How is everyone's training going?

[Dak]

And Army has a standard and we don't play that palms facing inward stuff

 

[rms]

He bought that shirt off ebay

 

[SomeGuyDude]

It's a stupid goddamn argument because the only people who argue that CHIN-UPS aren't "proper" are skinny twats who can't bench their own bodyweight and read a couple articles on bodybuilding.com so they think they're experts.

Anyway, came close to a 475 belt-free pull today, which would have been damn cool considering I haven't done deadlifts in about 2 months and I've lost 10 pounds in the interim. 455 was smooth as silk but I just couldn't get 475 over my knees. I'm definitely thinking by Halloween I'll be able to hit 500@200, which would give me that nice 2.5x number. Finished up with a few sets of 205-225 box front squats and some other shit, called it a day.

 

[King Richard]

It's a stupid goddamn argument because the only people who argue that CHIN-UPS aren't "proper" are skinny twats who can't bench their own bodyweight and read a couple articles on bodybuilding.com so they think they're experts.

 

[Satanstoenail]

Why's that?

I think I'd just find it distracting.

 

[damnromulans]

pointless, ne?

What are you, Japanese?

I went to GOLD'S GYM for the first time yesterday (using my Groupon!) after running 3 miles outside with PP and I fucking hate everything about that place. This specific location was where that dude flipped out and threw equipment around and punched random people until police Tasered him to death: http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/Chief-Tasers-justified-2244581.php

Still made the most of my visit. I have fucking god awful all-over DOMS today which is the first in a while. Also my lower back hurts, which I suspect is from flinging 40 lb bags of dirt around after the gym. Sprints and stairs this morning. Need to be in shape to hike some of the Adirondack High Peaks in a week and a half.

 

[rms]

Thinking of a new routine, I think I fucked my other shoulder the other day so i'm worried i'm getting old..

Day1 Chest
Day2 Tris/Back
Day3 Bis/Shoulders
Fill the whole week with this, hit legs on Friday and Saturday...Sunday rest/swim/run day..am I fucked up?

 

[King Richard]

uh...yes

Why would you want to spend five-six days a week working out? When you go to the gym, workout. There's no reason why you can't do legs, chest, arms, and back all in the same day unless you're doing purely isolation exercises which would make no sense. Get a full body work, allow enough time to fully recover and go back at it. For some its three days rest, for others its six, whatever.

Start charting your workouts and when you see an area lagging behind, switch your routine up.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

KR, stop talking. You have NO IDEA what you're talking about. Every post you make in this thread shows more and more ignorance when it comes to exercise. I'm not kidding, do you actually work out? Between this chinup talk and now you're suggesting that a split routine is bad, I can't imagine you do more than once a week on Nautilus equipment.

As for rms, six days of nonstop lifting is definitely a bit much. A four-day split is plenty for most people. Nice and basic would be:

Chest/tris
back/bis
shoulders/etc
Legs

Put 'em on whatever days you want, feel free to run around or swim or just have fun on the off days.

 

[damnromulans]

You forgot hamtoids and squelts day. Those are important.

I'm in so much pain and I'm probably still like 40% body fat. urrrggfff

 

[Dak]

I think Squelts are highly overrated.

Did not lift on Monday since school was closed/ we had a big family shindig. Lifting tomorrow morning. Hoping to hit 15 on the pullups, maybe bump my bench up a little. I'm so crammed for time and there's workouts I wouldn't do normally that are required for the class. Might see if I can get by without doing some of them, and sub in what I would prefer to do.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

You forgot hamtoids and squelts day. Those are important.

I'm in so much pain and I'm probably still like 40% body fat. urrrggfff

Unless you gained about 50 pounds since that yoga pic you put up I don't think you're anywhere close to 40%, LOL.

 

[Krigloch the Furious]

this strained groin is really putting a hamper on my bike riding. bah!!!

 

[rms]

KR, stop talking. You have NO IDEA what you're talking about. Every post you make in this thread shows more and more ignorance when it comes to exercise. I'm not kidding, do you actually work out? Between this chinup talk and now you're suggesting that a split routine is bad, I can't imagine you do more than once a week on Nautilus equipment.

As for rms, six days of nonstop lifting is definitely a bit much. A four-day split is plenty for most people. Nice and basic would be:

Chest/tris
back/bis
shoulders/etc
Legs

Put 'em on whatever days you want, feel free to run around or swim or just have fun on the off days.

I don't really like to depend on a weekday leg day since i'm usually required to run a good distance and I can't be seen as a weak body and my legs are so un-trained that they are just nothing but runner's legs..I like doing Chest by itself because it's the hardest one I do..longest workout per muscle group

 

[King Richard]

KR, stop talking. You have NO IDEA what you're talking about.

Prove me wrong. Claiming I have no idea what I'm talking about is not a counter argument.

Every post you make in this thread shows more and more ignorance when it comes to exercise.

Ignorance in the sense that you posted a video of yourself doing seated reverse grip chin-ups with a straight bar? Or ignorance in the sense that you posted a video of yourself doing an "axle press" using nothing more than momentum and joint locking to complete an exercise?

I'm not kidding, do you actually work out? Between this chinup talk and now you're suggesting that a split routine is bad, I can't imagine you do more than once a week on Nautilus equipment.

Yes I work out, I haven't for a while due to laziness, but that's irrelevant. I know how to workout and I also know how to doll out helpful advice without being a complete cunt about it.

As for my "suggesting that a split routine is bad", stop putting words in my mouth. I didn't say it was bad, I implied that it's a waste of time, slight difference methinks. If someone is performing the basic exercises in a workout routine when they're just starting out, or even for people who have been lifting for quite some time should continue to perform theses exercises, then there's five essential exercises they should be performing; a vertical and horizontal push and pull with the arms and leg exercise like squats. All of these exercises can easily be performed in an hour or less. Not only that, but they're all interwoven in the overall scheme of full body fitness. Four of those simple exercises include chest, triceps, biceps, traps, lats, shoulders, abs, and deltoids and work them simultaneously. What you're suggesting is more of a routine centered around isolation exercises which far too many people perform for no reason. The only reason the average person should be performing isolation exercises is to increase growth if a particular muscle group is lagging behind. And the philosophy behind that should be to NOT increase reps for the sake of reps, but increase the amount of work done. You don't have to be a personal trainer to figure this out, but for the sake of it I'll throw in the fact that I've had these specific philosophies supported and practiced by a number of world-renown instructors such as *Arthur Jones (the father of high intensity training), Drew Baye, and my friend IRL who is a personal trainer for the athletic club in my town who has a BA in Kinesiology from IU.

So ya, I may not be an instructor, but I'm not talking out of my ass either brah. Keep doing what you're doing, I don't give a shit, but I'm not going to sit here quietly while you try to pass long shitty advice.

edit: *Typed the wrong name, sue me.

 

[divine_torture]

Squats/leg curls/shoulder day today. Finally added a little weight (20 lbs) to my squats, but didn't to an extremely aggressive shoulder workout. Presses on a machine, standing presses with the incline HammerStrength machine, shrugs, lat raises, and neutral grip presses on a machine. Still pretty exhausted though.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

King Richard, I'm going to say this one last time: if you are suggesting a split routine is a "waste of time", then apparently you're privy to some secret that decades of coaches of varying levels of strength training are not. Pick a protocol: 5x5, Smolov, Sheiko, 5/3/1, Juggernaut, Crossfit Conjugate, German Volume, Westside, Metal Militia, the list goes on and on and on, ALL split routines.

YES, there exists the idea of HST training and there are some acolytes of full body routines, but they're in a bit of a minority and you ain't gonna find too many people that do it any more than you'll find a lot of vegans in lifting. Can it be done for some? Sure. Are you a fucking moron if you say that eating meat is a waste of time? Yes.

And besides, Mentzer isn't the father of HIT. That's Arthur Jones. And Mentzer didn't do full body, or even full "HIT" until the END of his career after he'd spent the rest of it with splits and volume. Same with another supposed HIT proponent, Dorian Yates. Despite all the yapping about him doing HIT, he didn't do that until the very end after he'd already built his body on a volume-oriented split routine.

You have no idea what you're talking about, and you're name-dropping your... friend who's a personal trainer? Oh snap, watch out, dude knows a PT! Lord knows I'm not friends with about seven of those, complete with certifications and degrees in things like sports medicine or kinesiology. I also know national-level strongman competitors, a couple competing bodybuilders, and one guy who wrestles on the independent circuit. So what? Are you suggesting your lone "friend" knows more than everyone else?

I'm done with ya dude. I'll keep jawing here in the thread, but this is the last post I'm gonna waste trying to explain why you're woefully ignorant.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

Had a fun little circuit today, 10-8-6-4-2 log clean and presses with a 160lb log with 7 clap pushups in between. My shoulder is fucking killing me, but it was a fun little try. Forgot to have the clock going, but it was two regular ol' hip hop tracks, so... about 7 minutes?

 

[King Richard]

King Richard, I'm going to say this one last time: if you are suggesting a split routine is a "waste of time", then apparently you're privy to some secret that decades of coaches of varying levels of strength training are not. Pick a protocol: 5x5, Smolov, Sheiko, 5/3/1, Juggernaut, Crossfit Conjugate, German Volume, Westside, Metal Militia, the list goes on and on and on, ALL split routines.

YES, there exists the idea of HST training and there are some acolytes of full body routines, but they're in a bit of a minority and you ain't gonna find too many people that do it any more than you'll find a lot of vegans in lifting. Can it be done for some? Sure. Are you a fucking moron if you say that eating meat is a waste of time? Yes.

And besides, Mentzer isn't the father of HIT. That's Arthur Jones. And Mentzer didn't do full body, or even full "HIT" until the END of his career after he'd spent the rest of it with splits and volume. Same with another supposed HIT proponent, Dorian Yates. Despite all the yapping about him doing HIT, he didn't do that until the very end after he'd already built his body on a volume-oriented split routine.

You have no idea what you're talking about, and you're name-dropping your... friend who's a personal trainer? Oh snap, watch out, dude knows a PT! Lord knows I'm not friends with about seven of those, complete with certifications and degrees in things like sports medicine or kinesiology. I also know national-level strongman competitors, a couple competing bodybuilders, and one guy who wrestles on the independent circuit. So what? Are you suggesting your lone "friend" knows more than everyone else?

I'm done with ya dude. I'll keep jawing here in the thread, but this is the last post I'm gonna waste trying to explain why you're woefully ignorant.

Re: Arthur Jones: Simply a typo error, I was thinking of Mike Mentzer when I should have typed Arthur Jones. You got me, woops.

As for the rest of what you said, lol k. I'd rather go argue with monoxide_child.


edit: For my homies who may be interested in high intensity training, here's a rundown from Drew Baye's website:

High Intensity Training is a form of progressive resistance exercise characterized by a high level of effort and relatively brief and infrequent workouts, as opposed to typical training methods involving low to moderate levels of effort and longer, more frequent workouts. Nautilus inventor Arthur Jones helped define and popularize high intensity training in the 1970’s, often summarizing the general philosophy as “…train harder, but train briefer” or “…train harder, but train less often”.

Train Harder…

The most fundamental principle of exercise is overload. To stimulate increases in muscular strength and size you must impose a demand on the muscles that is greater than they accustomed to. The harder, or more intense an exercise is, the greater the degree of overload and the more effective the exercise.

During high intensity training exercises are typically performed with all-out effort until it is impossible to perform another repetition in good form. While training to muscular failure is not necessary to stimulate increases in muscular strength and size, it ensures one has done all they can for that purpose. Some people believe regularly training to muscular failure is too stressful on the body – specifically the central nervous system – however this is not a problem as long as the volume and frequency of training are not excessive.

High intensity training methods vary with regards to the specific style, speed, and number of repetitions performed, as well as the number of exercises and frequency of workouts, but all emphasize working as hard as possible.

…But Train Briefer

There is an inverse relationship between the intensity and the volume of exercise a person can perform. The greater the effort put into a workout, the shorter the workout must be to avoid overstressing the body. High intensity training workouts typically last less than 30 minutes, and some “consolidation routines” may take fewer than 10 minutes to complete.

Almost all high intensity training methods involve only performing one, all-out work set per exercise. Although the majority of research shows no significant difference in effectiveness between single and multiple sets for improving either muscular strength or size for the majority of people, a few high intensity training methods prescribe two or three sets for some exercises.

High intensity training methods also vary in the total number of exercises or sets performed per workout, from as few as two or three to as high as twenty when neck and grip exercises are included. The appropriate volume of exercise varies significantly between individuals based on genetics, age, and lifestyle factors such as quality and amount of nutrition and rest, as well as the specific training goals. Athletes or trainees with physically demanding jobs or lifestyles must also balance their training volume against the amount of other physically demanding activities they perform to avoid overtraining.

While some trainers claim high intensity training routines are only appropriate or effective for beginners due to the low volume, and that an increase in volume is required as a trainee becomes more advanced, empirical evidence shows as trainees become more advanced and capable of training with greater intensity a reduction in training volume becomes necessary to avoid overtraining.

Train Less Often

Intense exercise places a significant amount of stress on the body. Exercising too frequently, without allowing the body adequate time between workouts to recover, will eventually lead to overtraining and a lack of progress.

The majority of people on a high intensity training program should train no more than three non-consecutive days per week. More advanced trainees working at a much higher level of intensity or older trainees and others who don’t recover as quickly may get better results training even less frequently. Most high intensity training methods involve a starting frequency of two or three workouts per week, which may be adjusted depending on the trainees’ progress.

General Guidelines for High Intensity Training

The following are general guidelines for high intensity training. Keep in mind the specific volume and frequency of training and exercise selection should be modified to suit the individual, based on level of conditioning, response to exercise, and goals.

Training Frequency: Beginners should perform no more than three workouts per week on non-consecutive days. Advanced trainees should work out less frequently, not more.
Training Volume: Perform between two and twelve exercises addressing all major muscle groups. If a higher number is performed, limit the total number of compound movements to no more than half.
Number of Sets: Perform only one set per exercise.
Number of Repetitions: A wide range of repetitions can be effective.
Progression: Increase the resistance used during an exercise by approximately 5 percent whenever you are able to complete the highest number of your repetition range in strict form.
Repetition Speed: Move slowly enough to maintain strict control over the movement and to be able to reverse direction smoothly. Avoid fast, jerky movements.
Range of Motion: Use a full range of joint movement.
Examples of workouts based on these guidelines:

Basic workout with Nautilus machines:

Leg Press or Squat machine
Calf Raise
Chest Press or Dip
Pulldown
Shoulder Press
Row
Hip/Back Extension
Trunk Curl
Basic workout with free weight and body weight exercises:

Barbell Squat
Standing Heel Raise
Bench Press or Dip
Chin Up
Standing Press
Row
Stiff-Legged Deadlift or Hip/Back Extension
Weighted Crunch
Advanced trainees working at higher levels of intensity will require a reduction in training volume and frequency, and very advanced trainees may benefit from cutting back to as few as three to five exercises as infrequently as once every 7 to 10 days.

Examples of very low volume high intensity training workouts:

Body by Science “Big Five” workout:

Chest Press
Pulldown
Shoulder Press
Row
Leg Press
Mike Mentzer’s Heavy Duty Consolidation Routine:

Workout 1

Barbell Squat
Chin Up or Pulldown
Dip
Workout 2

Deadlift
Shoulder Press
Calf Raise
Full-Body or Split Routines?

Most high intensity training methods prescribe full body routines, however a few like Mike Mentzer’s Heavy Duty use split routines, which may allow for longer local recovery for certain muscle groups.

Examples of popular high intensity training workout splits:

Basic upper body/lower body split:

Upper Body

Bench Press or Dip
Chin Up or Pulldown
Standing Press
Row
Triceps Extension
Barbell Curl
Lower Body

Barbell Squat or Leg Press
Stiff-Legged or Leg Curl
Leg Extension
Calf Raise
Trunk Curl
Basic push/pull/legs & abs split:

Push (Chest, Shoulders & Triceps)

Bench Press, Chest Press or Dip
Standing Press or Shoulder Press
Chest Fly
Lateral Raise
Triceps Extension
Pull (Back & Biceps)

Chin Up or Pulldown
Row
Dumbbell or Machine Pullover
Shrug
Barbell Curl or Bicep Curl Machine
Legs & Abs

Barbell Squat or Leg Press
Stiff-Legged or Leg Curl
Leg Extension
Calf Raise
Trunk Curl
For more high intensity training workouts see High Intensity Workouts

Machines or Free Weights?

Although high intensity training is often associated with Nautilus exercise equipment due to it’s promotion by Nautilus inventor Arthur Jones, it can be performed effectively with any type of equipment. While good equipment does make a difference it is not as important as how it is used.

Bodybuilding or Strength Training?

High intensity training is not exclusively for bodybuilding or strength training or any one aspect of fitness. High intensity training may be used for a variety of exercise goals, by properly manipulating the relevant training variables. In addition to building muscular strength and size, high intensity training is highly effective for improving cardiovascular and metabolic conditioning along with numerous other measures of health and fitness.

Note: Towards the end Baye mentions Mentzer and his version of split routines, which contrary to what twatsickle above says, I don't think are stupid. However, I do believe that for beginners in the world of lifting weights and working out that splitting up the Big 5 that I mentioned before would be a complete waste of time, particularly if you start throwing in isolation exercises from the onset. None of us are professional weight lifters and I personally believe that everyone should master the basics before splitting off and doing something dumb like 285928598295 dumbbell curls. But if you're interested in throwing barbells around utilizing momentum and joint locking and thinking you're Billy Badass please continue on with the conventional methods of working out. If you want to do more WORK and get better RESULTS, consider HIT. Carry on!

edit2: I forgot to mention that if anyone is interested in reading further then I have a copy of Drew Baye's 101 High Intensity Training Workouts and Guidelines for Performance, which is 54 pages of literature on HIT with topics ranging from specific exercises, equipment, and no equipment workouts. I've actually had this a while, and I think it cost me around $14 or some shit, but if you're interested I'll hook it up for free.

 

[Satanstoenail]

Willy waving and roid rage in the gym thread. Who would've thunk it.