Hi guys, I need some advice. (Studio related)

[tempe]

For a bit of background, I've been an aspiring audio engineer for around 4 years now. I've started recording local bands this year and things are looking good for next year. I'm booked for the first three months of the year which is fantastic, I just have one small problem. I as of the 24th of this month have nowhere to record any of it.

I'm currently also studying at SAE which I'm starting to feel is a giant waste of time for me, because I only started this year. I've been learning on my own for three years and looking forward at my unit outlines I'm not going to learn anything I don't already know (information I've acquired mostly from this forum) until the last trimester in a year's time, which is the use and alignment of a tape machine. I've been recording bands mostly at home using either SAE or the music academy I teach at to record drums, which has been fine until my lease on my current house ran out and because of the noise complaints from recording, the agent decided not to renew our lease. I'm currently in the process of finding a place with my girlfriend and basically have decided that I can't realistically work from home anymore. Not while we are both students and can't really afford a place big enough to accommodate my work.

What I am tentatively thinking of doing is leaving uni and doing whatever I can to start my own studio. Whether that means working a shit job for 6 months and canceling my current bookings (thankfully haven't taken any deposits yet) to save up enough to get a business loan. Or trying to find work at another studio, I'm not really sure.

I'm curious how people like Ermin and Joey got things started. Both of which I understand work from home, but that's unfortunately not possible where I am, the housing market is just to expensive in Perth to buy or rent a place like Joey's, and from my understanding Ermin mostly gets mixing work, thus can work from home. What I am ultimately looking at is some kind of commercial space that I am going to build from the ground up, which is just insanely expensive.

And that brings me to my next problem, the only reason I am booked for three months is because well I'm cheap for Perth. I charge $400 a track, for a finished product including mixing and my lame attempt at mastering. Now my work does not sound amazing, but it sounds better than the one other dude working in Perth recording small bands of a similar genre (mostly hardcore), and apparently I'm much more pleasant to be around . Other places in the city are charging between $700 and $1500 a day, but none of them really know what they are doing for metal. If I start a commercial studio with that kind of outlay and monthly expenditure, I need to start working with different bands as there is no way in hell that the bands I am working with could afford $1000 a day studio rates. I need to start looking at label work for that, and my only experience of that is one track for a charity CD released in boston (Covers for Cure if anyone has heard of it) and a two tracks for a split being released on a local (not even national) hardcore label. So that wouldn't pay that either. Which is yet another problem.

I was also considering interning at a studio instead, but of course no one in Perth takes interns, don't you just love living in a small city! I also don't have the option of family help, my father passed away a little more than a year ago and my mother hadn't worked for 12 years before that, leaving to be a stay at home mum and is having trouble getting back into the workforce.

So I'm sure someone else has been in my position before, where you have the work to keep going, but a huge jump in expenditure and not a immediate way to deal with it. As with the rates I've been charging its barely enough to survive and save a little for some more gear. I'm just really stuck and I'm sure this whole rant didn't make a lot of sense but please help me. There isn't anything I would rather do in the world, and I'll do anything to be able to work in this industry. I've definitely got the drive to do anything, it's just trying to work out where to begin.

Quite frankly I think I'm mad, but I love what I'm doing and uni isn't rewarding for me at the moment. But I just have absolutely no idea where to begin. I can't work from home, and I can't afford to not work from home. I'm still only 21 so its not like I'm financially ruining a family with my choices or anything but its still terrifying!

Help me out guys?

Thanks,
Matt

 

[Trevoire520]

Basically it looks like you need to find a studio local to you that will let you hire the studio as a freelancer. You'll have to increase the rate you're charging the bands to reflect the added expenditure, but chances are the results should be even better if the studio is at least half decent.

 

[tempe]

Basically it looks like you need to find a studio local to you that will let you hire the studio as a freelancer. You'll have to increase the rate you're charging the bands to reflect the added expenditure, but chances are the results should be even better if the studio is at least half decent.

I've tried that Should have mentioned it in the OP. The only place willing to do that is a gigantic concrete box for a tracking room, and a control room that consists of a behringer mixer and a bunch of SM58s for mics. Oh and they want to charge me $500 a day and not let me bring in my own gear. Everywhere else is extremely paranoid about other people taking their work or something and just won't allow freelancing. It's because our city is so small that people are worried about losing what little clientele they have.

 

[jipchen]

Wow, hard decision man.
An internship or freelancing (or both) would really be a good way, but it seems that's not really an option.
I'm studying audio engineering at a similar school (although much smaller) and felt like it was a waste of time in the beginning, but I've already learned a lot new and important stuff. I probably would've learnt the same amount of things as intern at a studio but here are no studios I'd want to work

I don't think it's a good idea to quit SAE, because if you're really in the whole thing (and you clearly are) you can profit from it in many ways: knowledge from the courses, exchange tips and tricks with fellow sudents / audio engineers, perhaps get to know someone who's starting a studio and looking for a partner, get assistant-jobs from the SAE, etc.

How much time do you have to spend in the whole SAE thing (per week)? Can you manage a side job to gain some money?

Also, ever thought of moving to another place? Preferrably to a place with a few good studios around.. I believe you can study at any SAE around the world?

 

[tempe]

Hey guys thanks for your help, I'm probably not going to quit SAE as I really just want to finish my degree. I've dropped out of two different music performance courses (I did Jazz then Contemporary performance), ultimately to go to SAE and I'm fucking finishing if not just to have SOMETHING to show after 4 years of university thus far. I have another year and 3 months to go, and I'm there around 20 hours a week which is just class time. I'm usually there around another 8 - 16 working in the various studios. Most other time is spent working on other projects. It looks like I'm going to have to bite the bullet and just get another part time job and not record outside of uni for a while. Which just plain sucks, I guess I could try and get some mixing work but everyone around here doesn't like the idea of that.

I'd be completely down with moving and so is my partner, I'd ultimately like to go to somewhere like LA, and just try and make it because you never know what will happen in life and there are a lot of small studios that make money in that area. Unfortunately I am also in a band which is just starting to tour next year as well, and getting out first few international supports. Which I obviously would have to leave. Major life choices suck.

 

[black.death]

I am not a studio owner, and I might never try to be one in my entire life. I also do not live in Australia. Nonetheless, I read your entire thread and here are my thoughts these may seem harsh but they are not intended to be such.

1. Lease a new house. One that is preferably located a decent distance away from neighbors. I'm not saying that you have to live on an open farm. Just look for something a bit less congested without as many lame neighbors.

2. Do not even bother entertaining the idea of moving to LA to "make it." Thousands of conniving audio engineers are already there and everywhere else in California. You mentioned that Perth is a really small market but despite your stated moderate ability are able to make $400 per track and seem to have a bit of a following. That's actually a decent setup plus you are already booked solid for three months. Do not lose that potential money and word of mouth that you have going just to gamble on a drastic move to try and get bigger bands somewhere else. You mentioned being inspired by Joey, he lives in Indiana. Indiana is known for absolute jack shit in the music world (sans Joey). He has been able to build up from bringing in a steady clientele of local bands and nobodies. Then slowly amassing bigger and bigger bands. This is what you are on your way to doing and should continue to be doing. Joey obtained a word of mouth and could now setup shop and record bands anywhere. Why doesn't he do this and move to LA? Probably for a bunch of reasons but here are some ideas why. a. He completely has the hardcore/scenecore/etc. market cornered in his entire state. He is now the goto guy for these genres. b. Why risk moving into a more crowded market area? c. Standard of living is nearly as cheap as humanly possibly in his state. d. He already "made it" by his own merits and does not need some phantom connection to do so.

3. Here's some advice. Absolutely under no circumstance should you allow a girlfriend to influence how you make a living and where you live (I'm not saying you do this for all that I know you have the best girlfriend under the known sun). If you need to move just outside Perth to be able to get a nice enough setup to record, then do it (no need to go crazy fancy yet, hell I'm pretty sure that neither Joey nor Ermz are and they still get sick results). If your girlfriend doesn't understand the basic concept that you are living your dream and making money off of it, then she is not worth it. There will always be more girls and probably even more as you record even better known bands. To top it off you live in Australia for the love of god, (from what I have seen/heard/read) gorgeous beaches and babes a plenty. The vast majority of people will never ever live the actual life that they want. From your posting, I gathered that you want to record bands for a living. Then do that and only that. Most people end up with at best mid level management jobs for companies that do not give a fuck if they live or die. Create your own legacy and be your own man.

4. School. Your aforementioned influences include people on this board like Joey and Ermz. To my knowledge neither went to school for audio engineering. If school is using up too much of your time and funds right now. Finish later if you care. Seriously what in the hell could any school possibly teach you about recording brutal death metal? This forum is the only school on the planet for that and you are already here and people are here 24 hours a day waiting to listen critique and comment on your mixes. What teacher actually even listens to these genres enough to actually help lead you to mosh nirvana (you probably record other music too but you can post that and receive critiques just the same)?

5. Drum volume. Alright if you simply cannot move to a better recording space. Either A. program drums B. use a drum set with mesh heads and triggers and use SSD, SD2, etc. to replace C. use an electronic drum set. D. Have them track drums somewhere else.


Again, this post might seem harsh ut it is not meant to be so. I have been in countless real life conversations where people ask me about forming a studio or what it takes to make it in the music industry. I break it down for them. They go back to believing that if they could just move to LA, NYC, etc. then they could get connections or get signed or some other bullshit just by pure luck. One, two, three+ years later they are working a job that they absolutely hate still fantasizing about making it.

Keep recording those bands for $400/track until your recordings are so good that you can start increasing your rates, and as such take the other piece of garbage studio's clients, and eventually build up your own nice studio. Try to stay as financially lean as possible until then.

 

[Trevoire520]

Quite surprised at the reluctance of studio's to let freelancers in tbh. You'd think in this economy any studio with a room sitting empty would love to get someone in to make some money from.
Maybe you can find someone thats in the same boat as you locally and you could open a studio together? Halves the cost and risk.

 

[ahjteam]

but of course no one in Perth takes interns, don't you just love living in a small city!

Umm, Perth has 1.65 MILLION inhabitants, I wouldn't count that as a small city. I live in a city that has 0.3% of that population.

 

[LeSedna]

Although, isn't $400 a song a fairly decent rate ?

 

[tempe]

I am not a studio owner, and I might never try to be one in my entire life. I also do not live in Australia. Nonetheless, I read your entire thread and here are my thoughts these may seem harsh but they are not intended to be such.

1. Lease a new house. One that is preferably located a decent distance away from neighbors. I'm not saying that you have to live on an open farm. Just look for something a bit less congested without as many lame neighbors.

2. Do not even bother entertaining the idea of moving to LA to "make it." Thousands of conniving audio engineers are already there and everywhere else in California. You mentioned that Perth is a really small market but despite your stated moderate ability are able to make $400 per track and seem to have a bit of a following. That's actually a decent setup plus you are already booked solid for three months. Do not lose that potential money and word of mouth that you have going just to gamble on a drastic move to try and get bigger bands somewhere else. You mentioned being inspired by Joey, he lives in Indiana. Indiana is known for absolute jack shit in the music world (sans Joey). He has been able to build up from bringing in a steady clientele of local bands and nobodies. Then slowly amassing bigger and bigger bands. This is what you are on your way to doing and should continue to be doing. Joey obtained a word of mouth and could now setup shop and record bands anywhere. Why doesn't he do this and move to LA? Probably for a bunch of reasons but here are some ideas why. a. He completely has the hardcore/scenecore/etc. market cornered in his entire state. He is now the goto guy for these genres. b. Why risk moving into a more crowded market area? c. Standard of living is nearly as cheap as humanly possibly in his state. d. He already "made it" by his own merits and does not need some phantom connection to do so.

3. Here's some advice. Absolutely under no circumstance should you allow a girlfriend to influence how you make a living and where you live (I'm not saying you do this for all that I know you have the best girlfriend under the known sun). If you need to move just outside Perth to be able to get a nice enough setup to record, then do it (no need to go crazy fancy yet, hell I'm pretty sure that neither Joey nor Ermz are and they still get sick results). If your girlfriend doesn't understand the basic concept that you are living your dream and making money off of it, then she is not worth it. There will always be more girls and probably even more as you record even better known bands. To top it off you live in Australia for the love of god, (from what I have seen/heard/read) gorgeous beaches and babes a plenty. The vast majority of people will never ever live the actual life that they want. From your posting, I gathered that you want to record bands for a living. Then do that and only that. Most people end up with at best mid level management jobs for companies that do not give a fuck if they live or die. Create your own legacy and be your own man.

4. School. Your aforementioned influences include people on this board like Joey and Ermz. To my knowledge neither went to school for audio engineering. If school is using up too much of your time and funds right now. Finish later if you care. Seriously what in the hell could any school possibly teach you about recording brutal death metal? This forum is the only school on the planet for that and you are already here and people are here 24 hours a day waiting to listen critique and comment on your mixes. What teacher actually even listens to these genres enough to actually help lead you to mosh nirvana (you probably record other music too but you can post that and receive critiques just the same)?

5. Drum volume. Alright if you simply cannot move to a better recording space. Either A. program drums B. use a drum set with mesh heads and triggers and use SSD, SD2, etc. to replace C. use an electronic drum set. D. Have them track drums somewhere else.


Again, this post might seem harsh ut it is not meant to be so. I have been in countless real life conversations where people ask me about forming a studio or what it takes to make it in the music industry. I break it down for them. They go back to believing that if they could just move to LA, NYC, etc. then they could get connections or get signed or some other bullshit just by pure luck. One, two, three+ years later they are working a job that they absolutely hate still fantasizing about making it.

Keep recording those bands for $400/track until your recordings are so good that you can start increasing your rates, and as such take the other piece of garbage studio's clients, and eventually build up your own nice studio. Try to stay as financially lean as possible until then.

Hey man thanks for the advice! It didn't come off as harsh I needed to hear a lot of it. I am trying to lease a new place at the moment, and its on a much bigger block further away from neighbors. So that should be sweet. As for your second point I don't know why I said LA, it's a ridiculous notion and it probably just seemed at like a grand idea at 2am when I wrote this, whilst stressing out. Third point, its not so much my girlfriend its more the fact that the real estate agent kicked us out because of noise complaints, its been a horrible situation and they've given us until the 24th to get out of the house we're in at the moment which to be honest makes me think my real estate agent is the Grinch but whatever I'm probably going to try and just soundproof the shit out of a room in my new house, then try and treat it over that and just see what happens.

As for the recording school, its not making a lot of sense to me at the moment, purely because I've learned more from this place then from a university I am paying a whole lot of money to go to. And just to give people a reference to the standard of the university / the quality of the feedback. The track on my myspace in my signature "A rose by any other name" was one of the first tracks I ever recorded and it was for a assignment in my first trimester. I got 97% for the mix and if I posted it here it would get absolutely torn to shreds, it sounds terrible! But at the same time, I want to finish my degree because heaven forbid I ever need the piece of paper for whatever reason.

I also do a lot of programmed drums at the moment, and track live drums where ever I can find space to do so, so things wouldn't really change for that. But its also the problem of not being able to crank a tube amp / record loud singing / mix at a reasonable volume. Oh well, nothing a shitton of soundproofing wont fix.

Quite surprised at the reluctance of studio's to let freelancers in tbh. You'd think in this economy any studio with a room sitting empty would love to get someone in to make some money from.
Maybe you can find someone thats in the same boat as you locally and you could open a studio together? Halves the cost and risk.

Trust me I am surprised about the freelancing thing, I think its just plain paranoia more than anything. Particularly when the few times I've tried it, its to record a band that the studio has recorded before and gone to me afterwards not for any reason except that I am a hell of a lot cheaper.

@ahjteam Perth may be a big city, but its a musical hole. Arts aren't appreciated here in general, despite having the most prestigious music school in the country. Everyone believes that staying in Perth isn't going to get you anywhere and people with delusions of grandeur move to somewhere like London or even the other side of the country, where really if people just stayed here. We would have a fantastically creative city. A great example of this would be a band I just recorded a track for. They shall remain nameless but they we're the typical crab-core bs, but completely talentless unlike Attack Attack which are actually capable of writing a riff. I recorded them a cover of Katy Perry's Teenage Dream (dear god). They are recording over east not because they don't like my work but they believe that going over east will make them seem like a better band, more worthy of being taken seriously. Its a fucked situation but I'm doing my best to change that!

Thanks so much for your advice guys, I think I really was stressing a little more than I had to last night. I think what I'm going to do is set up a room at my new house, and try and track as much elsewhere as I can and just mix from home. If anyone has any better ideas, please tell me!