Chasing the 'perfect' mix

Ermz

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Apr 5, 2002
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Melbourne, Australia
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These are just some collected thoughts I needed to write down after a long time of thinking. It's been about a year straight that I've been mulling this over, as it relates quite specifically to my work and future. It may relate to many of you and your own aspirations, and perhaps touches on the potential future of the metal industry as well.

Back about 2 years ago I was intently chasing what I considered to be the 'perfect' metal mix. For me that was somewhere within the realm of 'Stabbing the Drama' but with more pleasing individual elements. You can think of it as trying to combine the guitars of 'EoH' with the separation/low-end balance of STD and the vocal sound of 'TWoAF'. This ultimately led me to a CD I did in mid 2009 which is likely still my 'most well-balanced' work. Not saying I succeeded in the initial goal by any stretch, but this remains the case all the same.

The thing is that, back then, my gear was very limited. I had an analogue stereo bus compressor, a mediocre converter and that was it. The rest was done in ITB land. This was also prior to Nebula really taking off with console saturation and offering us the wealth of possibilities it (and an array of other plug-ins) now do.

My thoughts back then were turned to acquiring more analogue gear. I'm actually not even sure where that became the case. I remember distinctly starting this gig over half a decade ago saying 'I don't need a multitrack interface, I will mix ITB, always, there is no need'. Somewhere along the line that changed. Maybe you naturally get to a point where you need to move... if not forward, then at least sideways or diagonally towards some ill-defined goal.

Regardless, as time wore on and I acquired more and more analogue gear and processing techniques which led to more 'analogue-sounding' mixes, I noticed a strange trend. My work wasn't getting immediately nor objectively 'better'. No, it was just getting different. It wasn't the straight, linear scale I was expecting.

During this period I was progressively getting into more and more rock productions, while also trying to get in touch with, and rekindle my inner music listener. I tried to isolate elements of records which made them memorable to me, back when I had no idea about production, and see if I could find any trends.

The more I did this, the more I noticed that the most distinctive and timeless records normally had equally distinctive audio 'blemishes' or imperfections. Certainly, the more I started to use the same gear as on many of these records, the more my own work took on an 'imperfect' character (notwithstanding that which came from my lack of experience). I started to wonder at that point though - what is the point of chasing the perfect balance in a mix? When the kick might sound better pumping all the way through the chorus, why would I want it nestled nicely between the bass, doing its job, but otherwise not being notable at all? Why do I want every element audible all at the same time, when that comes at the cost of cohesion and an overall sense of 'unity'?

What I'm arriving at, and ultimately what this boils down to for me is that.... Stabbing the Drama may well be the most well-balanced metal mix I've ever heard but.... I never listen to it for recreation. Never. Sure, the music sucks - but more than that: there is nothing exciting about ideal balancing. It does the job, and sure sounds tight on a variety of systems, but it's the things which stand out that grab a listener.

Going back and listening to my mix from 2 years ago... yeah it's damn loud, bright, and everything can be heard more or less the whole way through. On a mix 'checklist' one would think all the points were ticked off. But it doesn't 'excite' me anymore - as a listener.

The brightness is a byproduct of digital purity, and an overall lack of softening saturation. It's the product of over-using the Waves EQs, which have notoriously harsh top-end, and compressors which let a very plain transient through. The low-end clarity is a product of not using any parallel compression. No pumping, no real sustain to the drums, but they sit nicely right? That's what counts?

The point I'm rapidly arriving at is that chasing a 'perfect' mix is futile. Even if you succeed by some measurable meter, it's not going to do anything for the music if you've lost perspective on what the music actually needs. As a result I feel somewhat more disconnected from the general vibe in this place, which is ironic really, considering i started here and was chasing Sneap sounds like many back then (back when it was the AS, not JS forum!). It couldn't have backflipped any more for me, but it did.

So you never know what's around the corner for you, but if you take away anything from this, at least take away the notion that each individual project you engage as a producer or engineer demands its own personal, unique sound. Instead of worrying about whether it will take your regular array of processing, perhaps instead wonder what you can do to bring out the inherent character of each very unique project - and more-so - what you can learn by doing this. It's a much more enriching experience when you let the creative aims of the project guide you, rather than chasing some unattainable 'perfect' template in the sky.

Thanks for bearing with my rant!
 
I'm pretty sure we've spoken about this in less words some time ago but you were in a very different mindset then, the one you were writing about!
Good luck dude, I hope you're projects come out better than ever with your new attitude :)
 
Whatever you're after in audio production at the moment be sure that if you continue investing 100% in it there will be a lot of people who happen to be on the same page and think it sounds awesome and there will also be a bunch of other people who have a totally different view but will still appreciate your work because it's well-done. Don't hate your previous work because your perspective has since changed, take a break whenever you feel your head is going to explode and know that at one point or another a mix you've done is going to be 'perfect' for someone out there... if your lucky that person might even be yourself.
 
Dude, don't worry that much and make the music sound good, and don't worry what it needs to do so.
There's not such thing as a perfect mix. For me "Doomsday Machin" is like really close to perfect, Stabbing the Drama too BUT there are people out there (listeners, the most kind of people who hear you records I guess, if you dont do it for the musicians only) who HATE them. So why bother?
My tastes in mixing change constantly from project to project. Right now I love my bands mix, but who knows how it will sound when I will look back at it in a few years?
Time = change
And maybe you're searching for "different" because you can't really get noticable "better" anymore at the level you're working at.
 
I always hated STD. It may be perfect from a technical viewpoint but that doesn't make it pleasing to my ear.
So +1 @Mago
Perfection, if such thing exists, is purely subjective. As long as you do your best to serve the music, you're doing it right.
 
Been thinking a similar sort of thing, but it's hard to put in words.

All of my favourite productions have some pretty serious flaws in them. In Flames' Reroute to Remain is muddy, some of the leads are so buried you can't even hear the notes, and the snare is poking out like crazy. But if all of those aspects were fixed, I don't think it'd be as good a mix anymore.


On a sort of tangent.. I happened to listen to some pre-final mixes (like 2 or 3 mixes before the final thing, really close) of a song I did a few months ago.. and I honestly couldn't tell a noticeable difference between the pre-final and final. However, there were some really obvious things in ALL of the mixes that I completely missed when I was doing the actual mixes. The result of focusing too much on the details and not on the big picture, perhaps.

I always hated STD. It may be perfect from a technical viewpoint but that doesn't make it pleasing to my ear.
So +1 @Mago
Perfection, if such thing exists, is purely subjective. As long as you do your best to serve the music, you're doing it right.

Yeah, I never really got the excitement there either.

Maybe you naturally get to a point where you need to move... if not forward, then at least sideways or diagonally towards some ill-defined goal.

 
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I always hated STD. It may be perfect from a technical viewpoint but that doesn't make it pleasing to my ear.
So +1 @Mago
Perfection, if such thing exists, is purely subjective. As long as you do your best to serve the music, you're doing it right.

+1
 
great post

the progress of the character and the experiences one is going through, will always play the more important role in any kind of improvement.
it's IMO really only about the ear and the mindset (given there are at least some decent tools).
art or craft, so to speak......

(also just reminds me when Andy Sneap compared a mix to a "take", which IMO shows how high the percentage of art in an AE's work is or should be)
 
I think mixing is an illusion (well, spiritually speaking everything is an illusion IMHO). I`m not a professional AE, not even close, i`m actually an orchestral conductor who happens to have a metal band and likes to record his own stuff hahahaha and what i`ve discovered is that, yes, perfect mixes are "impossible", but you can create a mix that gives the illusion of being perfect.
This is very similar to the approach to compose "classical" music (academic,bla bla bla, dont mind the term) in the sense that a piece of music, or a mix in this case, can be perfect only as a reference to itself, in other words: coherent with itself.
As a composer or mixer YOU set the rules, you set the standard or reference system. In that sense the only thing that can be perfect is the way that the bass relates to the guitar or vocals to drums, etc.
To give you a parallelism in classical music. The rules,goals, Technics of a piece of music by Beethoven are not the same as the ones in the music by John adams (to name a contemporary composer)
We can apply the same for todays music genres: we dont mix pop music in the same way we mix metal.
And to push things further: Who says how metal, pop, electronic music should sound? Is there a book that says: Metal should sound like this, if you do it like this then it is perfect?. No. WE are the ones who say how it should sound simply because we are free!
And this is why everything changes. A metallica record from the 90`s sounds very different from an emmure album.
To prove this i am working on a thread that will present 20 different mixes (20second fragments) in 4 minutes. I took the idea from a mixing book and it is quite revealing because you listen how a record you think sounds great is complete rubbish against another record. BUT how is it that it sounded good in the first place? because it is coherent with itself. This is the famous principle of UNITY.
I have read a lot of Ermz`s threads (dude, you know your shit!!!!) and you pointed out that there are a lot of phases and stages in the road of developing as an AE. This is just another one. I applaud you for you determination to think about what you are doing. This means you are trying to understand and of course get better every day. This is the attitude that will make you learn until the end of your life. Of course this applies to everything, not just mixing. We are always learning, and i think it is good to keep doing it until the end of times hahahahah!

So, in the end, what i`m trying to say is: If it sounds good, it sounds good! it doesn`t matter if it is perfect.

Cheers guys!

Martin
 
Great thread!

I got to same conclusion this last couple of days, since I started mixing my upcoming album...
First, being an amateur musician and AE I can't compete with the big gurus (although I try, ahaha)!
Second, every recording is unique. You cannot (deeply) compare two records that were recorded with completely different gear and musicians. Ultimately you're just comparing the music itself, the arrangements, and how each tone fits in the whole song and mix.

So ultimately, yeah, you must serve the songs and forget about sounding louder, or more balanced than everyone else.
The mix needs to get you excited when you listen to it (especially after a few days of not listening to it). That's when you know it's good!

That being said, I still compare my mixes with albuns I really like, just for referencing.
 
Excellent post, i had also thought about this a lot.

The thing is that ears (or rather the way the brain percieves sound) are very adaptive, so even if a mix is bright/dark/balanced/imbalanced/flat/pumping/whatever you'll adjust to it in a matter of minutes or even seconds. The most important thing is that mixes should enforce the music and make it exciting. I remember reading a saying by some big shot mixer that a sound should be fresh and exciting, not good or perfect (whatever that means)

Anywho, carry on
 
Nice post, Martin!

Thanks! It is nice to give something back since i`ve learned so much from this forum!

I think a lot about this kind of stuff one thing that really helped me is just "letting go". We put so much into music/mixing that when we don`t get what we are looking for we get sooo frustrated.
I`m actually mixing my second album and i has became a real pain in the ass because i want everything to be so perfect.... i was getting veeeery frustrated and then i realized: my happiness doesn`t depend on this.
The same happened with my conducting job. I was very stressed out becouse a had a huge "gig" (actually it was massive two and a half hour ballet) becouse we conductors endure a lot of pressure. But i ended up with the same thought: this is not my happiness.

So then it came to me, like if someone was injecting the idea in my head:
"Don`t make music to be happy, BE happy and THEN play music"

Replace "mix" for "music" and just let go!

(sorry for the crappy English, i`m from argentina)

Martin
 
^ great post again, ahah! :)
Being happy and "let it go" when making music is definitely important!!
 
Completely agree there. One thing my retarded schedule of the last few months has taught me is the ability to 'let go'. I still border on obsession when attempting to fix elements of a record I don't like... but if it happens that I absolutely run out of time, and it's not going to be what I thought it would... then so be it. The next band will get the benefit of that experience and so on, and so on. Do the best you can with what you have, and that's the best that can be expected.

Now the important thing to understand is that this is not a distinction made as a cop-out, to half-ass your work... but rather to retain your personal sanity, and keep you fresh for future work, and above all allow yourself to learn.
 
I feel somewhat more disconnected from the general vibe in this place, which is ironic really, considering i started here and was chasing Sneap sounds like many back then (back when it was the AS, not JS forum!). It couldn't have backflipped any more for me, but it did.

Welcome to my world Ermz! I've learned a lot from this forum, but I've tended to feel that anything I do is always at odd's with the "Sneap Forum Zeitgeist" as it were.

This is basically why I don't engage in a lot of the rate my mix threads, or the shootouts or whatever. Coz generally I find the taste around here to be quite contrary to my taste... yet a lot of the techniques around here have really REALLY helped.

Kinda weird.