Getting a nice huge bass tone is impossible

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Jan 17, 2014
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I've tried Ermz Systematic Guide, tons of hours processing and mixing and my bass tones are so sterile. I get that the source sound is important but I just can't get a good tone...tried zombass 2/3, FTS bass and Trilian and they sound better than my real bass tones and still I can't get a good tone out of them.

This is Trilian bass



just listen how good it sounds from 1:30 and onwards

this is getting really depressing...what are you guys doing to make your bass sound so huge?
 
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1. Fresh strings, or if you're cheap, boil them or use the "slap them against the fretboard" technique

2. Proper input volume

3. Modest onboard eq, I usually increase the treble and reduce the mids just a tad to make it clank better

4. Filter into multiple tracks a la Systematic. I find that the single biggest determinant of the bass tone is the steepness of the high pass and low pass filters you end up using here on each track, and what frequencies you set them to. I usually use an 18db/oct low pass filter at around 185 for my DI/low end track, with the HPF set to about 35 at either 6 or 12 db/oct. Sounds extreme, but those low mid frequencies are absolutely useless and you can add them back in in a more controlled manner by reducing the HPF of your clank/distortion tracks. Speaking of which...

5. Clank/distortion tracks! Whether you use just a DI and a clank, or a DI and distortion, or all three will substantially alter the tone. Try inverting the phase on each track to see what sounds best to you- you will often get phase cancellation when you distort the tracks. I usually use a DI, a SansAmp track, and a Dual Rectifier track. Your HPF/LPF determine how much of these tracks you can use in the mix. Lower HPF = muddier bass tone that sticks out in the mix. Lower LPF = making the tone less present, but it also tends to blend better with the guitars/drums/vox and allows you to turn up the overall bass volume a bit more.

5.5. Relative volumes of the 2-3 tracks. I mute the clank/disto tracks and set the DI volume to 0, then bring it up until the mix feels full. Then I set the disto/clank tracks to 0 and bring them up until you can just barely hear them in the mix.

6. "Character" EQ after your initial HPF/LPF decisions on the bus. I almost never boost, and if anything, I cut a little more around 200 hz to get rid of that nasally, whooshy zone from about 200-350 hz. Totally awful. Just be conscious of how much you're doing; if you use an extreme high pass/low pass on the DI, you shouldn't need basically any EQ on the bus at all.

7. Compression: where, how much, what type. I always have a modest amount of Waves bass rider on my DI (even after doing some manual volume riding on the track itself), followed by gentle feedback compression like the TDR Feedback Comp just to smooth it out. On the bus, I usually have 2-3 db of gain reduction from a medium attack, slowish release SSL compressor, then an 1176 just to catch the peaks, then a limiter to catch any last volume jumps. Multiband compression can help, but it's easy to mutilate the tone by accident if you have each segment solo'd, so be careful.

8. Saturation/distortion/whatever on the bus. SoundToys Decapitator is good from what I've heard when used sparingly; I usually use a bit of Reaper's JS Saturation plugin and Slate VCC set to either the US or Brit N. Play with the drive to get to the point where it starts to muddy the sound then back off. This should add some harmonic content to a very surgical-sounding end bass tone and make it sound more natural.

I'm by no means an expert, but I've always struggled with bass tones as well and I've found these to be the most important parts of the process. The new version of Ermz' guide has some interesting techniques involving using saturation at an earlier stage in the process, and different compression ideas. Overall, you can sort of fuck everything else up, but you have to get your HPF/LPF frequencies/slopes right, and you have to know how to use a compressor well. Everything else should fall into place with some modest effort.
 
The bass player is the first important thing then the bass. Also, try to shape your guitar tone around your bass tone. If you have Ermz book to get you in the ballpark, then you have to experiment until you find something that works for you. And, use you ears!!! Take some reference mixes. This last point was (and actually is) very important for me.
 
Great player, fresh strings, great bass, b7k/sansamp into something ampeg-ish, and you should be ready to jizz your pants.
Even "just" the first half into a SansAmp (the PT plugin is awesome for this) can do the job really really well.

And even with this, it's not the easiest thing in the world to balance the low end in a mix. You can easily go overboard with the management (too much compression,too much eq).

Also don't underestimate what automation does to it in the mix.

Look out for various multitracks, and try out the different bass DI's. even through the same chain. You'll realize it's so much about the source.
 
Auras is one of my favorite artists. I didn't know they used trilian for their records.

I'm still learning how to get a good bass tone that work well with guitars. It seems I get a fuller bass sound with a real bass than a midi bass. But some user here do a nice job with midi bass. I think I have to ptactice more andI have to check out trilian ^^
 
Bass, strings, playing technique will get you 80% there :



I actually just bought a Spector for this reason alone : having a proper good bass ready anytime I need to track a line !
 
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^ that's super awesome! such a shame the bass is so low on the album though. Hansen never really makes the bass audible. Would have been great here :p

I didn't get that you wanted to know how the get that out of trilian. If the song in the op really used trilian, I guess it's the hardcore bass fingered?

Just try running that through a B7k or something like that. Should be possible to get that kind of mood going if it's the same sample libary.
Maybe also try limiting the bass before any distortion/clank. that way you can even it out to get a constant "buzz" in the bass going.
 
If you can't get a good bass tone: Either your strings suck, your bass sucks, or the player sucks. End of story.

Make each of those better in succession until you find the problem. I've never had luck with VI basses, but with them I'd imagine its ALL in the programming, like with programmed drums, to get a realistic sound.
 
That Auras track sounds good. It's nice to hear that Jordan is still keeping the bar high over there.

There's no simple answer to your question. Getting low-end of that quality is one of the hardest things to get right, and will likely take you years to truly master. Between the mixing guide and the posts here, you've been given the tools. You need to figure it out for yourself from there.
 
Bass is the most difficult thing to nail imho. I've been chipping away at this production stuff for years and years now, since I was 15... and I still struggle to get the bass tones that I want. Multi-band processing is basically the best thing for it though, as has been said. I first noticed this when I looked at the rigs of the bassists I like. None of them had simple rigs. I'm thinking specifically of Justin Chancellor from Tool. Two amps, one set dirty, one set clean. And parallel signal paths on his pedalboard.

It seems obvious now, but I never got it when I first started out: divide your bass into sets of frequencies, and give each of them jobs. The lows, the mids, and the highs... in a basic sense. Figure out for each section which part needs to dominate, and automate levels to make it so.

Focus on each band individually at first, and get them sounding the best they can, and then see how they sound together. A bit of parallel bus compression can help glue the three bands together as well. I use Cytomic The Glue or Waves CLA comps for this.
 
Nolly's chain is interesting too. He has a specific sound that fits Periphery, and he plays kind of like a guitarist. When he disables a single pedal, the whole tone falls appart :
 
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