How many of you guys went to school for Audio Engineering?

[006]

rant/

Why the hell would anybody need to go to school for engineering?

When you go to school for something, it's to learn what? A set way of how something is done/understood/performed/etc. Engineering is NEVER the same thing twice. How can a school teach you that? I JUST DID. Everything you need to know should be done by trial and error anyway. Otherwise you won't know SHIT about SHIT when you hit the real world trying to record people. I really want to dig up a thread and quote it right now, but I'll sum it up for now. The quote is basically from a dude that went to Full Sail and for a rediculous amount of time after graduating it, STILL isn't any closer to having a job doing engineering than he was before he went to Full Sail.

The best two ways to go about it, are A) get an internship or apprenticeship at a local studio, or B) start doing it all on your own. The first studio I worked at did contracts for foley and ADR on big feature films, commercials for television and radio and some music here and there. The money was in films, the contracts were kind of faw between, but holy crap did we get paid nicely for them. NONE OF THE PEOPLE THAT WERE THERE BEFORE I STARTED HAD DEGREES. Not even the owner. The studio is a multi-million dollar place. It's freakin nice as hell, built from the ground up with some of the best shit money can buy...and then tons of gear that is top notch. You know how the guy afforded it? Loans, playing gigs for money, and saving from working a normal job for several years. He didn't have his place until he was 40 years old. But god damn it's freakin' nice. But he had to work a normal job forever to get to that point.

The market is wayyyyy too crowded for anybody to be able to pop into an existing reputable studio and get a job...sometimes not even as an assistant. The engineers that are there now have been there for a good while and the studios like them, the only way to get in nowadays is to assassinate every engineer in the US...otherwise it ain't happening.

And finally - unlike any other job that I can think of, working in a studio requires one thing and one thing only: Experience. No degree in the world will get you hired at a studio. I can bet money on that. They will want to hear examples of your work, tenure at studios and which ones, and in some cases references of clients/producers/other engineers so they can get a feel for what kind of engineer you are.

So why go to school for it? Get started now on your own, spend money on gear instead of a pointless waste of 2-4 years of your life and get a head start on people that DO go to school for it. They aren't learning anything special...believe me. You can actually also learn MORE on your own.

/rant

FIN

~e.a

 

[KeithRT99]

i can think of a few reasons to go to a school: some people learn much better/faster in a class room environment, and networking with others who are going to be in working your field.

a reason you shouldn't go to school, from my experience: the goal of being an engineer in the music field. from my perspective (as well as many others) it's really hard to pay off student loans on that paycheck, if you can even get a paycheck. Post production/game audio is the way to go if you're going to school.

 

[stringy_]

I'm an applied/computational mathematics & computer science double major at a 4 year university. I'm just now finishing up my freshman year...

I plan on going into digital signal processing, digital audio, and music software development. Maybe I'll learn German and go work for Steinberg or Native Instruments....haha! This is a field where a formal degree is absolutely necessary. I have to eat, sleep, and breathe C++.

I personally worked with a guy up at my part time job who paid tens of thousands of dollars to go to Full Sail. Last I heard he just got fired from a car wash.

Wouldn't it be crazy if I wrote programs that maybe some day some of you guys might use?! Whoa...

 

[Jarkko Mattheiszen]

rant/

Why the hell would anybody need to go to school for engineering?

I certainly understand your point of view, but honestly, I think you're closing your eyes from some of the possibilities. My reasons to apply to such a school are as follows:

1: The students get lots of live gigs through the school. There are several event organizers who frequent the services of the school, which include groups of students dealing with FOH, live recording etc. That means work experience, which is the single thing you emphasized on.

2: Connections. The school has lots of music industry professionals around, and many of the students have managed to form good relationships with the people already known in the business through the school. At least in Finland where the business' scale is so small, having connections is really fucking important.

3: Attending a school with top notch facilities and equipment makes you familiar with working in different kinds of environments. With my income, I couldn't afford ProTools HD or a 48 channel tube console just to get familiar with them. In school, I get some of that experience I don't want to get by agreeing to a gig only to tell the client in the mid of the process that I have never used this software/hardware before in my life.

4: This is a selfish one, but going to the school gives me the possibility to use the school's studio facilities for my own projects. Ka-effin'-ching!

All in all, going to an AE school seems (to my common sense anyway) a good way to get your foot in, gather some more experience in field work and learn a thing or two during the ride.

 

[ashgallows]

eningeering schooldidn't teach me jack about really engineering per se. they more taught us how to use the gear, and the rest was pretty much up to us. everything I've learned worthwhile has been from forums and reading books on my own time.

 

[Remy_5150]

the main reason for going to school for engineering should be obvious: the degree.

Especially with home studio equipment becoming more and more capable, the decline of business in studios (and major ones like Hit Factory in New York getting shut down), and the state of the music industry make it very risky to put all your chips into becoming an audio engineer. When I graduate, not only will I have gotten a good college experience, not only will I have A LOT more knowledge of music and engineering, but I'll also have a degree. Therefore it will be alot easier to get music related jobs for web design companies or any other big media companies. And having a degree from a good school usually means you will end up getting paid more than someone who doesn't have one.

Yes, I could just get a shitty job, save up and buy gear, and learn by myself. But there is no guarantee that I will ever succeed, and why skip out on having a good time at college when I get all the benefits mentioned above? And if I DO get a good paying job after college, I can still save up for gear, learn on my own time, and maybe start my own business some day...probably faster than people who chose not to go to school.

 

[Matula]

AE school (1992 - 1995). You get a degree, but more than that, there´s tons of things you can use and learn. They have the equipment for you to practice on.

 

[Loren Littlejohn]

Of course college doesn't teach you to record. That notion is silly.

Principals of sound, how mics work, routing within a console, how devices work etc... This is what I am being tought and it's good info.

 

[LydonB]

Yeah I am at Shenandoah Conservatory right now in Virginia. I like it. We learn a lot of technical things but we are getting to do a lot of hands on things as well.

 

[Chryst Krispies]

There are a lot of jobs one can get with an Audio degree that aren't just studio/producing things. So going to school for audio doesn't necessarily mean that you wasted a whole lot of time and you will never get a decent job.

 

[Sloan]

Personally, if I was in school for engineering, I would get ahold of all the local bands that I really liked and offer them some recording for really cheap rates at the school's studios to build my "portfolio" and gain experience.

 

[006]

eningeering schooldidn't teach me jack about really engineering per se. they more taught us how to use the gear, and the rest was pretty much up to us. everything I've learned worthwhile has been from forums and reading books on my own time.

Exactly my point. I see what everyone is saying...but all I'm hearing (in general) is using the audio degree to do something other than studio work. One of you guys said "music related jobs with web comanies"...is that in a studio recording a band? Highly doubt it. As far doing the music thing, you seriously don't need any schooling. A few books on techniques, forums like this, and good old-fashioned tinkering around will teach you everything you need to know. Who cares if you don't know how to use a specific console? You should learn how to use your gear. How many times do you think you'll ever even see an SSL console in person? Let alone use it. Whats the point then? So you can say "I touched an SSL console when I was at blablabla for a class once"...... and?

I honestly do see both sides. But I can't even begin to think that anyone with aspirations to go into music (bands) as an engineer should go to school for it. Anything they teach you, you can learn somewhere else for free...or if need be, as little as a freakin' book costs you. Modern Recording Techniques is a great book that teaches you a LOT about mics, positioning, and tons of other really useful knowledge. BUT, none of that shit you read will mean anything to you unless you - DUN DUN DUN - actually USE it and get experience.

I'm not trying to piss anyone off that already has paid their money, or taken out a sick loan so they could spend it on, going to a school for this subject. I'm just stating my opinion. The fact that I've never actually talked to anybody that went to Full Sail and had a good...anything...after graduating tells me enough. It's always been stories about how they can't believe they paid for that shit, or how if they would have just interned at a local studio they'd be so much better off by the time they graduated...It's true. Perseverance in an actual studio pays off. It sucks in the meantime, but shit if thats not the coolest feeling when they say "how'd you like to get paid for this?"

There are a lot of jobs one can get with an Audio degree that aren't just studio/producing things. So going to school for audio doesn't necessarily mean that you wasted a whole lot of time and you will never get a decent job.

Agreed. For anything other than working with bands, I could definitely see the potential uses of an audio degree. For engineering...just seems like a waste of time to me.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

In a round-about way, what I'm trying to say is: I can read every book ever written about flying airplanes. Does that mean I can fly one?

~e.a

 

[KeithRT99]

Personally, if I was in school for engineering, I would get ahold of all the local bands that I really liked and offer them some recording for really cheap rates at the school's studios to build my "portfolio" and gain experience.

me and ben versluis(earlier poster) do that. although, there's not many good local bands here. Also the school won't allow us to charge for our time at school. We're alotted 12 hours private booking per student, per month.

 

[Loren Littlejohn]

me and ben versluis(earlier poster) do that. although, there's not many good local bands here. Also the school won't allow us to charge for our time at school. We're alotted 12 hours private booking per student, per month.

Ghey.

Can't you trick the band or will you get p0wnd by the school?

 

[Glenn Fricker]

I get asked this question a fair amount. Usually I'lll tell kids to stay the hell away from engineering school. Take the money you'd spend, buy some gear, and learn on your own. At least you won't have time limits or have to share it with 30 other people.

Recording schools are in the business of selling bullshit. As mentioned before, they will not get you a job when you graduate. Not recording bands, anyway.

 

[006]

Can't you trick the band or will you get p0wnd by the school?

Like tell them they have to pay with PayPal before you can make the booking.

~e.a

 

[KeithRT99]

Ghey.

Can't you trick the band or will you get p0wnd by the school?

it's a preventative measure to conflicts over payment for studio time and stuff. technically You can make money off of the final product, or receive "gifts" ie. beer and food(both things i've never recieved), but you can't charge for time.

 

[benversluis]

Ghey.

Can't you trick the band or will you get p0wnd by the school?

if the school busts you getting paid, all studio rights are revoked.

and that would suck.

 

[fatalforce]

I think that some people go to school for audio engineering to get that piece of paper aka a college degree. That proves that you've accomplished something. Thats what I'm doing it for. As far as getting proficient at working in a studio, producing or even a job, it all depends on how dedicated and serious you are.

 

[JBroll]

My math degree or someone else's CS degree will mean that I've accomplished something much different than an audio engineering degree. Mine will mean that I can solve these equations, explain these phenomena, prove these assertions, and justify these predictions - which is what a mathematician has to do. A piece of paper from Full Sail will not guarantee that its holder can make a good-sounding record. Hell, I've met a couple of Full Sail grads that can't even be guaranteed to know pressing the record button from pulling the fire alarm. That's where the comparison fails - a CS guy will know how to program, a civil engineer will know how to build a bridge, guaranteed, but that has been shown very clearly to not be the case with recording schools.

Jeff