbridge. But unless you've got Reaper and Gears of War running at the same time that's not an issue at all. :lol:

Btw, don't worry . Your data transfer would always be in a steady-stream and never in chunks. Even though you're plugging into a PCI-E slot, it wouldn't act like a PCI-E slot. The only advantage is the north-bridge. You'll be surprised by the difference.
 
I have a Firestudio which is very picky when it comes to FW controlers.
On my laptop I have a LSI (Agere) controler, and I must say that it works better than a PCI-E controler with Texas Instruments that I have on my desktop machine.
Even though TI is usually a safe choice, it is true for integrated or PCI versions of FW400 non combo cards.
PCI-E seams to have it`s peculiarities with FW, so by my experience, I`d still get an LSI or some tried and true PCI card with TI.
 
AudioGeekZine said:
Stick with SIIG, LaCie or ADS Pyro

ASUS has LSI chipset and you should just disable it.
Click to expand...

Ah yes that's it... LSI chipset. I remembered it as "LS-something" :) I haven't read any recommendations about this chipset so I will definately be aiming for a TI chipset. It seems to be a decent idea to get an ASUS board since they seem to be making one hell of a motherboard these days, considering that they pretty much dominate the retailers' inventories.

Maamar Huq said:
HAI ERKAN, as far as I know PCI-E belongs to the Northbridge part of the motherboard whereas built-in firewire stuff and PCI stuff belongs to the Southbridge - which is very, very congested due to hard-disks, dvd/blu-ray drives, network cards/other pci cards etc. Shoving in a Firewire card into the PCI-E slot would yield you much better results than PCI or even built-in firewire, but you have to make sure of how many PCI-E slots your motherboard offers. If you're a hardcore gamer and you don't like your motherboard's built-in graphic chip you'd definitely want 2 slots. Now, some people would say that a high-end graphic card can really congest your northbridge. But unless you've got Reaper and Gears of War running at the same time that's not an issue at all. :lol:

Btw, don't worry . Your data transfer would always be in a steady-stream and never in chunks. Even though you're plugging into a PCI-E slot, it wouldn't act like a PCI-E slot. The only advantage is the north-bridge. You'll be surprised by the difference.
Click to expand...

Wow dude, this info was really useful! I haven't seen this anywhere so far... thanks so much for sharing it. Guess I will go for a PCI-e in that case so the workload across the motherboard is more evenly distributed? And there is absolutely no need to worry about the gamer issue... I'm building this new quad core computer purely for studio work so I will never be playing games or anything on it :) 2 PCI-e is the minimum I should go for though since I do have a separate GFX-card... since most of the built-ins kinda suck even if you don't run 3D applications.

All in all, thanks dudes, I'll be scouting for a new motherboard now and pick a FireWire card along with it :)
 
i have M-audio Profire 2626 interface connected to a PCI firewire device ADS PYRO PCI 64R2. i'm using win XP and gigabyte mobo with intel 945 chipset.
i did many recordings with various setups including like 14-16 channel drum recording with backing click track and pilot guitars, with NO SINGLE PROBLEM.
 
Pipsymbol said:
i have M-audio Profire 2626 interface connected to a PCI firewire device ADS PYRO PCI 64R2. i'm using win XP and gigabyte mobo with intel 945 chipset.
i did many recordings with various setups including like 14-16 channel drum recording with backing click track and pilot guitars, with NO SINGLE PROBLEM.
Click to expand...

Ashgarth said:
I use my digi002 with an asus motherboard, and have no problem.

I also have a pci firewire card with TI chipset...so if I have any problem ever with the firewire in the asus motherboard I can use it.
Click to expand...

Really glad to hear this from you guys!

I've picked a "Asus P5Q-E P45, Socket 775" to serve as my new motherboard... it had some pretty sick reviews on the net. I think I will also get the first FireWire PCI-e card I linked in the top of the thread (it has a TI chipset) even though the Asus motherboard has FireWire built in. I just want to be on the safe side so I'd rather spend a little more money and get a TI chipset on the FireWire card... however...

does it matter what brand the card is itself or is the only important thing what chipset it has? Like many network cards for example, there are a LOAD of different brands but they all sort of use the same chipset and most of them seem to work just fine. How important is it that I get a really expensive and "trendy" brand for the actual card, regardless of what chipset it has? This is already costing me more than I counted for so... if I can get away with that cheap one, I would be slightly happier :)
 
there is a list of officially supported firewire cards on m-audio FAQ pages.
if you can get one of these you'll be 100% safe.

this is what it says on the pages:


Compatible FireWire 400 Adapter Cards

Q: Which FireWire 400 Adapter Card should I get to use with my M-Audio FireWire device?

A: M-Audio recommends using a FireWire 400 Adapter Card with a Texas Instruments (TI) chipset.

Digidesign has qualified the following FireWire 400 Adapter cards for use with Pro Tools M-Powered:

FireWire/1394 Controller PCIe (PCI Express) Card:

SIIG FireWire 2-Port PCIe
Part Numbers:
* NN-E20012-S1
* NN-E20012-S2 (RoHS compliant)
Bus type: PCI Express x1


FireWire/1394 Controller PCI Cards:

ADS PYRO PCI 64R2
Part Number: API-311
Bus type: 64-bit PCI

SIIG 1394 3-port PCI i/e
Part Numbers:
* NN-440012
* NN-440012-S8 (RoHS compliant)
Bus type: 32-bit PCI


FireWire/1394 Cards for Laptops:

SIIG FireWire 2-Port ExpressCard
Part Number: NN-EC2012-S1
 
Pipsymbol, thanks for that info! But those brands are not available from this retailer and I hate to buy things from separate places :( I suspect those are really expensive too but I'll take a look around... thanks a bunch.

AudioGeekZine, I just saw the Pro model is only like 10$ more so I could get that one. Is there any obvious advantage to have the Pro model? I noticed it has better cooling on the bridges but apart from that..?
 
Just ran "ADS PYRO" on a www.pricerunner.se (swedish site for comparing prices on anything and everything) and got zero results. That means it's gonna be hell to get a hold of this card and I would probably have to order it from the States and that is just way too much hassle for a fucking FireWire card. I'm gonna have to take the risk and just go for a generic card, as long as it has TI chipset that is. The Asus board also has the LSI chipset so I will atleast have something as a backup if it would fail miserably... :S
 
Erkan said:
Just ran "ADS PYRO" on a www.pricerunner.se (swedish site for comparing prices on anything and everything) and got zero results. That means it's gonna be hell to get a hold of this card and I would probably have to order it from the States and that is just way too much hassle for a fucking FireWire card. I'm gonna have to take the risk and just go for a generic card, as long as it has TI chipset that is. The Asus board also has the LSI chipset so I will atleast have something as a backup if it would fail miserably... :S
Click to expand...

I have recently been through this. Using my Profire 2626 on an Asus P5K/EPU P35 chipset board. Tried the onboard firewire - playback fine but clicks and pops on record - now this was totally expected as it is via/agere/lsi - take your pick ! and was sharing IRQs. Solution Belkin FireWire card model F5U502EA with the required TI chipset.

http://www.ebuyer.com/product/47028

don't know if they ship from UK but I can confirm this setup is rock solid. The comments re PCI-e over PCI can't say they are necessarily helpful to you. PCI-e was an unecessary further complication to add to firewire card selection. My build for this box uses a PCI-e Geforce 7300 the 2626 is plenty powerful on a PCI firewire card. The Profire 2626 sits on the TI PCI firewire card on IRQ 17 - on it's own so no problems and it's a great setup.
 
Thanks for the information Transputer.

I am REALLY split between PCI and PCI-e. Been reading on the net for a while now, and I've heard from a friend that PCI-e has an overall higher latency but offers more bandwidth instead. As we all know, the bandwidth is not an issue for us audio geeks since it's a steady and constant stream (and 8 channels of audio from my Profire 2626 should NOT cap the bandwidth of even regular PCI), so I'm not sure which type of card to pick. There are other advantages of PCI-e though, stuff like you don't have to mess around with the IRQ and shit because they don't interrupt each other the same way as normal PCI does and so on. But my main priority is low latency with this setup, otherwise there is no point to it. If it's true that PCI-e has a higher latency, then I should just get a PCI card, but I haven't really found a rock solid evidence of this on the net yet... just some vague hints.
 
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