Alive Or just Breathing vs the Blackening??
- Thread starter dan weapon
- Start date
Erik Monsonis
Member
What about Fear Factory's Demanufacture? I think it was a non precedent modern metal album back in the '95 and set up a standard...
Dead Children Speak No Lies
Westie Headbanger
- Nov 15, 2007
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This poll is about AOJB vs The Blackening. To me they are both strong albums but AOJB slightly shades The Blackening.
If you want to talk influential, then Black Sabbath wins..bar none.
If you want to talk influential, then Black Sabbath wins..bar none.
I'm with you but I have to re-iterate dude, we're talking post 98/99.
Demanufacture, Burn My Eyes, Heartwork, Slaughter Of The Soul, Destroy Erase Improve... all amazing albums and all resonsible for what metal sounds like today. But all came out 94/95.
Otherwise we could start talking about Pantera, then Metallica/Slayer/Megadeth, then Maiden/Priest and then Sabbath/Led Zep!
slayercannibalsuffohead
Get a dog up ya!
Machinehead all the way .......... KSE are boring for me, not enough there to keep me awake!
Now IRON MAIDENS "BRAVE NEW WORLD". Great songwriting, percussion, vocals etc. You dont hang around in metal for 30 odd years for making shit! These blokes are a true testament for not only album of the decade, but for ALBUMS OF THE PAST 3 DECADES!
Now IRON MAIDENS "BRAVE NEW WORLD". Great songwriting, percussion, vocals etc. You dont hang around in metal for 30 odd years for making shit! These blokes are a true testament for not only album of the decade, but for ALBUMS OF THE PAST 3 DECADES!
slayercannibalsuffohead
Get a dog up ya!
Well here in Australia (in my corner of the globe anyway) KSE rarely gets talked about, let alone comes into any discussions about being influencial.
The only positives I hear for KSE are Howards vocals and the guitar tones.
Im not here to bag them out, as they have done well for themselves and have a good following, but one odd record with a couple of hits, vs 15 odd great records with 100s of memorable hits, including BRAVE NEW WORLD, makes MAIDEN and countless other great bands (MACHINEHEAD as well) 1000 times more influencial than KSE.
Im having a guess here, but if you polled all the metal community in the world about being influencial in the past decade (that includes ages 12 -92) Maidens BNW would murder KSE.
Maybe here at this forum not likely, as many people love the KSE style here, but as a generalisation, there is no comparison.
KSE are a good band, Machinehead are a great band and Iron Maiden are a huge "FARKING EMPIRE!"
The only positives I hear for KSE are Howards vocals and the guitar tones.
Im not here to bag them out, as they have done well for themselves and have a good following, but one odd record with a couple of hits, vs 15 odd great records with 100s of memorable hits, including BRAVE NEW WORLD, makes MAIDEN and countless other great bands (MACHINEHEAD as well) 1000 times more influencial than KSE.
Im having a guess here, but if you polled all the metal community in the world about being influencial in the past decade (that includes ages 12 -92) Maidens BNW would murder KSE.
Maybe here at this forum not likely, as many people love the KSE style here, but as a generalisation, there is no comparison.
KSE are a good band, Machinehead are a great band and Iron Maiden are a huge "FARKING EMPIRE!"
Well I would say that Maiden's 'Iron Maiden', 'Number Of The Beast', 'Powerslave' or 'Seventh Son...' are definitely more influential than KSE, and some of the most inportant records in metal history. But Brave New World wasn't exactly anything fresh or new.
I doubt many people heard that album and though "wow, I'm gonna start a band like Maiden now", or "Man I'm gonna totally change my band's musical direction".
If Brave New World WAS as influential as you say, then the next 5 to ten years after would have been DOMINATED by Maiden/BNW rip off bands. But it wasn't at all. In fact, the period from 1998 - 2003 was nu-metal at it's peak, and completely devoid of any maiden-esque metal-ness (with the exception of Papa Roach ripping off "Infinite Dreams" in "Last Resort").
However, if you look at the state of popular metal today, it is hugely derived from AOJB. I'm sure BNW still sold more records than KSE have ever done, but Maiden are the one of the biggest bands of all time, and were just releasing an album with their classic singer back in the band - so I don't think sales alone accurately reflects influence or importance.
I mean, St Anger still sold millions of albums - and so did the fucking backstreet boys!
I doubt many people heard that album and though "wow, I'm gonna start a band like Maiden now", or "Man I'm gonna totally change my band's musical direction".
If Brave New World WAS as influential as you say, then the next 5 to ten years after would have been DOMINATED by Maiden/BNW rip off bands. But it wasn't at all. In fact, the period from 1998 - 2003 was nu-metal at it's peak, and completely devoid of any maiden-esque metal-ness (with the exception of Papa Roach ripping off "Infinite Dreams" in "Last Resort").
However, if you look at the state of popular metal today, it is hugely derived from AOJB. I'm sure BNW still sold more records than KSE have ever done, but Maiden are the one of the biggest bands of all time, and were just releasing an album with their classic singer back in the band - so I don't think sales alone accurately reflects influence or importance.
I mean, St Anger still sold millions of albums - and so did the fucking backstreet boys!
cobhc
Amiga Enthusiast
slayercannibalsuffohead
Get a dog up ya!
For me, BNW was fresh. Maybe not new, (KSE was not new either), but to be influencial, you dont have to be a clone of another band and rip them off and you certainly dont have to TOTALLY CHANGE your bands musical direction to be influenced either. You hear the style, you fall in love with it and add a piece here and there, or in the extreme cases, give up your own band and join a cover band.
The last 10 years havent been dominated by KSE clones. There is 10 times more brutalness on cd out there, than there is of the KSE style. You say that nu metal peaked for around 5 years, not long enough to be influencial, and still didnt dominate metal as a whole.
Maiden-esque bands have been around for years and not completely devoid in the last 10. Even though I dont like them, DRAGONFORCE are probably the biggest band to come from the Maiden-esque style. As I said, you dont have to rip off another band to be influenced.
We have children here that ask for BNW to be played at home and friends houses, while they try and copy their favourite guitar part or their drum patterns or bass lines etc........ no KSE, even though they have heard it. That to me is influencial, not record sales alone ( I never said that ) or POPULAR metal ( which is????? ). We are talking metal as a whole here, not boring metal, or thingy metal or whatever metal, metal as a whole.
Bruce coming back raised sales? Maybe, but god damn it was a great album, even though the kids who bought the album, when asked, "Did you know Bruce left Maiden years ago" didnt even know! But they know who Bruce, Dave, Steve, Nicko, Adrian and Janick are now.
Let it burn...
Orgasm Donor
xconnyx
www.iheartsound.com
the clown is the guy who produced the record and actually played drums on aojb. hes a great musician and a good entertainer even if this depends on personal taste but he does a good job.
so my turn: aojb
but maybe i'm the only one, but i totally dig the miasma (tbdm) sound. one of my favourites.
so my turn: aojb
but maybe i'm the only one, but i totally dig the miasma (tbdm) sound. one of my favourites.
I see your Dragonforce and raise you:
Hatebreed
God Forbid
Lamb Of God
Unearth
As I Lay Dying
Chimaira
All That Remains
Atreyu
Bullet For My Valentine
Trivium
Darkest Hour
Poison The Well
Still Remains
Shadows Fall
Avenged Sevenfold
Bleeding Through
Parkway Drive
A lot of these are magazine-front-cover bands! They were also just off the top of my head, and are only some of the more 'popular' bands that flourished after AOJB came out. Every year at download/taste of chaos/Ozzfest/whatever-popular-tour, it's full of metalcore bands -
I've toured up and down the UK numerous times over the last 3 or 4 years and every town/city has the same identical shitty local metalcore support bands.
100% in agreement with Dan - for the record, I can't stand metalcore, but it's very easy to tell that the influence it's had has been monumental; and also for the record, I love "Brave New World," but fuck if the percentage of big bands that are IDENTIFIABLY influenced by it isn't pitifully small compared to those who were influenced by Killswitch
egan.
daylightdies.com
Um...half of those bands were signed with records out before killswitch and didn't change dramatically after AoJB. I understand your point about the record but I think you are overstating things a bit. To me the influence from this record is the appearance of pop choruses-- other than that the style had existed for a decade.
EDIT: I certainly agree about the local openers.....metalcore and bad BM here in the states.
I am very aware of that, but my point was that AoJB opened A LOT of doors for all the bands on that list. Were any of them "big" before KSE made it... not really. Did any of them get regular rotation on MTV before 'My Last Serenade' did? Not as far as I can remember.
The amount of kids that got into Killswitch and through them got into Unearth/All that Remains etc is undeniable.
I was very specific with my wording so that it didn't sound like I was saying; "KSE invented metalcore and therefore every other metalcore band copied them or were influenced by them".
It's like Metallica with thrash. They weren't the only band doing it back then. Exodus, Slayer etc were all starting up, but Metallica made it big first and set the standard for everyone else to follow, which also allowed a lot of the other thrash bands to flourish in their wake.
KSE are to metalcore what Metallica are to thrash.
Maybe the pop choruses were the only new thing that KSE did. That case could be well argued, but it doesn't matter, because that was one of in not THE biggest attributes to their sound. And those melodic choruses allowed kids who perhaps weren't previously into death/extreme/hardcore metal to get into or discover heavier stuff.
egan.
daylightdies.com
I gotcha, but my point is that hatebreed had already jumped from victory to universal at that point and killswitch has never dominated metalcore sales the way metallica dominated thrash. My point is not that you are wrong or that the record wasn't important but that you are overstating the facts.
Mat Laperle
RedDuskStudio
Well, Poison the well was doing the formula before AOJB, the opposite of december came out in 1999... I think that specific album was way more influencial to the metalcore genre than AOJB was, IMO hehe.
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