Actually, a well tuned kit will "sing." Gates, my friend. Learn what they are & how to use them.
Acoustic Drums for Metal: A Guide
- Thread starter Glenn Fricker
- Start date
Flal
Flal
lol, we followed almost everything on this thread so tuning was a big deal. We used a tension meter so that every individual drum sounds perfect, but when played together, the toms ring.
I'll ask my friend to set some gates Oz, thx.
AdamWathan
Member
I'm that friend 
Shouldn't it be possible to get a good drum sound without gating the shit out of the toms? I don't like the idea of cutting them out completely and then having them turn on during the tom rolls introducing cymbal bleed that just sharply cuts in and out with the gate :\... I'm worried it'll sound unnatural.
Does anyone else have this problem? Here's 3 clips to demonstrate...
Toms solo'd: http://www.ashesofthefallen.net/coldtoms.mp3
All drums: http://www.ashesofthefallen.net/coldall.mp3
Toms muted: http://www.ashesofthefallen.net/coldnotoms.mp3
Shouldn't it be possible to get a good drum sound without gating the shit out of the toms? I don't like the idea of cutting them out completely and then having them turn on during the tom rolls introducing cymbal bleed that just sharply cuts in and out with the gate :\... I'm worried it'll sound unnatural.
Does anyone else have this problem? Here's 3 clips to demonstrate...
Toms solo'd: http://www.ashesofthefallen.net/coldtoms.mp3
All drums: http://www.ashesofthefallen.net/coldall.mp3
Toms muted: http://www.ashesofthefallen.net/coldnotoms.mp3
deanbailey
O.C.D Member
I noticed you aim the Hat mic towards the edge(which is good) but facing the snare side of the hat.
I'd suggest aiming it towards the opposite side, away from the snare.
Sloan
Sounds like shit!
I'm that friend
Shouldn't it be possible to get a good drum sound without gating the shit out of the toms? I don't like the idea of cutting them out completely and then having them turn on during the tom rolls introducing cymbal bleed that just sharply cuts in and out with the gate :... I'm worried it'll sound unnatural.
Does anyone else have this problem? Here's 3 clips to demonstrate...
Toms solo'd: http://www.ashesofthefallen.net/coldtoms.mp3
All drums: http://www.ashesofthefallen.net/coldall.mp3
Toms muted: http://www.ashesofthefallen.net/coldnotoms.mp3
You've just got to work with the gate settings to get it to sound natural. It can be a real pain in the ass, but it's worth it. Once I started using gates, my mixes were a lot cleaner and AWESOME.
AdamWathan
Member
I'm starting to think that maybe that problem I had was because of the fact that my tom sliders were sitting at 0db and hadn't been lowered for the mix since there were no tom parts in the recording... If there had been tom hits, maybe I would've had to lower the tom tracks a lot to get the toms to sit at the right level with the rest of the kit and that might have made the ringing less obvious...
I know gates will help but I still don't think I should HAVE to do it to get a remotely decent drum sound. Koshpa's stuff isn't gated and he was recording in a much less ideal environment than I was, using stock skins and being more limited by his microphone selection and you don't hear any irritating BOING in the toms every time his kick drum goes off... I think it's just a matter of dampening the source sound, I don't want ringy toms anyways. The moongels don't seem to work very well on toms though and they don't make 8" mute rings so I would have to come up with an alternative way for dampening the 8" tom, which drives me nuts because I'd want to have every tom dampened the same way
Anyone have any dampening solutions that don't involve mucking up expensive brand new skins with tape?
I know gates will help but I still don't think I should HAVE to do it to get a remotely decent drum sound. Koshpa's stuff isn't gated and he was recording in a much less ideal environment than I was, using stock skins and being more limited by his microphone selection and you don't hear any irritating BOING in the toms every time his kick drum goes off... I think it's just a matter of dampening the source sound, I don't want ringy toms anyways. The moongels don't seem to work very well on toms though and they don't make 8" mute rings so I would have to come up with an alternative way for dampening the 8" tom, which drives me nuts because I'd want to have every tom dampened the same way
Anyone have any dampening solutions that don't involve mucking up expensive brand new skins with tape?I don't like them becasue they rattle on the head, making it sound distorted thru the mic.
schust
Member
i use them. they work pretty well for me, but i do use a few carefully placed pieces of duct tape to keep them in position.
Yes I've changed that, followed by some other changes to the mic placement. The overhead picks up the hihat very well so this hihat mic maybe won't even be used in the mix. We'll see.
Flal
Flal
Sloan
Sounds like shit!
AdamWathan
Member
I find they barely make any difference. We had moongels on all of the toms during the recording of those clips I posted... Anyone done a whole kit up with those Evans EC2 clears for their toms? They have some sort of dampening ring in them, just wondering how much of a difference it makes... My drummer has one for his 8" but has G2s for the rest so I didn't really notice if the 8" was going off since I wasn't trying to isolate the problem we were having at the time and the recorded tracks are 4000km away right now on my external HDD
Brett - K A L I S I A
Dreaded Moderator
Wow, moongels do make a very big difference, maybe you placed them wrong or maybe you should have put more if you thought it wasn't enough. Sometimes I even put some on resonant skins (and keep praying for them to stay in place which is rarely the case, lol)
broken81
Used by Protools
Brett what if you put a little piece of tape over the moon gel on resonant head to hold it?
Or would that just be bad news.....
Or would that just be bad news.....
Brett - K A L I S I A
Dreaded Moderator
I tried it but it couldn't hold, so then I just decided to use the good old "tissue and lots of tape" on the problematic resonant head
broken81
Used by Protools
This is what Ive been using. I need to quit being cheap and buy some moongel though.
Great thread. I'm a bit late in on this, but better late than never.
I use moongel all the time. I usually put it right on the edge next to the rim of the drum. It will damped some of the overtones, but not kill the tone quite as much. I've also used the paper-towels and duct tape for certain things like a kick resonant that couldn't be tuned. Worked well.
I use moongel all the time. I usually put it right on the edge next to the rim of the drum. It will damped some of the overtones, but not kill the tone quite as much. I've also used the paper-towels and duct tape for certain things like a kick resonant that couldn't be tuned. Worked well.
Flal
Flal
Although we used a tension gauge I have a feeling that the resonance skins are the ones causing the problems. We'll have to experiment with some different tunings. The moon gels on the snare are godly, but yeah, they didn't really help for the toms. How many do you guys use when you do use them?
johnny dove
Member
hey guys i'm new to the board, and i just wanted to say thanks for this thread, it's really been very helpful!
BUT. one thing has been really bothering me, and i'm just weird and anal so i have to say it.
you don't flip/invert phase. you flip/invert POLARITY. it's a polarity switch, not a phase switch.
i know it's really not a huge deal as long as everyone gets the idea, but still.
anyway, i really have gotten a lot out of this thread, and others at the forum here, so thanks!!
BUT. one thing has been really bothering me, and i'm just weird and anal so i have to say it.
you don't flip/invert phase. you flip/invert POLARITY. it's a polarity switch, not a phase switch.
i know it's really not a huge deal as long as everyone gets the idea, but still.
anyway, i really have gotten a lot out of this thread, and others at the forum here, so thanks!!
