Amazing Guitarists.... Vai

[YaYo]

Just recently started listening to Vai again. My god, that guy is so talented i cant even describe it.... Passion & Warfare is such a mind blowing album, ive got the tab book for it and the subtleties he's doing are amazing, the changing guitar sounds, the effects, the little whammy/wah uses... i just shit my pants when i think how skilled this guy is. Ive been writing a song recently and ive just given up, it feels useless to play music with my poor skills when compared to guys like him (its only a temporary feeling).

Can anyone begin to understand this???

He is quite simply the most amazing musician i have ever seen, i just cant put it into words.

The songs he writes wont please most people, especially those that dont have much guitar knowledge, but he is a genious imo. His singing sucks though (which thankfully he doesnt do on his earlier albums).

Anyone else know anyone who's a better guitarist?
Satriani is amazing too, but not as amazing (actually from what ive seen i wouldnt even say he was close to Vai).... and theres some good metal guitarists out there but nothing even 1/100th as good as Vai.
Yngwie is quick, and uses some interesting scales and stuff, but his solos seem to be just "look how fast i can play"... and his songs are no more advanced than any other 80s metal ive heard.

Vai is god. Never seen anyone close to this skill level.

 

[MetalManCPA]

Not a guitar player here, but:

Steve Vai - amazing when his guitar talks
Joe Satriani

I always thought Eddie Van Halen did some pretty amazing stuff

In the "older" days, Jimmy Page & Eric Clapton were considered guitar elitists

Other than that, there's plenty of talent out there. Lot's of great guitar work - chord structure, mood changes, but none totally stand out in my mind

 

[RETIREDTrapped]

Jeff Loomis from nevermore... Forget their newer albums like DHIADW... Go and get politics of ecstasy..

Listen to '42147', 'seven tongues of god'... There is some awesome guitarwork and solos... He is truly amazing.

Like i have said MANY times before, check out Martyr... now THEM is some awesome guitarists...

What about marty friedman?? Talented as Fuck...!!

 

[YaYo]

marty friedman

Talented: yes.
1/20th as good as Vai: maybe.

He is pretty fast, and writes awesome solos. But there isnt the subtleties. If you study what Friedman and study most other metal guitarists do, and then study Vai... well Vai is so far above them its not funny. Its an opinion obviously but im interested if anyone disagrees.

I will check out Jeff Loomis right now, but i seriously doubt he will be even close to as good as Vai. I may be suprised though!!



and yeh Van Halen, Page, Clapton, Hendrix, etc..... all innovators, and great for their time... but not gods in todays terms.

 

[Prophetix]

Im quite a good guitar player. I didnt say I reached the likes of Vai or anything but definately reached Akerfeldt at least ..
I personally care about the musics complexity more than the technical complexity of the guitarwork.
Yngwie Malmsteen is real good. But more guitar masturbation than actual music.
Marty Friedman is real damn good. But he plays new-age music. I dont mind but i prefer metal.

now JASON BECKER. He's a mix of guitar and musical talent like no other guitarist on the PLANET! I suggest you get his album 'Perpetual Burn' today! You'll forget a Steve Vai existed!

 

[bleed for me]

Originally posted by metalmancpa
Not a guitar player here, but:

Steve Vai - amazing when his guitar talks
Joe Satriani

I always thought Eddie Van Halen did some pretty amazing stuff

In the "older" days, Jimmy Page & Eric Clapton were considered guitar elitists

Other than that, there's plenty of talent out there. Lot's of great guitar work - chord structure, mood changes, but none totally stand out in my mind

you know quite alot for a non-guitarist

my fav. guitarist are dimebag from pantera, he has a very unique sound and style...uses the whammy pedal really well, prolly the best sounding pinch harmonics i've heard

mikael is really talented but in a different way...he doesn't do crazy solos but his strength lies in writing...writes some really great chord progressions and riffs for both acoustic and distorted guitar

jesper and bjorn from in flames are good, it's obvious that these guys have talent and they write some really catchy lead riffs, they work will as a duo


it's hard to tell whether a guitarist is good unless he's a soloist because guitarists in bands tend to hold back...hell, the guys in slipknot might be able to play some crazy lead stuff even though all they play for slipknot is powerchords in dropped d tuning

 

[KIRILL]

Yeah Steve Vai is amazing but i prefer Jason Becker and Al DiMeola before him but it´s really a matter of personal taste....
Damn everyone who plays guitar has to hear the song Air by Jason Becker it´s just so amazing...i think his work in Cacophony with Marty Friedman are really groundbreaking to and show how interesting guitar masturbation can be....

 

[Statues_Turned_Dust]

Cacophony are great Concerto and Speed Metal Symphony are definitely worth checking out,good luck playing them though

 

[Sadistik]

Actually, Yayo, Satriani was Vai's teacher, as well as Alex Skolnick's and Kirk Hammet's.

I'd say:Vai, Vinnie Moore (Check Him OUt!), Barrett Tagliarino, Marcel Coenan, Buckethead, Skolnick are my fave shredders, though I never thought that Vai could write good songs. P&W was definitely his best songwriting.

 

[veil the sky]

Yeh I was just listening to Sex and Religion today right about the same time you started this thread. Cool.

Vai is a bit of an excpetion to the rules, he's a technically near perfect player. I don't know if that makes you necessarily a great musician. Vai is, don't misunderstand, but other guitarists like STEVIE RAY VAUGHAN can play slightly ruffer, but still make music that is better. Great as Vai is, I think there are guitarists out there with better musical knowledge if not better technique.

AL DIMEOLA is a great player, but so is BB KING. He plays about five notes per song, but I could study a lifetime and not play such incredible music as he does. It's in the soul baby

I take some influence from YNGWIE MALMSTEEN, but I went to a guitar masterclass with him and to be honest, he's so far up his own ass that I lost a lot of respect for him. Every solo I hear of his I think, 'Yeh I know you can do that Yngwie, I've hear you do it on about six albums before!'

A guy who taught me is, I genuinely think, better than Yngwie, he's called Guthrie Govan (guitarist of the year 1994 or thereabouts) and his playing is even more frightening and more intelligent.

EDDIE VAN HALEN, I think his soloing is (slightly) over-rated, but his rhythm playing is extraordinary. He is, IMHO, the most influential guitarist in rock music.

Other faves: NUNO BETTENCOURT (yes yes I know) PAUL GILBERT, AUGUST, ERIC CLAPTON, ERIC JOHNSON, PAT METHENEY, RICHIE BLACKMORE, ANYONE WHO EVER PLAYED FOR STEELY DAN!!!!!

 

[Hellrazer]

how about Todd Duane or Jason Becker? Jason Becker wrote his album when he was 18.

 

[YourFuneral]

Originally posted by Hellrazer
how about Todd Duane or Jason Becker? Jason Becker wrote his album when he was 18.

He wrote his first SOLO album at 18... Him and Marty wrote the first Cacophony album when he was 16 or 17... (I think 16, could be wrong...) Jason Becker is (was? *snif*) awesome! Definately one of my biggest influences, but then again, so is Vai... I think you would dig him Yayo (if you haven't already...)

You should also check out Steve Morse (didn't see anybody mention him)... He (IMO) is GOD! His stuff is just mind-bogglingly amazing... Not the fastest guitarist and probably not the most technical, but I have NEVER heard a guitarist with such amazing picking ability... Matter a fact, you have to STRAIN to hear him pick at all, but he does! (The closest I can think of is Eric Johnson but that's a stretch... (Morse taught Johnson, btw))

Vinnie Moore is pretty awesome too...

 

[Manbient]

Originally posted by Sadistik
Actually, Yayo, Satriani was Vai's teacher, as well as Alex Skolnick's and Kirk Hammet's.

Actually Vai taught Satch i think... could be wrong, i don't think it really matters.

Well ACTUALLY i think Jason Becker was a genius as well as WAY beyond almost anyone technically... i mean shit watch his atlanta clinic and TELL ME anyone could play those arps like that? Nope, i don't think anyone can, even rusty cooley or George Bellas. Also listen to his song "The End of The Beginning" he didn't play on it because of ALS, but he composed it... it is one of the most beautiful and uplifting songs i've heard! Michael Lee Firkins does an AMAZING job on it too... he is one talented guitarist. But Vai does have something special. I don't particularly like most of his songs but he does make his guitar talk... it is very cool. Also John Petrucci is pretty damn unique... he writes some of the coolest guitar parts i've ever heard! Acntually yea! They ARE the coolest guitar parts i've ever heard! Vai may have more skill and can find those inbetween notes, but i think petrucci is a MUCH better songwriter.

 

[Sadistik]

Actually Vai taught Satch i think

No, I'm certain it was Satch teaching Vai. What happened was Vai actually got signed first, and in an interview, when asked who some other killer guitarists were, he mentioned Satch. Some label guy read that and asked for a Satch demo, and he got signed. As my old guitar teacher used to say, Satch should go to Vais house every year and give him a thanl you blow job.

 

[Useful Idiot]

Originally posted by Prophetix

now JASON BECKER. He's a mix of guitar and musical talent like no other guitarist on the PLANET! I suggest you get his album 'Perpetual Burn' today! You'll forget a Steve Vai existed!

I've heard some stuff on Perpetual Burn...pretty amazing stuff. I suggest everyone check it out.

 

[D Mullholand]

Okay, I've listened to ALL albums of Vai, and I have to say that it's NOT MUSIC. I mean, the guy is a gymnast, not a musician, there's no musical feeling in his guiturbations. Sure, you can appreciate him as a guitar-trickster, you can learn technique from him, but he clearly doesn't hear music. His albums are some of the most shallow, ugly, tasteless and just plain disgusting moosik that I have heard in the last couple of years.

I would gladly prefer the 3 songs by YaYoGakk to 3 discographies of Vai, any day.

John McLaughlin, there's a real guitarist, who most importantly, is a Musician.

D Mullholand

 

[Manbient]

Originally posted by D Mullholand
Okay, I've listened to ALL albums of Vai, and I have to say that it's NOT MUSIC. I mean, the guy is a gymnast, not a musician, there's no musical feeling in his guiturbations. Sure, you can appreciate him as a guitar-trickster, you can learn technique from him, but he clearly doesn't hear music. His albums are some of the most shallow, ugly, tasteless and just plain disgusting moosik that I have heard in the last couple of years.

I would gladly prefer the 3 songs by YaYoGakk to 3 discographies of Vai, any day.

D Mullholand

OUCH man are you SURE you wanna say that?

 

[Sadistik]

I kinda agree. I only find P&W as worthy of repeated listens for the MUSIC and not the technique.

 

[YaYo]

No, I'm certain it was Satch teaching Vai.

Yep, Satch taught Vai.... but i think people take that a bit too full on, im guessing he just taught him a few things here and there.. it doesnt mean satriani is better.

And heck Hammet learnt from the same guy and apparently only learnt the pentatonic scale, so i wouldnt think much credit could go to Satriani.



Ok i am checking out Jason Becker tonight, sounds like ill be impressed!! Seems like someone with just as good technical skills, but better uh 'music' skills.

Vai is a bit of an excpetion to the rules, he's a technically near perfect player. I don't know if that makes you necessarily a great musician.

Okay, I've listened to ALL albums of Vai, and I have to say that it's NOT MUSIC. I mean, the guy is a gymnast, not a musician, there's no musical feeling in his guiturbations. Sure, you can appreciate him as a guitar-trickster, you can learn technique from him, but he clearly doesn't hear music. His albums are some of the most shallow, ugly, tasteless and just plain disgusting moosik that I have heard in the last couple of years.

P&W is the only album worth listening to, i listened to the 4 albums after that today and only found 2 songs that interested me ("Fire Garden Suite" and "The Crying Machine")... and thats in my current 'Vai is a god' mood so it says a lot. Theres still some great technical playing, but not as great, not as inspired, not as well constructed, none of the subtleties. etc. etc.

Most of his song writing sucks. Most of his riff writing sucks.
But his solo work are the entire song, thats where the concentration should be completely.. and in that area he is very emotional, it is music... but not everyone will hear it. (its another case of "if you dont like it then you cant judge it!" hehe).

So yeh in a way i agree, most of my praise comes from the 'technicalities' side of things. Whereas emotion and stuff is the most important thing in music for me, but i CAN see a lot of emotion in his soloing on P&W so i do have a little different opinion.

And yeh, Vai is an inspiration to me in a number of ways... techniques and guitar sounds and stuff like that. Not an inspiration in song or riff writing ways.

 

[Analog_Kid]

Ahh crap! How the hell could I pass this thread up?!? I've tried all day to restrain myself from posting to this one but...

I had four primary guitar influences in the 80's when I started playing: Satriani, Vai, Hedges, and Stevie Ray. I started taking guitar seriously back then because of two things, seeing Vai in Crossroads and later seeing the "Satch Boogie" video on Headbanger's Ball the night it debuted. Both those things just blew me away. Especially when I saw the Satriani video, I was like "Van Halen who???". Yeah, it had that much of a effect on me. The impressions left by SRV and, obviously, Michael Hedges would come later on in my life.

As the years have passed I've taken on a very different perspective on Vai and Satriani just due to my experience both with the instrument and in the music biz. Here's my take on both of them: Satch is a tremendously expresive player and is a master at writing very excessible guitar music. Unfortunately, he's pigeonholed himself in that niche. Then again, his formula works and that's why he makes the big bucks. He's at a point now where he can do whatever he wants because money isn't quite as big a consideration for him as it might have been in the 80's. More power to him!

Vai, as far as technical profficiency and astounding accuracy, is second in my book only to John McLaughlin,(whom I consider to be the best guitarist alive today). Unfortunatley, he's always tried to emulate Frank Zappa in the majority of his compositions and not really done so with much success. My favorite Vai work is when he just lets loose and plays his ass off, which I wish he would do more of rather than try to fit 127-and-a-half guitar tracks into 128 channels. 'Alien Love Secrets' and Public Image Ltd's 'Compact Disc' are my favorites of all the work he's ever recorded. Live, however, he's the greatest show on Earth. Hellacious stage presence.

Of all the guys on Shrapnell Records that have been mentioned so far, I've always considered Friedman and Becker to be kind of low on the totem poll. My favorite Shrapnell atrists were always MacAlpine and Greg Howe. Greg was the most original and interesting musician Mike Varney ever signed to the label. His self-titled debut is amazing,(Sheehan on bass and Atma Anur on drums. Atma just tore it up on that album!).

I've also always just had to drop my jaw to the floor in awe over everything Jeff Beck has ever done. Wish I had his tone and knack for standard tremollo bar work. I could go on all day but I need sleep before heading off to yet another session. Later.