An unusual question

[TyrantOfFlames]

I recently decided i want to write a concept album. Quite an undertaking, i know, but everyone loves a challenge. I am stuck, though, on how to start. I have all kinds of ideas, but I dont want to write the music first, then have the lyrics not go very well, lacking that connection in which the music enhances the idea of the words. I also dont want to write the lyrics first, because I might limit myself to the music writing by doing so.

So which should I write first? Any suggestions? Thanx guys (and girls as the case may be)

 

[yourdeadgroom]

Gee, you don't ask for much, do you! (don't want to write music or words first??..)
Well, start by writing down the overview of the story/concept, then break it down into parts- each part becomes a song. Make the parts detailed, so you know what happens, where things go, and how they lead on to the next song (also who's perspective they are from- are you describing an event, is someone thinking something etc..). If you happen to come up with some phrases that would be good for lyrics, keep a note of them. Next, go through your story, and draw a graphic representation of your musical ideas (y'know a straight horizontal line that rises for a loud part, falls for soft, you can use anything, solong as it means something to you). Think about what parts of the concept would be best suited be fast, aggressive stuff, what would be better slow/midpaced/whatever. Then move onto the music and lyrics from there, and keep to your original schemes (unless you come up with something really cool). If you have people in the story that come in alot, maybe write a riff to represent them, and use it in more than one song, just to tie it together (but change it a bit each time).

Hope that's slightly helpful

 

[MetalManCPA]

This is an answer from someone who has never written music : only play keyboards and listen, but here's my opinion------

To craft a well designed album, I think it starts with a vision. It's doesn't start with a specific sound, or a specific set of lyrics, but more of a general message.

First - what "message" are you passing on to the listener. How do you want the listener to feel once the listening experience is over - angry? happy? sad?.

Then - your musical intuition will enable you to envision a sound for that mood. Take these from your own listening experience - certain "styles" make you feel a certain way. You could use a roller-coaster technique, a build-up or let-down style, or be steady throughout. Speed, volume envokes feelings - use these styles to enlighten thge listener.

The lyrics are tough - people could read the lyrics and lable you a satanist, etc. I have no pearls of wisdom on lyrics, but if they come from the heart, they will sound true (at least that's what I believe)

Oh well, I tried anyways.

 

[TyrantOfFlames]

Wow, thanks guys. That really helps alot. I suppose I was looking at it the wrong way...I really like the guideline idea, it makes you sound as if you have written one yourself, (have you?). I'll let you know when it is done (a year maybe? heh). Thanks again.

 

[Morningrise]

It comes as obvious to make the music interact with the lyrics, so yes it is a good idea to write the lyrics first. Like yourdeadgroom said write out a representation of the music, and base how your write the music on the certain emotional level of the music. If soloing becomes needed, go ahead and put it in. Make the music have the listener picture the scene, the music to me is what conveys the emotion, and setting of a concept album, whereas the lyrics tell the story. So even when the person isn't reading the lyrics they can tell partly what is happening within this story of yours. Atmosphere of course works great for developing this mood and setting. I know you wanted to create a Sci-Fi concept, this would be hard to develope with metal Metal music, but try to create the best atmosphere out of what you can.
This is all kind of obvious, just putting my two cents in.

 

[D Mullholand]

Interesting question indeed. I have written one concept album already (only lyrics so far - the music I'm working on now is too different from the mood of these lyrics).

I must say first of all - forget structure, common sense and extensive planning when you write. Try to work with images instead. Suppose you have this powerful image in your head - it may not necessarily be visual or a picture per se, more like an associative perception of some place, event, person or process or whatever you like. Add a really effective title to set a tone for the album. At this point you'll probably already have at least a vague feeling where the path will lead you. You may also take more than one "establishing" image for contrast, but not too much : the local sets and scenes you can make as detailed as you wish, but the main vision must be cohesive and effective. Remember, this is poetry and music.

It's good to know at least the ending before you begin - or you can let the story surprise you, or you can even make it absurd, if that's your intention. The details will be filled in as you write more songs. Let secondary characters appear at your command, let the story flow, but try not to set it into rigid boundaries. Good songs make emotional impact on the listener because he can partly relate to them, so if a song is from one character's POV, make its message subjective, let reality be filtered through this character's perception.

It's not necessary to tell all the story in the lyrics - leave something for the music to tell, let the music be not just a soundtrack to the poems, but complement the story as much as the texts. Insert some themes and leitmotifs at unexpected places to give the listener something to think about, if the story needs it. When writing music, try to add special symmetry to the key moments, and you can make the most intense parts disjointed and incoherent to increase the effect. Think not in heavy-riff/slow-riff/solo/interlude sequences, but in theme development and variations. Invent or choose some sounds (guitar, keyboard, vocal, whatever) to make it sonically cohesive. Decide whether you want individual songs to tell the story, or a different structure like for example Camel "The Snow Goose" - an excellent example of a concept album.

But try to always reread the parts you already wrote, to keep sight of the "big picture".

Hmmm... sorry if this was too long or disjointed, it's 1 AM here

Good luck with writing !


D Mullholand, a dead composer
---------------------------------------
NP: The Doors - Waiting for the Sun

 

[TyrantOfFlames]

Thanks for the tips, D Mullholand, though you didn't really answer the question. I still think I will make a layout/overview, though. I like my ideas to be organized, and I find that if i write either the lyrics in whole or the music in whole first, whichever I write second suffers in quality. I really liked writing both kinda mixed, though. I'll definitely be printing out this thread.

 

[yourdeadgroom]

Originally posted by TyrantOfFlames
...I really like the guideline idea, it makes you sound as if you have written one yourself, (have you?). I'll let you know when it is done (a year maybe? heh). Thanks again.

Haven't written one myself as such, but it's a technique I used in school, when I had to write stuff for music class- I used to do some epic stuff (once started on doing a guitar concerto, I've got it all planned out (using lines and squiggles), and some of the main parts written, just never got to finish it). When we wrote stuff to poetry, the teachers made us draw out our ideas first, we had to get that part signed off before writing any music. It's really helpful when you're 'composing' something, as opposed to just throwing ideas around and magically coming up with a song

Good luck!

 

[warsofwinter]

Originally posted by yourdeadgroom
Gee, you don't ask for much, do you! (don't want to write music or words first??..)
Well, start by writing down the overview of the story/concept, then break it down into parts- each part becomes a song. Make the parts detailed, so you know what happens, where things go, and how they lead on to the next song (also who's perspective they are from- are you describing an event, is someone thinking something etc..). If you happen to come up with some phrases that would be good for lyrics, keep a note of them. Next, go through your story, and draw a graphic representation of your musical ideas (y'know a straight horizontal line that rises for a loud part, falls for soft, you can use anything, solong as it means something to you). Think about what parts of the concept would be best suited be fast, aggressive stuff, what would be better slow/midpaced/whatever. Then move onto the music and lyrics from there, and keep to your original schemes (unless you come up with something really cool). If you have people in the story that come in alot, maybe write a riff to represent them, and use it in more than one song, just to tie it together (but change it a bit each time).

Hope that's slightly helpful

Fuck stop giving me ideas ,,,,,now I want to be able to write again ( I've been in a hole for writing for a month now , not a riff came out of me )

 

[yourdeadgroom]

Originally posted by warsofwinter



Fuck stop giving me ideas ,,,,,now I want to be able to write again ( I've been in a hole for writing for a month now , not a riff came out of me )

Hey, watch who you're calling Fuck, fuck!

I have a fix for writers block, but it's expensive- buy a new guitar. That always seems to help, it's actually amazing, playing a foreign axe just opens up new avenues

Or, do what I do when writing a riff: turn off the lights, get naked (wait, just kidding......)(maybe....), set your recorder going (that's recorder as in tape-recorder, not one of those annoying musical instruments), turn off your brain, and just let your fingers go. Forget all the music theory, scales etc.. and just play what comes out. Then listen back to the tape and figure out whatever sounds cool. (this is good in theory, however I have the problem of likeing everything I do in a session, so I end up writing a 10 minute ultra-progessive song, instead of just one riff )

 

[RETIREDTrapped]

Buying a new guitar hey? You wouldn't want to get writers block too often!!