44th President of the USA

[freakchylde]

With regards to your reasoning behind why English should be the official language... if anything that's an argument AGAINST English as the official language. If you need to mail official documentation in German to Germany, how else should one go about getting it? Further, look at the amount of people that cannot, or speak poor English and weigh that number against the amount of people living in the US (whether that be citizens, non-citizens, or illegal immigrants) who require specialized paperwork in another language. One vastly outweighs the other.

Howso? If I need to mail official documentation to Germany, I'll write it. If I'm in the government, I'll get one of the official translators in the State Dept write it up (we do have those, for the whole purpose of official visits and whatnot). If I'm a company, I'll hire a translator to write it. Doesn't seem all that difficult.

It's called, pay a translator. My teammates had to do it, so they could understand the contract they were signing in English, fully. The law firm that handled their immigration and business contracts made it available to them. I'm sorry, but if we have a number of people in this country to aren't proficient enough in English to communicate, that out-weighs those in this country who do, then we have a problem that needs to be fixed. Whether it be the requirement of English proficiency for immigration or work visas, or requiring it within one-two years of arrival. There is no reason for it.

 

[...AndTimeBegan]

Good thing I quoted you.

No, it's the individual's responsibility, IMO, not the government's. If you're a citizen and you can't speak enough English to communicate, then you need to work harder at learning it. There are plenty of places with free ESL classes, there is no reason for a citizen, as described by you, to not be in one. Immersion is a wonderful thing, use what's available to you.

Hmm... I don't recall haranguing you about your spelling mistakes (should you make any), nor do I recall haranguing anyone on this board for spelling mistakes. I don't see the reason for your rudeness. Oh well, cheap shots do nothing more than weaken your argument.

You don't learn English overnight. You can however, require medical assistance overnight. By being on US soil, hospitals are required to treat anyone. Absence of a translator for people who cannot speak English could lead to unavoidable medical malpractice. This isn't a difficult concept.

 

[...AndTimeBegan]

Howso? If I need to mail official documentation to Germany, I'll write it. If I'm in the government, I'll get one of the official translators in the State Dept write it up (we do have those, for the whole purpose of official visits and whatnot). If I'm a company, I'll hire a translator to write it. Doesn't seem all that difficult.

It's called, pay a translator. My teammates had to do it, so they could understand the contract they were signing in English, fully. The law firm that handled their immigration and business contracts made it available to them. I'm sorry, but if we have a number of people in this country to aren't proficient enough in English to communicate, that out-weighs those in this country who do, then we have a problem that needs to be fixed. Whether it be the requirement of English proficiency for immigration or work visas, or requiring it within one-two years of arrival. There is no reason for it.

Ok and what if you need specific forms that are in another language- like government forms? You can't simply hire a translator to copy that... That's illegal.

 

[freakchylde]

Ok and what if you need specific forms that are in another language- like government forms? You can't simply hire a translator to copy that... That's illegal.

Then *I* foot the bill for the government getting those forms translated. It's not the government's fault that I need those forms in another language.

 

[...AndTimeBegan]

Then *I* foot the bill for the government getting those forms translated. It's not the government's fault that I need those forms in another language.

And if you can't afford those forms? How about instead of thinking for yourself, think about the people that generally require those forms in the first place. It's not Ted's (or would you prefer "Bob" in this hypothetical scenario?) fault that he he needs those forms in another language if he for insance, fled to America as a result of war or genocide in his home country but cannot yet afford to foot the bill. Excuse him for wanting to live.

Once again, the number of people who need such forms is vastly outweighed by the amount of people living in America who either cannot speak English, or speak it poorly. People's lives are far more important, whether you want to accept it or not, than your personal frustration in dealing with those who cannot speak English.

 

[freakchylde]

And if you can't afford those forms?

Then I guess I have a problem. Still not the government's problem.

 

[Pellaz]

The fact (if it is so) that hospitals MUST treat anyone on American soil will mean the death of charity hospitals within 10-15 years. It's already happening as we speak (witness Grady Hospital in Atlanta), and the problem is even more advanced in the UK.

 

[sh0kr0k]

The fact (if it is so) that hospitals MUST treat anyone on American soil will mean the death of charity hospitals within 10-15 years. It's already happening as we speak (witness Grady Hospital in Atlanta), and the problem is even more advanced in the UK.

Colleen (13ShadesOfGray) told me that numerous hospitals in her area (San Diego) have been shut down because they can't afford to foot the bill for the emergency room visits of poverty-level visitors, the massive majority being immigrants. All I know is what she told me, but if that's true it's very troubling =( She also mentioned a number of other things that she deals with on a daily basis that really make her & her family a minority in her city.

If that's the transition of this nation's history, then so be it. My family is built off immigrants coming here too, though legal. Here in Texas I constantly see advertisements, products, and services entirely in Spanish, without a lick of English. What frustrates me about that is the lack of respect for English-speakers yet nearly everything these days will have a Spanish translation.

hmm.. I hope that made sense, I'm running on empty right now.

 

[J-Man]

I can see all points brought up, and i agree with some of them, but the bottom line is as Tammy said, here along the border there is a complete disrespect for non-spanish speaking people. We are so in the minority here in El Paso its like 75% hispanic to 15% Caucasian. Yea I know i choose to live here so it is my problem, and I will agree with that, but when i go into a national chain store and the checkout person starts talking to me in Spanish and when i say i don't understand, i get a 5 minute scolding on why i should speak spanish, and that it is my responsiblility to learn the language of the border, that is pure bullshit.

And also we have a county hospital, and 45% of the patients are illegal and i don't mean illegal immigrants, i mean they live in Juarez Mexico, and come across the border to go to the emergency room for the sniffiles, who pays for it? You guessed it I DO, with my county hospital tax.

I live across the street from an elementry school, and on any given day over on-third of the cars parked there in the afternoon picking up kids have Mexican plates and the school has specific classes for NON_ENGLISH speaking kids and well as the regular classes, who pays for these classes??? No the parents of the kids in these classes, cause they are from mexico, I DO!

And what about the lady from Mexico who 2 years ago, who used my driveway to make her turn around for her get away, and crashed into the back of one of our cars, and then tried to blame it on us cause she used the driveway everyday to turn around and we should not have been home at that time. Police called, report taken, she was released, and the policeman regrettable said that she was from Mexico and even though she was cited with two tickets we would never see money for the repairs, again who paid??? I DID and my insurance went through the roof.

Granted it is my choice to live here because of my job and family, so i will bitch and moan and complain, and i know notheing will change it will just get worse. Oh yea and 60% of our elected city and county officials are either under investigation or have been indicted for various crimes that they have commited while in office. Again who pays We the citizens do.

 

[Greykiller]

One year from today....we'll know who that man/woman is.

Neither party wants to win this race, considering the state of the economy to come and the way the war is playing out.
It will be Rudy Guiliani/Mitt Romney Vs. Hillary and Obama. The racists will come out in droves, and the christian fundementalists will hold there noses and vote for Rudy.

Rudy will win with such a large margin there will be no need for voter tampering.

I so hope that I am wrong.

 

[Burnout]

Neither party wants to win this race, considering the state of the economy to come and the way the war is playing out.
It will be Rudy Guiliani/Mitt Romney Vs. Hillary and Obama. The racists will come out in droves, and the christian fundementalists will hold there noses and vote for Rudy.

Rudy will win with such a large margin there will be no need for voter tampering.

I so hope that I am wrong.

If that happens I'll be buying a one way ticket to Europe.

 

[sh0kr0k]

..stuff..

Word. Frustrating, isn't it? If a dual-language society is what everyone wants, then fine, but they better start paying some damn taxes if they want to have it easy while living here!

If that happens I'll be buying a one way ticket to Europe.

Brazil for me.... though that wouldn't solve any of the problems we've been discussing in this thread!

 

[freakchylde]

Word. Frustrating, isn't it? If a dual-language society is what everyone wants, then fine, but they better start paying some damn taxes if they want to have it easy while living here!

Which is the issue I have with taxpayer money going to this stuff. The non-taxpayers aren't paying into it, but can reap the benefits. They shouldn't be. Tax-funded programs are for citizens, not for the people who choose to show up here and reap the benefits of it (for me, this cuts across the board, not just in regards to Mexicans). And, this is one reason, why I'm totally against Americans heading north for their prescription refills (which is a totally different subject, but along the same lines when you look at what goes on behind the scenes).

 

[Burnout]

Brazil for me.... though that wouldn't solve any of the problems we've been discussing in this thread!

True, I just can't really support the vast majority of Republican policies. I can't say Clinton is my ideal candidate but I'll support her before I jump on board with Romney or Guliani.

I'm most concerned with energy/environmental policy and the whole Republican policy of letting the market handle the issue with minimal involvement doesn't seem to have been terribly effective over the course of recent years.

I also like how the Repubs have environmental policies while also supporting increased offshore drilling to meet growing energy demands. I'm sort of curious as to how they plan on reconciling those particular sections of their platforms.

And, as far as Guliani goes, being endorsed by Pat Robertson is more or less the touch of death in my book, that guy makes my skin crawl.

 

[J-Man]

True, I just can't really support the vast majority of Republican policies. I can't say Clinton is my ideal candidate but I'll support her before I jump on board with Romney or Guliani.

I'm most concerned with energy/environmental policy and the whole Republican policy of letting the market handle the issue with minimal involvement doesn't seem to have been terribly effective over the course of recent years.

I also like how the Repubs have environmental policies while also supporting increased offshore drilling to meet growing energy demands. I'm sort of curious as to how they plan on reconciling those particular sections of their platforms.

And, as far as Guliani goes, being endorsed by Pat Robertson is more or less the touch of death in my book, that guy makes my skin crawl.

Please say it ain't so?????? I am a conservative, but yet i have not found a conservative candiate i like in this election so far, the closest i can come is Fred Thompson, but please not another Clinton, in Hillary's case it is again 'I will say what the people want to hear" but she will never carry forth with it. But again as i have stated so many times I will respect your choice, and defend your right to vote for whomever you want, but i ain't gonna cut you any slack, hehehehehehehe at least your informed and want to vote.

That is what i Like about the PP family, they are informed, concerned, and want to make a difference. we may not all have the same views, but we respect each others views and are willing to discuss any differences we have.

 

[...AndTimeBegan]

Neither party wants to win this race, considering the state of the economy to come and the way the war is playing out.
It will be Rudy Guiliani/Mitt Romney Vs. Hillary and Obama. The racists will come out in droves, and the christian fundementalists will hold there noses and vote for Rudy.

Rudy will win with such a large margin there will be no need for voter tampering.

I so hope that I am wrong.

Rudy doesn't stand a chance and neither does Mitt. Huckabee will probably get the nomination on the Republican side. As for the Democratic side... either Hillary or Obama.

 

[Burnout]

Please say it ain't so?????? I am a conservative, but yet i have not found a conservative candiate i like in this election so far, the closest i can come is Fred Thompson, but please not another Clinton, in Hillary's case it is again 'I will say what the people want to hear" but she will never carry forth with it. But again as i have stated so many times I will respect your choice, and defend your right to vote for whomever you want, but i ain't gonna cut you any slack, hehehehehehehe at least your informed and want to vote.

That is what i Like about the PP family, they are informed, concerned, and want to make a difference. we may not all have the same views, but we respect each others views and are willing to discuss any differences we have.

I'd rather see Obama get the party's nomination, to be perfectly honest, but so far the Democratic candidates scare me less than the Republicans.

I liked McCain before he made something of an about face and started pitching the party line more and more. I'm not at all a fan of Romney and I guess I could bring myself to vote for Guliani but it would take some serious convincing.

 

[...AndTimeBegan]

in Hillary's case it is again 'I will say what the people want to hear" but she will never carry forth with it.

It's called politics and almost every president has done this- including Bush countless times (Bush has done this more than any other president in fact).

The reason why I support Hillary is because of her husband. Whether you like him or not, his foreign policy is fantastic. What we need now is strong foreign policy and not this 3rd grade anti-diplomacy crap Bush is pulling.

 

[sh0kr0k]

The reason why I support Hillary is because of her husband. Whether you like him or not, his foreign policy is fantastic. What we need now is strong foreign policy and not this 3rd grade anti-diplomacy crap Bush is pulling.

Does Hillary share her husband's ideas for foreign policy?

 

[Burnout]

Does Hillary share her husband's ideas for foreign policy?

One can only hope, although I'm still hoping Obama gets the party nomination at the moment.

As far as politicians go I've actually been really happy with Schwarzenegger as governor. I'm kind of hoping he runs for a Senate/House seat after he terms out in 2010.