Engl Invader 150 or Savage 120?

[Gnash]

I bought an Engl Invader 150 a few weeks ago. Channel 3 is crushing with my OD808, but it just seems a little brittle, or thin. I haven't messed with changing any tubes. I am debating on sending it back for a Savage 120, or an Invader 100. I got a really good deal at $2200 new for it, but I'm looking for a more tighter, fuller gain, like my 5150 with just a little more. I don't really care at all for the other two high gain channels on the Invader. The clean channel is perfect. I'm leaning towards getting the Savage 120, but it's hard to give up the deal I got on the Invader. Will the Savage make me happy? I have about five days to decide.

 

[PhilTheBeard]

I would go with the savage personally

 

[Sacha]

Savage by a good margin, it's my favourite ENGL for pure tone, and it shares a lot with the 5150 IMO

 

[Gnash]

It's weird, but the Invader's tone seems way better with two Mesa 4x12s in the 4 ohm split, rather than one cab in 8 ohm.

 

[slayercannibalsuffohead]

Hmmm, never tried the Savage 120 (here in Australia, its a special order just to get one in), so I can't comment on that, but I am the proud owner of an Invader 150 for around 3 months now, and I must say, that I am delighted with what that amp can produce.

My tastes are very picky when it comes to overall saturation of an amp, as I love very thick but straight to the point kinda distortion. I love my 5150, 6505+ and my XXX, but the Invader is another couple of pegs up. Everyone that has heard this thing when we jam, are blown away by how much better it sounds than the Peaveys.

You say you boost the Invader? I boost all the Peaveys with a Maxon 808 and they sound great, also tried it with the Invader, and I swear it made it worse, even trying different settings on the amp itself and also the Maxon. Have you tried dicking around without a boost?

The 4 channels are very different, with the cleans being great, channel 2 is like hot rodded Marshall territory, channel 3 is the most scooped and brutal sounding, with channel 4 being awesome for lead tones.

Im using a Presonus EQ-3B in front of the amp and that has tightened things up brilliantly. As I said before. The 5150 is a great amp, and I love it, especially for it's mid-range grind, but the Invader does better book ends, as in the lows are deeper and tighter and the highs have a better quality sheen to them. Mixed with the Peaveys, I should have the sound I've been looking for. I have only tried all amps through V/30s, so I can't comment on other cabs, and my musical tastes are more death metal like, rather than this new-age metal kinda thing, so I hope you can get a bit of a feel from where I'm coming from.

Would love to try a Savage out, (Exodus' newy is the best tone I have heard for a thrash metal album), but sadly here in Oz, we only get Powerballs and Fireballs, Blackmores and Gigmasters. I tried a Powerball 2 the other day through an Orange cab with V/30s and walked away thinking that I could achieve 99% of what the Powerball had to offer through the Invader, so no moneys were parted. The Invader is also one loud mutherfucker, and because of its mids, cuts through brilliantly well in a live environment also.

I will get a Savage one day (thomann Germany), 230v works well straight into a wall socket here and at 60% off of what we get stung here for an Engl and I'll pop back one day and do a comparison of both Engls. All the best with the decision.

 

[TonyS.]

Invader 100 > Invader 150!!!

 

[amarshism]

Savage shits on the invader

 

[Brandon E.]

Invaders are gross.

 

[StefTD]

Savage for sure!

 

[Torgal]

Victor Smolski Ltd > Savage 120 > Invader imo.

If you're looking for agressive attack the Invader is definately not for you.

 

[Gnash]

I dig that Victor Smolski head. It has 6l6s, and the clips I have heard with him playing it sound good. Better than a Savage huh?

 

[Melb_shredder]

For what you're after the Savage seems a better fit. But anyone saying the Invader sucks is talking shit because it has its fair share of awesome built in, just not for that ultra awesome generic metal tone. But yeah, Savage in this case definitely.

 

[Brandon E.]

But anyone saying the Invader sucks is talking shit because it has its fair share of awesome built in, just not for that ultra awesome generic metal tone.

It is versatile...it can get a lot of different sounds. Too bad all of them suck though

 

[CronosBeyond]

What exactly is a "generic metal tone"?

 

[Lasse Lammert]

clearly the Savage (IF it HAS to be Engl)

 

[amarshism]

It is versatile...it can get a lot of different sounds. Too bad all of them suck though

Hahahaha

 

[Torgal]

I dig that Victor Smolski head. It has 6l6s, and the clips I have heard with him playing it sound good. Better than a Savage huh?

Fortunately I don't live too far away from the Thomann Store so I had the chance to try out almost every single ENGL head so far. Yeah lucky me. :Smokedev:

Before I got my V.S. I've already owned a Savage 60 and I realy love that sound. A lot of people say you can't compare 60 vs. 120 but I say the basic tone is quite similar. Fast attack and one of most "raw" sounds an Engl can provide. Of course the 120 has more headroom and more low end.

So how to compare a V.S. to a Savage? First of all you can't make a mistake with either one.
The best advice I can give is that I bought the V.S. because I was looking for more balls and didn't like the Invader at all. I was looking for a Savage type of amp with more balls than my precious 60 Watt head. The 120 didn't move as much air as I was expecting so I've tried the Powerball II and the Fireball II and the V.S. All comparison here was done without any pedals because I'm not a fan of cable mess. For recording a TS will make your mix a lot easier, but that's a different story.

So if I had to put up a fav list for direct "attacky" sound with enough punch it would look like this:

V.S.
Savage 120
Fireball 2
Powerball 2
Savage 60
.
.
Invader

Of course that's only my subjective impression. So if you have the chance to play the amps back to back, please do that. Thats simply the best method.
If you have specific questions regarding the differences I'll try to answer as best as I can. And no I don't work for Engl, I'm just another addict .

 

[Wohma]

Before I got my V.S. I've already owned a Savage 60 and I realy love that sound. A lot of people say you can't compare 60 vs. 120 but I say the basic tone is quite similar. Fast attack and one of most "raw" sounds an Engl can provide. Of course the 120 has more headroom and more low end.

+1 on that, I also have Savage 60 and I don't think the differences are so dramatic tone-wise.


Lasse: Why don't you like ENGLs? I'd really love to hear an ENGL reamped by you, but with your attitude I don't see that happening :\

 

[Gnash]

It sucks that I don't have a store nearby to try out the amps, but they are shipped from the Musician's Friend warehouse which is 30 minutes from my house. It's cool that I can get an amp delivered in 1 day! It just sucks that I got a new amp for $800 off, and if I send it back...there goes the deal. I have really learned to love the tone of ch.3+gain switch+TS. I'm just always trying to dial in a little fuller gain out of it. It just seems a little too compressed, or processed. I bet the haead would come alive with a hotter bias and better tubes throughout. Ch. 4 is just not right, with the mid boost curve. I'm sure I would never use it, so the 2 full channels of other models would be fine for me. If there is a better tone than this from Engl, I gotta try that. I'm looking for the tight low-mids of the invader with a faster, more organic attack. Maybe something in between the Invader and my 5150. Since those VS heads are in stock right now, I might try one. The Savage won't be in for another two weeks.

 

[Torgal]

I know exactly what you mean when you say you want to dial in more gain on the Invader. It's simply less "punchy" than the FB PB and V.S.
I use Channel 3 for Rhythms and Channel 4 with more gain and mids OR the Midle Voice Button for Leads(awesome feature!).
Actually Victor Smolski switched from Powerballs and Invaders (he used both at a time) to his sig amp to combine the advantages.


Here's a little something to feed your GAS. It's in german but the amp speaks for itself :-D


One word of warning though before you hit that order-button! The Snakeskin Tolex is a lot more sensitive than a regular Marshall or Engl Tolex. If you plan to take it out on the road I highly recommend a case.


@Wohma: Give a month or two and I'll start reamping for our band with EVH 5150, Marshall JVM410HCF, Engl V.S. and Savage 60. I can't compete with Lasses awesome mixes but I'll do my best to squeeze out some nice guitar tones.