Acoustic Drums for Metal: A Guide

[MKS]

Mr. OzNimbus.

What version of drumagog are you using? Yours looks a lot different than mine.

BTW - As always, thanks for all the information. Much appreciated.

 

[JeffTD]

I still can't figure out how to HPF a reverb return - if I slap an eq on the reverb bus, it affects the signal I'm sending to it, not just the return. Anyone care to detail how to do this in Cubase/Nuendo?

 

[Ermz]

Most verb plug-ins should have their own HPF. In Nuendo, your 'aux' tracks are called FX tracks. What he meant, I assume, is that you should add an EQ plug-in right before the reverb plug-in on the FX track, so that you kill everything below 200 before it even gets to the reverb.

One thing I've been wondering for a while... is it possible to sidechain in Nuendo? I've never found a way to do it.

 

[JeffTD]

Actually, what he means is just to filter off the reverbs low end, as reverbing the low end of things is just going to muddy stuff up, but you still want to keep the low end in the signal - thus my question.

 

[Ermz]

You want to take out the low end of the signal you're sending to the verb unit. I'm not talking about affecting the dry signal at all.

 

[Torniojaws]

One thing I've been wondering for a while... is it possible to sidechain in Nuendo? I've never found a way to do it.

I've read about a lot of people complaining you can't do real sidechaining in Cubase/Nuendo, but apparently Steinberg is supposed to add it to the next installment (4.0), along with drag'n'drop-moveable effects

However, there's many guides on how to work around the lack, but it only works with plugins that support sidechaining. Here's one I found:

1)add a stereo group track.

2) add the C1 comp-sc as an insert device on the group channel.

3) Now we start the routing. In the inspector, Set the output of the synth's AUDIO channel to the input of the group and set the pan to hard right.

4) For the drum's audio channel put in a pre-fader send to the group (in the channel settings window). Make sure that the send is "on" and that the send level is raised to at least 0db. Now pan the send to hard left (the pan parameter is only visible on the send when in routing mode, found in the little black box at the top right of the channel settings window) We want this to be pre-fader so we can turn down this channel's fader and not change the send's level to the group (compressor).

5) play back, if everything is set up correctly you should hear the synth on the right, the drums on both left and right (although slightly higher volume on the left ( now that it is going through 2 channels). If the group's fader is turned down all the way then the synth should not be heard and the kick (if mono) should be equal on both sides.

6) Now to set up the compressor. For "EQ mode" select "sidechain". For "key mode" select "L --> R" , this sets the kick as the sidechain key and the synth's signal as what is to be controlled by the key.

 

[Nebulous]

Nice clips Oz. Any chance of the whole song?

 

[CJWall]

Most verb plug-ins should have their own HPF. In Nuendo, your 'aux' tracks are called FX tracks. What he meant, I assume, is that you should add an EQ plug-in right before the reverb plug-in on the FX track, so that you kill everything below 200 before it even gets to the reverb.

One thing I've been wondering for a while... is it possible to sidechain in Nuendo? I've never found a way to do it.

I've never tried to C1 method above, but theres a plug called GoldenGate by Sinusweb that makes sidechaining wayy easier than the above method.

Google it, I believe it's shareware.

Charlie

 

[~BURNY~]

Actually, what he means is just to filter off the reverbs low end, as reverbing the low end of things is just going to muddy stuff up, but you still want to keep the low end in the signal - thus my question.

Make sure your return is 100% wet and filter... There should be no problem with the dry signal...

 

[Seizure.]

Tc natice plug in set has good side chaining aswell.

 

[Glenn Fricker]

is that you should add an EQ plug-in right before the reverb plug-in on the FX track, so that you kill everything below 200 before it even gets to the reverb.

Precisely. Not my idea, actually. I was reading an interview with Alan Parsons about his work on "Dark Side of the Moon" and he mentioned it.... I tried it out & it's great.



BTW, it's Drumagog 3 in the screenshot. I'm not paying to upgrade something that works fine.
-0z-

 

[Glenn Fricker]

Nice clips Oz. Any chance of the whole song?

Whoops! I was gonna put that in the article. Here's the link:
Final Stage - In the Night

 

[Ermz]

I've read about a lot of people complaining you can't do real sidechaining in Cubase/Nuendo, but apparently Steinberg is supposed to add it to the next installment (4.0), along with drag'n'drop-moveable effects

Yes, I'd heard about that. It's very odd that it's taken them this long to implement some rather rudimentary features. Makes me a bit more enthused about getting an Mbox 2 and just switching to ProTools.

 

[Glenn Fricker]

It's called the "uniform" shade.

You can get it, and a whole bunch of others, here:
http://www.angelfire.com/ult/saw/

 

[Nebulous]

Cool. I like the track. Do they have a name and/ or website?

 

[poundingmetal74]

Yup.

www.finalstage.ca
-OR-
www.myspace.com/finalstage

 

[Nebulous]

Haha, cheers man.

 

[cobrahead1030]

thanks a ton for taking the time to do all this man

altho 90% of the stuff in the mix section is knocking my brain for a loop (not your fault, i just don't understand what half that stuff is)

any idea where i may be able to find more info on exactly what are the techniques you described in the mixing section? such as sidechaining etc. i'm really stupid when it comes to doing anything beyond basic eq, compression, etc.

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

Just put it all into Word. Thanks Oz!

 

[zmetallica]

I just read this whole thread. so here's some of what i have to say to it all:

I give you all mad props, but especially to Glenn. i remember back when you did betrayer's rusted icons, and i was like wow this guy can really do drums, but that guitar tone was so muddy (then again that was your old studio). after listening to that sample, you've learned a ton. hell from betrayer's last EP to now i hear improvements. drums is something i've got down, but still need work with. I don't know the best methods/equipment to get/use. though i've never used an XY set up for overheads. It just doesn't work right, so i'm surprised you used that.

also what that guy posted from SAE is appealing to me since I'll be going there in less than a year. I looked at some of the other things through that site (you should all look too) some interesting stuff along with basic things I already knew. lots of help with the 'which mics to get' section in the beginning.

I too have never heard of side chaining, but i think i can guess what it is. anyone wanna care to explain it in detail? I currently use nuendo. also mega thanks for all those nifty little free plug-in links. personally i think all plug-ins should be free (or at least not 4k for a large plug in pack IE waves), we all already (or will in my case hehe) paid for expensive hardware, mics, mixers, software, etc. I can only think of this one way, its a one time payment... (right?) Do you have other suggestions on plug-ins to use in correspondence with drums to "enhance" them that are good and free/cheap and dx/vst? for example, name a good reverb for drums.