Anyone have any general suggestions for eqing(or comressing) bass in the mix. The mix is for a thrash/death metal recording.
Thanks!
Thanks!
Any tips for EQing bass in the mix?....
- Thread starter Shredfiend
- Start date
Shredfiend said:
It depends what sound you want, how the guitars sound and how the bass sounds without any processing. And what the bass plays.
E.g. a Overkill-, a Metallica-, a Slayer-, a Death/Cynic/Atheist-, a distorted black metal-, a Type-O-Negative-, a Carcass-Bass etc. pp. sounds different.
I often use a multiband-comp if I want clear but not annoying highs/high mids.
I've found bass to be, above almost all other instruments, the one that you really have to nail when recording (when bass is prominently featured, of course). That doesn't necessarily mean printing eq and compression to tape (so to speak), but you should really attempt to get the sound right before hitting record; if you're using plugins, at least get it sounding close to how you want it first, and tweak minimally afterwards, but be in the ballpark from the start. Nine times out of ten, no amount of processing will fix a bad bass tone. Of course, it depends how important bass is to the song- if it's only there for reinforcement and not prominently featured, I guess just making it play nice with the kick and guitars is all that matters.
As far as compression goes, start with a moderate attack and slow release and go from there. It depends on the tempo and feel- long, ringing notes will benefit from a longer release time than stacatto notes. Threshold and ratio are to taste; often, heavy compression is called for, but don't lose the feel.
For eq, there's no one rule. Listen to the 200-500 Hz range, because it can get muddy at the low end, and can really fight with the guitars here. Cuts are better than boosts, which is generally true with all EQ; if you want to hear more slap, try shelving some lows before you attempt to boost the highs.
Hope that helps somewhat; I happen to be mixing a bass-heavy song right now, so I've got bass on the mind!
As far as compression goes, start with a moderate attack and slow release and go from there. It depends on the tempo and feel- long, ringing notes will benefit from a longer release time than stacatto notes. Threshold and ratio are to taste; often, heavy compression is called for, but don't lose the feel.
For eq, there's no one rule. Listen to the 200-500 Hz range, because it can get muddy at the low end, and can really fight with the guitars here. Cuts are better than boosts, which is generally true with all EQ; if you want to hear more slap, try shelving some lows before you attempt to boost the highs.
Hope that helps somewhat; I happen to be mixing a bass-heavy song right now, so I've got bass on the mind!
Genius Gone Insane
http://www.¯\(°_o)/¯.com
I've noticed from a lot of samples people have posted on this forum that the biggest difference between demo and pro-sounding stuff tends to be the bass. Definitely true with my stuff.
On my VHT I tend to boost the treble and bass but not the mids.....I don't do any mid scooping but on that amp I leave them all there.
I really want the bass on these to tracks to stand out......on our pre-production versions the Bass and Guitar were fighting for a lot of the same space in the mix. I perposely tried not to run too much low end on the guitars.
I'm think, since I don't boost my mids on the main guitar tracks I'll try to boost some of those frequencies on the bass. Hoping it will make it stand out a bit.
I really want the bass on these to tracks to stand out......on our pre-production versions the Bass and Guitar were fighting for a lot of the same space in the mix. I perposely tried not to run too much low end on the guitars.
I'm think, since I don't boost my mids on the main guitar tracks I'll try to boost some of those frequencies on the bass. Hoping it will make it stand out a bit.
Kazrog
Kazrog, Inc.
Most important things are the quality of the player and of the bass itself. The other factors can vary, but unless you have a good bassist with a good sounding bass, you're fucked!
I've found the Sans Amp Bass Driver DI to be amazing when paired with a competent bassist and a nice bass.
I've found the Sans Amp Bass Driver DI to be amazing when paired with a competent bassist and a nice bass.
Genius Gone Insane
http://www.¯\(°_o)/¯.com
Kazrog said:
Well that's a good excuse for me not getting a good bass sound yet!!!! Fuck it, I'll go MIDI bass next time to go w/ kick and toms hahaha...and I won't have to deal with any more bitter bass players who don't know what they're doing!!
egan.
daylightdies.com
unsilpauly
Member
Grave Desire
Member
One thing i've had success with is taking out a little bit of 100hz to have the kick drum come through a little better if your having problems with the bass covering it too much. Not too much though or you might lose alot of the bottom of the bass.
Razorjack
Bass Behemoth
I've just tracked bass with a band I'm working with, both the player and the basses were awesome (2 Spector 5 strings,one of which was a hollowbody fretless, and a 4 string Musicman Stingray). We took a DI and ran through the Bass players Ampeg SVT Classic head, which sounded awesome even though the input distorted on a few tracks. I have found I have no problem with the bass fighting the guitars, it just fits in the mix perfectly.
Daunt
Member
I usually record bass with DI Box and reamp it later with Bass POD and distortion pedals. I use the clean DI track for lows and distorted amp track for mids and highs. I think it's great to have the freedom to choose bass sound after the guitars are sitting nicely in the mix.
~BURNY~
Member
- Apr 20, 2005
- 5,091
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About eq I'd say:
Look at the 80-300 range (assuming you nailed the correct sound when recording). This is the most disturbing frequency range. Try to find a place for the kick's punch by soloing Bass and Kick drum together. Try to not go under -6/8db and above +6/8db. If you need to, your bass sound is probably fucked and need to be re-recorded. Use tightest Q possible when cutting and largest possible when boosting. The same rules are true for many instruments. A dual band compression is also helpful to fix the dynamic range without killing the bass harmonics.
Look at the 80-300 range (assuming you nailed the correct sound when recording). This is the most disturbing frequency range. Try to find a place for the kick's punch by soloing Bass and Kick drum together. Try to not go under -6/8db and above +6/8db. If you need to, your bass sound is probably fucked and need to be re-recorded. Use tightest Q possible when cutting and largest possible when boosting. The same rules are true for many instruments. A dual band compression is also helpful to fix the dynamic range without killing the bass harmonics.
I've spent a ton of time trying to get my low end working well and tight together, and have found a few little tricks. First, the section around 250hz kills me, so I usually take some stuff out of that area. Secondly, if I'm having a tough time blending the guitars and the bass together, I'll mult the bass and run that through Amplitube, Sansamp, Guitar Rig, or something like it, and severely cut the low end from it, trying to give it the sound of a low guitar, then mix to taste. To get the actual low end tight and together, I have two strategies that I usually work from. First is if I want the bass predominantly above the kick. I'll emphasize the kick somewhere around 60-75hz(depends on where the energy is), then hipass the bass somewhere around 250 depending on the piece), but then put a bell back in around 130 or so, and compress it till that lower section just starts to sing, or become even and more apparent and consistent. That usually gets rid of a lot of the low end flab that I've come across. Sometimes, I'll boost the hell out of the bass around 40hz, smash it with a nice compressor, then take a post compressor eq and take out some stuff around 80 or so to bring the kick back in, and add some "real" bass in around 120-150hz. Often works really well, creates a very tight, Andy Wallace-style low end. Hope this helps.
Skaldir
formerly known as Unicorn
I agree with some of you, that mostly it's about good gear.
But there's another thing that makes it so hard to fit the bass in a mix.
It's because of the resonation frequencies of the room. I think not many of us have a nearly freq-linear room in the low frequencies. It's easier to damp higher frequencies, the low ones are reflected even through big material.
So I guess that it's a main problem.
But there's another thing that makes it so hard to fit the bass in a mix.
It's because of the resonation frequencies of the room. I think not many of us have a nearly freq-linear room in the low frequencies. It's easier to damp higher frequencies, the low ones are reflected even through big material.
So I guess that it's a main problem.
