Definition of Good Guitar Tone

[johnzorn]

I know we here talk about what guitar tones are "good" and "shitty". I was wondering how you guys in general define good tone and bad tone. All the talk of tube, solid state and digital aside, what characterists are need to you individually to be classified as a "good tone". I know there will be differences in the tone you use when you record, and when your jamming by yourself or when your jamming with a band (and of course if you have a good tone, you mold it to the situation.) .....Or we could just say the tone has to be "Big, thick, and juicey." But anywho, the best tone I've had was when I had a Mesa Mark III thru a Peavey 5150 cab(I hate 5150 cabs). Very smooth with a nice bit of high end. At the time I was running a Rocktron Pro Q thru the effects loop and it sweeteed it up a bit. Also owned a Mesa Triple Rec. Solo head for a few (also thru the 5150 cab), and I can't recall the tone really made me wanna make love to it. I know it pushed massive air though and was heavy. The tone wasn't too memorable though. But anywho, I guess I would love to have the Mark III back for some sweet tone. But the damn footswitch for it cost $100 and some bucks. And I've just made no sense.

 

[commandante]

I am about to get a Mark III and I fell in love with it when I tried it.

For me a good (metal) guitar tone is:

Carcass - Heartwork
Death - The Sound of Perseverance
Destruction - Metal Discharge
The Haunted - s/t
The Hidden Hand - Divine Propaganda
Lamb of God - Ashes of Wake
Metallica - Master of Puppets
Nasum - Human 2.0
Nevermore - Dead Heart in a Dead World
Orphaned Land - Mabool
Spiritual Beggars - On Fire

The list can go on and on, but I would say it actually depends exactly what kind of tone you are looking for. These albums all have their characteristics, but I think the guitar tone on all of them perfectly fits the albums atmosphere.

 

[johnzorn]

Excellent list. I spans many different amps both solid state and tube and also different geners. Also your right in that the tone compliments the band as a whole. Having a tone fit in a mix is different thing as we all know and those tones are sweet. Plus James from Iced Earth has some tight as tone along with with thick strings(I think he uses 12's tuned to Eb). And his gallop is insane. He uses some custom amp though. But tone is tone, no matter how much it costs, what the source is. Just as long as it rocks out in the song. And Mark III's rule though.

 

[spaivxx]

I think of good tone in a few ways. For Basic Heavy Metal Rhythm I love Mesa Boogies, you guys hit in on the head with Mark III. One aspect of tone I rarely hear mention of that is important to me is dimension, or, the tone's existence in space. A good guitar tone envelopes you. You feel the air moving in very cool ways, as well as hearing it. That so far is my biggest complaint about modelers and such, their tone tends to be like looking at a painting while a godd analog sound is like a sculpture.

I have for most of my career played Mesa/Boogies and for some stupid reason I always buy other amps (as I have duscussed extensively in another thread). The Mark series Boogies have that big bottom end with that cutting but not piercing high. Boogies are naturally mid range heavy; which is why the "V" in the 5 band is seen on every (Mark series) Boogie you ever see on stage. I crank the mids on my Boogies and then scoop em out with the 5 band, that way I get a lot of harmonics, articulation and gain from the mid control before scooping out the 750k frequency.

Lead tones are actually easier to achieve.... I like a round, clear sustained lead tone where every subtle little thing I do to my strings is very clearly articulated.... like John Petrucci. I very often use the neck pickup for leads. For years I like the strat/Yngwie sound but that tone now I actually only use for playing Fusion type stuff.

All the guitars I use in my metal projects are outfitted with EMG's for the definition they give my sound.

On a similiar topic, a bad tone is thin, fuzzy, muddy and too pocesssed, any or all of these are qualities of shitty tone.

I bought a Vetta on eBay this week, it isnt here yet and already I am ready to get rid of it and just stick with Mesa.

Some favorite tones .... Petrucci (any DT album), Master of Puppets and lately I am lusting after the guitar sound on Godsmack's rendition of "Sweetleaf".

 

[johnzorn]

Good description there. You do want the tone to engulf you and also you want it to motivate you to play, to not put down the guitar and to keep playing. Also I agree in that lead tones are pretty easy to get, as are clean tones too. I think its the elusive "rhythm" tone that most people want. What I look for mostly in my tone is that the rhythmn tone has aspects of the lead tone. That is articulation across the string pallet. Its always easy to the the low string to chunck, as well as the 5th string. But getting the other others to have tight definition with chords as well as cut through with single notes and muting and other techniques is the challenge sometimes. I can sometimes see why people perfer tube to solid state or digital at times. To me, tube brings to mind the word "dry". Not dry in a bad, and its hard to describe it. Just listen to any tube amp with the distortion the way you want it. The saturation is just right, the ummph is there, and the "dryness" I guess is that little bit of the clean that was there that you have surpassed. As if you got your distortion yet about 15% of the clean is there and slightly dirty. Again hard to describe.

 

[spaivxx]

Another thing I notice, a lot of solid state stuff produces a tone that is tiring to the ear. I have been playing through a wide variety of amps the past few months and my drummer comments too that when I am using solid state gear, even good gear, we tend to want to practice for shorter periods. The tone seems to wear out the ear quicker. Not that i am dogging solid state, I use a Flexone II XL for a lot of stuff just because it is portable and full of tones.

 

[Hopkins-WitchfinderGeneral]

I'll list some I like:

The Haunted - one Kill Wonder (does it get any more intense?)
Opeth - Still Life
Enslaved - Isa
Scarve - Irradient

 

[Ermz]

Nightrage - Sweet Vengeance (for nice saturated rhythm tone)

Opeth - Damnation (for creamy clean electric and lead tones)

I've always had more trouble getting a good lead tone, to be honest. My ME-50 pedal has a simulation of the Boss DS-1 and that just creates perfect thrashy rhythm tone right from the get-go. The best lead tone I've been able to get is using the MT-2 simulation, which whilst being totally boosted up in the mids, tends to sound kind of strange and not articulated.

 

[DIOBOLIC5150]

Here are some of my favorite tones...
Divine Empire- Redemption
Crowbar- Odd Fellows Rest
Napalm Death- Diatribes
Nasum- Human 2.0
Soilwork- Doesn't matter, they have awesome tone on every album.

I can get CLOSE to the tones on Crowbar's Odd Fellows album.. I can get somewhat close to older Soilwork stuff... I think it's because both of these bands use Randall gear and my rig is almost the same. Soilwork uses Mesa gear now, I think..

My all time favorite tone...
Black Sabbath- Masters album, Into the Void... that's some tone right there! hehe

 

[Muttley]

I absolutely love the guitar sound on the 2nd Mindfunk album "Dropped".

No idea what amps/guitars were used for it though.

Muttley

 

[Brett - K A L I S I A]

My favorite guitar tones as I could remember :
Testament - The Gathering
Nevermore - Dead Heart in a Dead World
Machine Head - Burn my Eyes

 

[Exsanguis]

As far as metal goes. . .

Soilwork - A Predator's Portrait and Natural Born Chaos
Immortal - Sons of Northern Darkness
Opeth - Damnation and Deliverance
Carcass - Necroticism
Diabolical Masquerade - Death's Design
Fredrik Thordendal's Special Defects - Sol Niger Within
Morbid Angel - Covenant
Slayer - Divine Intervention
Megadeth - The System Has Failed
Nevermore - Dead Heart In a Dead World
Obituary - Cause of Death (our forum's own James Murphy has a phenomenal lead tone)

 

[Ermz]

Glad to see someone mentioned Sol Niger Within.

 

[Benny H]

Hell yeah. 'Meshuggah - None' is a fav of mine also. Same amp as SNW, Boogie 50 Caliber+

 

[Exsanguis]

My favorite part about Sol Niger Within is definitely Thordendal's 'Holdsworth-On-Crack' lead tone. Perfectly fits the music.

 

[Hopkins-WitchfinderGeneral]

I really love the leads on nothing too, thats some crazy fusion stylings right there.

 

[Genius Gone Insane]

how come no one put fear factory? granted, that tone would only work for them, or maybe meshuggah, but it is damn near perfect on demanufacture and obsolete.

here's my quick list if i want to hear blistering guitars:

carcass--heartwork (way, way ahead of its time)
metallica black album (actually, i don't ever listen to this album, but from what i remember, the guitar sound is incredible)
machine head--burn my eyes
nevermore--dhiadw
in flames--clayman

 

[Exsanguis]

Wow, I entirely forgot about In Flames. Clayman has a fantastic tone, as well as Jester Race. There's something about the tone on Colony that doesn't sound quite right. I'm not quite sure what it is, but I've always felt that that tone sounds a little sterile compared to their other albums.

 

[daemon097]

man - I've heard more about the mark III amps on here than I have in the last 10 years that I've owned one.

and commandante - you said you planned on purchasing one...do places still have them brand new? I would be really surprised...

 

[commandante]

no man, I got it used for 600 bucks just this weekend.