I can't listen to modern metal productions anymore / Compression and Loudness ...
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broken81
Used by Protools
There needs to be a law on RMS and if you go past a certain point, you will be sentenced to listing to some super squished distorting mix on repeat that is just awful at like 200db while strapped in a chair for 24hrs or something. 
I know I'm an idiot for thinking this.....
I know I'm an idiot for thinking this.....
jangoux
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- May 9, 2006
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It's been a very frustating experience for me on the last few records I listened. Even tho' i liked the songs, 'something' got me sick of the music - specially modern rock stuff. It's a pointless competition and whoever started this must be tortured to death.
What bugs me more is my clients asking to my mixes be louder than some other engineers. I got to the point were i was avoiding listen to the stuff i record because of this. Now, i just get back to the last point the song does not sound disgusting and keep it there.
ahha the worst case of this i ever came was when i mixed a band that had heavy-ish rock songs AND bossa nova/jazzy/very light stuff on the same record. The Rock stuff was pounding the limiter while the lighter stuff was MUCH louder, because it didnt have much to limit. The band liked it the loud way, so I kept it like that (and never listened to the thing anymore).
What bugs me more is my clients asking to my mixes be louder than some other engineers. I got to the point were i was avoiding listen to the stuff i record because of this. Now, i just get back to the last point the song does not sound disgusting and keep it there.
ahha the worst case of this i ever came was when i mixed a band that had heavy-ish rock songs AND bossa nova/jazzy/very light stuff on the same record. The Rock stuff was pounding the limiter while the lighter stuff was MUCH louder, because it didnt have much to limit. The band liked it the loud way, so I kept it like that (and never listened to the thing anymore).
Djabthrash
Member
I'm getting very curious about the whole "loudness war recent records gimme headaches listening to it" but i don't really get it...
What is the real explanation for this ? Is it something like "some frequencies tend to give people headaches, and those frequencies are overwhelming in all those squashed records" (which i doubt), or more like "we humans can't stand listening to music with a CONSTANT (i mean unchanging... no dynamics at all) volume" ? Or something else i guess ?
Anyone ?
What is the real explanation for this ? Is it something like "some frequencies tend to give people headaches, and those frequencies are overwhelming in all those squashed records" (which i doubt), or more like "we humans can't stand listening to music with a CONSTANT (i mean unchanging... no dynamics at all) volume" ? Or something else i guess ?
Anyone ?
SickBoy
Croatian Panzer division
I wish all top producers would stick to their guns and do more "a little quiet" recordings...
I hate Primal Fear's CDs for example, they induce headache in no time...
But the thing I hate much more are the remasters of good ole "too quiet" recordings resulting with no dynamics, crackling and listener's ear fatigue. Check Queensryche's OM, Exodus' BBB or Dark Angel's DA remasters, they're hideous!
uke:
TravisW
Member
I think it's the lack of dynamics. Our ears aren't designed to endure steady-state sounds for very long. Here's a pretty good article about it: http://www.austin360.com/music/content/music/stories/xl/2006/09/28cover.html
Djabthrash
Member
Thanks for the answer. I think i've read this article before but i'm gonna give it another shot.
EDIT: This article said it all thanks.
Exocaster
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Djabthrash
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jangoux
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Maybe im wrong, but the harshness due to overcompressing and overlimiting may cause that too.
wishtheend
clip the apex
And the thread topic flys right over your head. What do you think we are talking about?
Skaldir
formerly known as Unicorn
I guess other times will come in a few years. Dynamics will be cool again. And it's in our hands, isn't it?
Btw. first it was really hard listening to Dimmu Borgir's Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia, but then I listened to it with earplugs and then it sounds pretty good at high volume
Maybe it was designed to be listened with earplugs, as most live concerts are haha
Btw. first it was really hard listening to Dimmu Borgir's Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia, but then I listened to it with earplugs and then it sounds pretty good at high volume
Maybe it was designed to be listened with earplugs, as most live concerts are haha
jangoux
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I mean that beside the lack of dynamics, the harsh high end and the exagerated clipping, both tire the ears easily. In my experience, at least.
Chryst Krispies
Vanilla Gorilla
I guess other times will come in a few years. Dynamics will be cool again. And it's in our hands, isn't it?
Btw. first it was really hard listening to Dimmu Borgir's Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia, but then I listened to it with earplugs and then it sounds pretty good at high volume
Maybe it was designed to be listened with earplugs, as most live concerts are haha
Hhahahah , That reminds me of a time where me and some cronies were going to a show and we blasted Vital Remains on the way there and we all wore earplugs in the car haha. For that quintessential "LIVE" sound hahah...
Then we would chuck pizza boxes out the sunroof.
Good Times.
1st of all, not really...the aforementioned RATM sound just fine through radio broadcasts
2nd, nobody plays metal on the radio, so that's really a moot point
as for the cause of the whole "loudness wars" thing, i would venture to say that mp3's and just computer audio in general kicked it into high gear...the difference in volume between albums was much less noticeable when you physically skipped from album to album, but the birth of mp3 playlists made it blatantly obvious when one track was way louder than another
shit, i remember downloading some albums by the song back in the day, some of which came off of re-mastered versions...there's nothing weirder than listening to a CD in your car, and one song is 5db louder than all of the rest
Yes, absolutely. I cringe at the high-end on most records. Maybe my ears are simply too intact, but a lot of the times the cymbals are downright piercing to me. My car stereo treble is usually set to -1 or -2 ...
Joematthews
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- Dec 15, 2007
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I think a lot of the time loudness is overdone and makes the CD hard to listen to, ie Resurrection, but sometimes ott mastering helps, ie All Shall Perish- Price of Existance, which was never really meant to be easy to listen to. I like the way that album sounds because its ridiculously over the top and the drums are sooooo sharp.
I think people talking about the high end have a very good point, and a punishing high end is much worse than ott limiting IMO. An example of this would be In Flames- Come Clarity (ewwwww)
However, I would never really not listen to a CD because its too loud or has a dodgy high end, so to a consumer I would guess it barely matters. I might survey my friends though and see whether they notice the difference between something that has been smashed to hell and something that hasn't. I bet they can't and would listen to it regardless. We shall see though.
Joe
I think people talking about the high end have a very good point, and a punishing high end is much worse than ott limiting IMO. An example of this would be In Flames- Come Clarity (ewwwww)
However, I would never really not listen to a CD because its too loud or has a dodgy high end, so to a consumer I would guess it barely matters. I might survey my friends though and see whether they notice the difference between something that has been smashed to hell and something that hasn't. I bet they can't and would listen to it regardless. We shall see though.
Joe
it's easy to say that you wouldn't listen to something just because it's been smashed pancake-flat...but when your ears are bleeding by the 3rd song, i guarantee you'll be turning it off
On the mastering limiter/compressor...I usually don't like going over -10 rms ..... i usually try to hit between -10 to -11. Anything over that starts to get too nasty for me.
