Andy and friends, help me get my sound back...

[blackcom]

You guyes are my last hope...

A few months ago, I got the guitar sound of my life, absolutely loved it.
My chain was: Ibanez Universe, Marshall JMP-1, Marshall Valvstate120/120, Marshall JCM Lead 4x12 (left bottom element), SM57, API, RME AD.

I used the dials and mic positioning I allways do...

Now a little later, I'm about to record some new stuff, however, I can't get my rig to sound the same anymore even with the same settings....it's like something is fundamentaly different... !!

My buddy has the exact same equipment as myself, and I've checked my guitar, rack, mics, cables, new tubes, new string...just about everyting...i've been trying every single dialing combination in the universe for several hours everyday for about two weeks now and getting very frustrated and exhousted by now..

Perhaps any of you guyes could hear what is wrong/different by having a listen...anyone with more trained ears then myself...

http://home.online.no/~mstra/guitars/oldsound.mp3
(I -really- want this sound back...)

http://home.online.no/~mstra/guitars/newsound.mp3
(Yikes, what happened..., it's just so "weak" now...?)

 

[SickBoy]

Now a little later, I'm about to record some new stuff, however, I can't get my rig to sound the same anymore even with the same settings....it's like something is fundamentaly different... !!

My buddy has the exact same equipment as myself, and I've checked my guitar, rack, mics, cables, new tubes, new string...just about everyting...i've been trying every single dialing combination in the universe for several hours everyday for about two weeks now and getting very frustrated and exhousted by now..

And what about the mic placement? It could be a source of your troubles...
It's placement (the distance and the angle to the speaker) makes a world of difference and only 1cm would alter your sound!
If you're seeking a brighter sound, as a rule of a thumb you should point your mic's capsule towards speaker center and the closer the mic, more bottom end. You should always consider angling your mic at some 30 degrees from the axis, it gives very pleasing results (at least for me).

 

[blackcom]

And what about the mic placement? It could be a source of your troubles...
It's placement (the distance and the angle to the speaker) makes a world of difference and only 1cm would alter your sound!
If you're seeking a brighter sound, as a rule of a thumb you should point your mic's capsule towards speaker center and the closer the mic, more bottom end. You should always consider angling your mic at some 30 degrees from the axis, it gives very pleasing results (at least for me).

I've marked my cabinett for where to place my mic, so it's not the mic placement...I allways use that spot...

 

[DIOBOLIC5150]

I've marked my cabinett for where to place my mic, so it's not the mic placement...I allways use that spot...

It's either MIC placement or a different amp setting. Does it sound the same out of the amp as it did before? Because it should be fairly obvious that is sounds different even before you mic it, which would easily narrow it down to a simple knob setting. I think it sounds like a combination of both eq and mic placement. It sounds off axis to me. Good luck. Cool riff.

 

[blackcom]

It's either MIC placement or a different amp setting. Does it sound the same out of the amp as it did before? Because it should be fairly obvious that is sounds different even before you mic it, which would easily narrow it down to a simple knob setting. I think it sounds like a combination of both eq and mic placement. It sounds off axis to me. Good luck. Cool riff.

Nope....seems not to be a mic placement...besides, I allways use an angle of zero..

However, how about temprature and humitidy?
The old sound was recorded during a very hot summer.....it's not exactly summer outside my door anymore...

 

[Impy]

You say you alwaye use that spot, how about distance then? Are you sure that it's the same distance? But it also sounds like there's somthing else that differs, it's a totally different frequency spectrum

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

I've been doing a lot of physics reading lately and I keep coming across Occam's Razor. If it's a totally different sound you're getting than there is probably something that you did last time that you are forgetting this time. Are you SURE those are the same settings and equipment as last time?

 

[blackcom]

Yep, I'm shure....57 at marked spot on-axis as close as possible...However...
the old take sounds a littel more extreme then what the three tone controls on the JMP-1 are able to do alone...

Could there be any phase-canselation of some sort? It has a slightly boxy-botton to it I think...

 

[DIOBOLIC5150]

Yep, I'm shure....57 at marked spot on-axis as close as possible...However...
the old take sounds a littel more extreme then what the three tone controls on the JMP-1 are able to do alone...

Could there be any phase-canselation of some sort? It has a slightly boxy-botton to it I think...

I don't even think you're using the same equipment or any of the old settings. I think it's going to be impossible to help you with this!

 

[2dark]

well, what I could here on the my speakers (I'm not quite sure if can call this speakers) it sounds like an issue that I have right now. Old tubes.
Even the tube in the JMP-1 (and I truly love that preamp) gets age effects after a while. So you might bring that one in and have it checked.
Also a reason for the different sound might be the strings you use. Are they also exactly the same?
Your old sound sounds more open and crispy. The 'new sound' is kind of muddy.
That's why I guess it's the tube and/or the strings.

 

[Andy Sneap]

How have you marked the cab???? My guess would be the actual cone, but it's impossible to say.

 

[blackcom]

Diabolic, it's exactly the same gear..that's why i'm freakin out...

I've marked the cab by drawing a rectangle with a white colored pencil where to place the mic... What do you mean by the "actual cone"?

I'm starting to think maybe my cab got 'old' or something..
The same cabinett and gear/rack was used for Susperia's latest CD Unlimited...but we used a Neumann TLM103 -> Summit Preamp...not 57 -> API..
(I don't play in Susperia, but i'm in another band with the drummer and bassplayer...)

If anyone got that album, maybe you could check if you think that "sounds more like" my old or new sound even if it's a different recording chain.
(I've allready made up my mind...but i'm still instrested in what others may "hear").

We used the same mic-spot/element/angle/distance, though...I engineered it myself...

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

ok...did you forget to replace the battery on your active pickups? had that happen once, wasted two hours of my life figuring that out

 

[blackcom]

Ok...this is what i've come down to:
After hours and hours I've decided to borrow another cab from a friend, a JCM2000..

Now i'm able to get an edgy tight sound again...it doesen't sound like my 'old' JCM800 but it's kind of in the same vein and does sound more right and natural then what my JCM800 does today. I've re-wired and re-soldered my JCM800...improved a littel bit...but not enough....I just think perhaps my JCM800 is getting old and loosing it's edge somehow....

Anyone else experiencing that....cabs canging sound over the years?
I think that's the case this time...

 

[egan.]

Anyone else experiencing that....cabs canging sound over the years?
I think that's the case this time...

Sure, speakers wear out just like everything else.

 

[kaomao]

Did you think about the room where you're playing in??? are you playing in the same room as the old sample, I don't know if it can change a lot your sound, but different rooms different sounds.

Maurizio

 

[2dark]

Anyone else experiencing that....cabs canging sound over the years?
I think that's the case this time...

Yes they do. I had to replace all of them and faders in my old soundcraft console. Sounds much better now.
My JCM 2550 needs that treatment too. Besides getting new tubes.
But my bank account doesn't allow it.

 

[Andy Sneap]

told you, bet its one cone that has gone!!! Effecting the impedence of the cab. I've seen it happen a few times, it really changes the phase of the other speakers. Test each one (just play through one at a time, you may just have one dead one)

 

[2dark]

oups ....

cabs = capacitors
or
cabs = cabinet

??

 

[blackcom]

Listening with new ears, made me realize I haven't solved the problem after all (argh X 10.000).

The Marshall JCM2000 cab i'm borrowing sounds boring. Horrible crisp and less puch. Perhaps it's not the cone after all??

So...
Anyone with a Marshall JMP-1 here?

I've had a Marshall JMP-1 for years now. It's allways been dead silent,
but leately it's been starting to make this "hum" sound when I switch it on...it's not loud, but it's there.

So when I can't get that tight, crispy sound I used to get anymore
perhaps my JMP-1 need service?

Can any of you guyes hear this "hum" sound when turning it on, any of you ever had it to service?